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Are You Thinking About Cashing in on an EV

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What I don't understand is why it has to be all or nothing with EV's. Why not continue to develop more efficient hybrids?
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ShadowsPapa

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Okay whatever ya think bub ..you do know each one of those wind turbines takes many gallins of oil!!!??? And you did know they kill birds , do you think that applies to every state?? Scheduled??? Get real dude ! That is just Ludacris. I tell ya what you believe it your way and I will believe it my way . Have a great time with that hope it works out for ya 🙄
Wow, the hate but nothing to back it.
Scheduled means you plug it in and it charges during off-peak times. You can charge one of these in 2.5-3 hours. You plug it in and within the vehicle itself, you program the charging times - say, 1am start charging. That means when it's cooler and there's less demand from lights, AC and businesses you charge your vehicle.

https://www.usatoday.com/story/news...-electric-car-charging-efficiency/6441054001/

You obviously believe those Q sites, or "IHATEEVS.COM" sites, or believe fakebook posts and messages making the rounds.

In Iowa, the electricity costs for a "typical driver" of an EV would be $55
Can you drive a month on $55 worth of gas?

I do math and science and research facts.
BUB LOL, so funny! What a hoot.
 

ShadowsPapa

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What I don't understand is why it has to be all or nothing with EV's. Why not continue to develop more efficient hybrids?
????
All or nothing what?
Do some research - they ARE continuing, even looking into hydrogen, and in some countries they run on LP.
Go visit Korea and see how far advanced they are, or check into German technology.
 

pepeborja

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Bwahahaha what a load of Rubish !!! Not a tree hugger huh okay maybe your just in a place where you can charge one . Try living away from a big city or going overlanding, or Baja trekking .. Give me a break bub. Listen if you think 21 miles on full electric is good and going from a 3.6lt. To a 2.4lt. After the electric part is depleted your sadly confused. IT takes MORE burning of fossil fuels to produce the electric that charges the outrageously priced batteries. Than it does to just use the fossil fuel in the vehicle to begin with . It has literally crash California's electric grid. They are now asking people NOT to charge their electric vehicles..lol what a waste of money. I just read a story about some parents who bought their daughter a used electric car. Paid 11,000 for it had it for less than 6 months the battery went bad went to dealer theu said yep it is a bad battery . Total cost to replace 14,000 dollars. They can take those electric vehicles and shove em where the sun dont shine. PERIOD !!
That's why we own different cars: A Jeep TJ, a BMW i3, and an Acura MDX, each one serving a different purpose, just like airlines have different airplanes to serve different missions such as using a B747 to fly from JFK to London or a CRJ900 to fly from Austin to DFW. There is simply no single multi-purpose vehicle and thus the need for multiple cars in the garage: The TJ is for trails/summer fun, the BMW is for city DD missions, and the Acura is for long trips and cargo space.

I too was an "EVphobe" and disliked the notion of owning a "street legal battery Golf cart" until I came across some Youtube videos on EVs and became educated to the point I decided to experience it directly. That's when I bought a used BMW i3 2 years ago figuring that pass or fail, buying used was a safe bet and the car is now worth more than when we bought it.

The EV ownership experience has been a hit for me and the "war dept" and it has totally changed my mind about the technology and its utility to serve DD city driving missions. At this point I am 100% comfortable merging the Acura and i3 into a Model Y as there is no need for us to own two mission specific vehicles when there is one that can do both. The concerns over batteries and electric motors do not worry me much as they are very advanced and have excellent OEM and extended warranties.

I did look at the 4xe initially to replace the BMW i3 and after much research passed on it because I did not find value in the platforms' proposition. That is my specific case for my specific missions and is not everyone's.

We are not getting another EV because I ride with Greta T or because it is good for the planet... that has been more or less debunked to a certain extent, although I think it is still beneficial especially when compared to poorly maintained ICE cars. I like EVs because they are fun, fast, full of cool technology, are very capable, have little scheduled maintenance, have no cats to be stolen, and charging them at home means no more trips to Wawa for gas other than get some Hoagies.

We just need to become a bit more tolerant of other people's POVs. We are here to learn about automotive likes and dislikes and share experiences on a specific brand, not to pummel or berate folks because we do not agree with their views. I do have my eyes set on a gently used Firecracker Red Ruby Gladiator sometime mid-year and hope to post a picture of the Model Y next to the Glad and the TJ some day, Lord be Willing.

Cheers.
 

Stan H

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No hate here but for things that commonsense will tell you are a farce it amazes me people cant see it I work in hydrocarbons and I know how much those things need to charge. And windmills aren't everywhere. It is not a viable option period. As I said before go for a long trip see how much charging you do. The trillions that WE all would have to pay to have a grid in place that would support such a venture is no feasible. To think that electricity makes itself with enormous amounts of fossil fuel is again ridiculous and lacks commonplace thinking.
 

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Stan H

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Math and Science the 2 words every time they want to try and force people into something those pop out . No thanks . He'll to the No on EV's
 

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No hate here but for things that commonsense will tell you are a farce it amazes me people cant see it I work in hydrocarbons and I know how much those things need to charge. And windmills aren't everywhere. It is not a viable option period. As I said before go for a long trip see how much charging you do. The trillions that WE all would have to pay to have a grid in place that would support such a venture is no feasible. To think that electricity makes itself with enormous amounts of fossil fuel is again ridiculous and lacks commonplace thinking.
I take it you've never heard of energy diversification? There's a lot of new and exciting things being developed for power grids, both in terms of energy generation and energy storage. There is no one solution, it's going to be a combination of a variety of technologies. Using a narrow snapshot in time of an emerging technology to claim it's total overall viability is just not how the real world works.

Like everything else, support networks for EVs will need to grow and develop over time. Guess which part of that cycle we're in now? Even when gas engines were introduced, there wasn't the support network we have today. It grew over time. No need to be a science denier or stand in the way of potential progress just because "muh hydrocarbons" and a perpetual fear of change.

EVs today still have a long way to go. I would not get an EV for long-haul trips or towing today. But you must start somewhere, and we've got a good starting point to continue with new innovations to improve. That also doesn't mean there isn't a good use case for them today, or that they won't improve in time to a point where I would get one. Just because I don't want one today does not mean I'll never want one. No point in being that close-minded.
 

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"Cashing in" isn't what happens. You pay twice as much money for a car that can't be used when it is cold, causes you to spend 1.5 more times getting somewhere, and has no long term track record.
I just paid $50k for my gladiator, my wifes model 3 can be bought for $45k. The range drops from 330 miles to 297 miles when its freezing outside. It practically drives itself at 80mph to the beach and does 0-60 in under 4 seconds. it has an 8 year 120k mile warranty.

Everything you said sounds like crotchety scared hermit talk.
 

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Safe to say there are ICE purists and EV purists, both with arguments pro and con over their views.

I think it is OK to be both (as I am) but one has to be willing to try it by removing all prejudices (as I did).

We really can't change people's opinions by expressing hostile views but what we can do is encourage people to "learn and be curious" about the things they do not see favorably in order to get them to experience them and develop a more informed and complete opinion to shape their views based on experience.

I hope Jeep takes a page from Reanult and revives the old school Jeep TJ as an IFS/IRS full EV Jeep with 100+ mile range for mall crawling and mild trails. My first car was a Renault 5 back in the 70s and the EV version of the R5 looks killer. I'd say a TJ-EV it would be a hit with both Jeep and non Jeep people.

R5.JPG
 
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What I don't understand is why it has to be all or nothing with EV's. Why not continue to develop more efficient hybrids?
You make an interesting point. A lot of places don't have the infrastructure for EVs, so more hybrid options could be a potential solution.
 

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I wish the credit applied to a Moke…I would love a vehicle I could drive around locally, park anywhere, not care that it had 2” of sand in the seats. Let any of my family borrow it and it’s so ugly I wouldn’t be able to tell if it got hit while parked at the cove.
LOL.... that bad looking huh?
 

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I take it you've never heard of energy diversification? There's a lot of new and exciting things being developed for power grids, both in terms of energy generation and energy storage. There is no one solution, it's going to be a combination of a variety of technologies. Using a narrow snapshot in time of an emerging technology to claim it's total overall viability is just not how the real world works.

Like everything else, support networks for EVs will need to grow and develop over time. Guess which part of that cycle we're in now? Even when gas engines were introduced, there wasn't the support network we have today. It grew over time. No need to be a science denier or stand in the way of potential progress just because "muh hydrocarbons" and a perpetual fear of change.

EVs today still have a long way to go. I would not get an EV for long-haul trips or towing today. But you must start somewhere, and we've got a good starting point to continue with new innovations to improve. That also doesn't mean there isn't a good use case for them today, or that they won't improve in time to a point where I would get one. Just because I don't want one today does not mean I'll never want one. No point in being that close-minded.
Anyone with a big appetite ?
Plenty of word salad in that post about nothing except stuff that will COST TRILLIONS OF Tax payer dollars.
 

ShadowsPapa

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Wow, closed minds ignoring facts.
Trillions? And at what cost if we stick with our 100% gas vehicles getting 20 mpg and we go to war? We're closer than you might think. And we lose resources from other countries, and our oil goes to defense and gas and diesel skyrockets. It's happened before - nothing prevents us from ending up like the 1970s. Noting except diversification, that is.
At least that's taxpayer dollars going toward our protection and future. It takes money to develop that future. It will stand on its own shortly. We are investing with those dollars.

Interesting reads out there on "birds killed by wind turbines".
Not as high as people are lead to believe. In fact, buildings cause more bird deaths.

Land wind turbines were responsible for over 200,000 bird deaths while collisions from building glass are estimated to be responsible for nearly 600 million bird deaths. The U.S. Fish and Wildlife Service did not provide estimates for deaths resulting from offshore wind turbines.
Turbines kill a really small percentage compared to buildings.
The number of birds killed by fossil fuel use is far higher than those killed by turbines.

1674707897377.png


From Canada -

So what are the actual numbers concerning bird mortality?

In Canada, collisions with wind turbines don’t even rank in the top nine leading causes of bird death, according to CBC.

Here are the top causes of bird fatalities according to Environment Canada:

Domestic and feral cats: 200 million
Power lines — collisions and electrocutions: 25 million
Collision with houses or buildings: 25 million
Vehicle collisions: 14 million
Game bird hunting: 5 million
Agricultural pesticides: 2.7 million
Agricultural mowing: 2.2 million young birds, equivalent to one million adult birds
Commercial forestry: 1.4 million nests, equivalent to 900,000 adult birds
Communications towers: 220,000
How many bird deaths are caused annually by wind turbines? 16,700.

The California raptor study was grossly flawed and their math skewed - plus, poor planning in the state of CA resulted in really poor locations for the turbines. CA blew it.

So here in Iowa, we charge our vehicles cheapy using energy that is more than 50% provided by wind.
My wife is loving her PHEV. She drove it to some appointments today and was bragging about the 27 mpg she had gotten to a point today and finding that much of her driving will be almost half electric. Dang that thing is quiet and smooth and has zip!
 

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I just paid $50k for my gladiator, my wifes model 3 can be bought for $45k. The range drops from 330 miles to 297 miles when its freezing outside. It practically drives itself at 80mph to the beach and does 0-60 in under 4 seconds. it has an 8 year 120k mile warranty.

Everything you said sounds like crotchety scared hermit talk.
And a new 1/2 ton is 80K; however our Jeeps and a full size truck don't compare to a Model 3. I compared it to a car that is comparable in size and usefulness.
Electric cars are more expensive. You can easily option up a Ionique to 50K but you can get a Elentra N for 30K. So once again....20K more. Remember the title of this thread!

I'm glad you like yours, it would suck to pay 45k for something you didn't.
And you need to watch Out of Spec Reviews if you think I am making up the charging issues. You mention "freezing" but that is only 32 degrees so it isn't what I would call cold.
 

dcmdon

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I just did the math. A base Model 3 with the tax credit comes to $32k. Pretty cool.

p.s. If energy policy was being made by people who understood science and engineering rather than politics, we'd be making power with Nuclear and HydroElectric.
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