BOH new designation suggestions

[AmishMike]

What if Jeep came up with a vehicle classification system on top of their ambiguous 'Trail Difficulty Rating'.
Kind of like this (inaccurate idea)
Class A- any Jeep with 4wd
Class B- any Jeep with 4wd and off road tires
Class C- Short wheelbased Jeeps with 33" tires, long wheelbased with 35" tires
Class D- All Jeeps with 35" tires, long wheelbased with 2" lift
etc....
some of you guys with more off road experience than me could easily define the characteristics that would make the different tiers. Then they could give a minimum vehicle requirement and a much more accurate trail rating.
Some locations/events, like Bantam coming up, use a similar guide for participants.
Thoughts?

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[ACAD_Cowboy]

One of the clubs I run with breaks it down somewhat thusly:

1. Stock (YJ/TJ/XJ is baseline)
2. Light Modified: 33" tires, rear locker
3. Modified: 33"-35", twin locked, disco
4. Hardcore: 35"+, twin locked, disco, axle swaps, engine swaps

But wait... there's more!

Various runs/trails have additional qualifiers like winch, twin winch, bead locks, endocaged/exocaged, chains, swampers.

So we may see a trail listed as Stock/Winch which means nearly any jeep or jeep like thing can do the tail and winch is recommended. We may also see a trail listed as Modified/Winch*/Twin Winch which would tell us a stock rubicon should be fine, a modified XJ or TJ should be fine, a winch is required and twin winch recommended if possible. But it can also be interpreted as everyone need a winch so the man behind can help lower you down. shades of interpretation.

The bigger issue here is defining what is or isn't considered serious. I spend a lot of time running with some big and capable mammajammas who in their stock form have 17" of clearance to the axle, thumping diesel power and chassis about a slinky as a ferret. I feel like a Shetland among Percherons. What is easy for them is tricky for me, where they get nervous, I'm cold slither (you know you love that track!) so when I go out with jeeps, my perception of challenge is all wonky and it's hard for me to answer the questions of was that hard. On the flip side, I did a snow run back in January and out of nowhere the trail suddenly became one of those youtube videos you can't help but watch, the will they fall of the trail kind and boy howdy, it got tricky fast because of a rutted insloping , overall off camber snow covered rock strewn tree bound tail. Imagine you are side hilling but every so often you are shoved into the hill while sliding down... a very please don't break my top and all the glass on that side moment.

But how do I describe that trail in that moment that has any bearing on anyone else at any other time? It was a light modified trail and the only reason we needed to winch was because of snow, in summer we would have been zooming baby!

And as a final nugget to chew on, one of my big truck group go where they go in a stock LR Discovery on knobbies, before that it was a bone stock mis-matched all seasons TJR with wonky lockers. he does it all with grace, finesse and a most amazing eye for lines. No carnage, no savagery just a slow a methodical approach. So really... is it the rig or the driver or luck or the gods smiling upon you on that day? Perfectly possible to have a bad driver in an impossibly overbuilt rig still fail.

 

[AmishMike]

I agree, man or machine? I watched an 'experienced' JK with a 4" lift on 37's get high centered and beat up for hours while I followed in my stock JTR still on 33's with only some minor use of stock skid plates and LCA skids.
And at any given point things can change. I got out and walked a section to pick my lines and by time I got back to my truck, the Jeep a few ahead of me had moved a rather large rock (2' x 2') by sliding sideways into it and made a huge difference on my approach.

Sounds like your group has a sound approach on vehicle standards. You/we should use that and push for better descriptions.

p.s. I still want to try Crawl Daddy. Have heard, yup no problem just watch your lines to 'no way in that thing' from a JK lifted 6" on 37's.

 

[ACAD_Cowboy]

Now for the part where I offend everyone.

Too many people put too much weight behind useless mods as a crutch to cover bad driving.

If you start with a stock jeep or jeep like vehicle and go right to deep gears, mucho macho power, huge tires and enough bash bars you have no incentive to learn to drive and do or be better. It is far easier to be mediocre with deep pockets than be skillful on a budget in my experience.

Conversely, those who stick with stock or stock type equipment for as long as possible tend to use the power of upgrades far more judiciously and to much greater effect once employed.

So going from open to LSD to locked teaches you to understand your driveline and how it is doing what you want. Progressing from 30" to 33" to 35" gives you an appreciation for where on the trail you can get the most done. Lifting should really only be used to make space for the big tires to articulate because really, the real clearance number you should be worrying about is from the axle to the ground.

What are you really getting with 6" of lift and 37's other than a crap-tacualr ride, broken parts and a rig you always have to "work on"? I've heard that tons and 42's are the new 33's... from the guy at the 4wd shop who does all my mods...

I'd rather see us all making incremental changes that help us learn and grow versus rolling on corporate welfare brodozers, if you dig. The magazines said I need all this, the forum said I need all this, the dude at the shop said I need all this plus all of that and the wonks on the trail said all I need is a YJ with a coon tail on the whip antenna.

::Big Deep Breath::

Okay so as I was saying, quantifying and qualifying trails is both objective and subjective with the special sauce being yourself, your skills and your willingness for failure and breakage. To know the trail you must know yourself I guess.

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