Maximus Gladius

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FCA CANADA CASE# 83054194

You read the title correctly, AMSOIL does state in all their American advertisements that their oil will not void warranty and they even sell it up here in Canada and provide the same paper work and claims but I’ll be the first to tell openly, the use of their data sheet “specification compliant” oil for your 8 speed 850RE transmission or any other ZF transmission WILL have your warranty tossed out because the ZF manufacturer does not approve of AMSOIL.

AMSOIL states on their data sheet “use AMSOIL if the below specifications are required” and then lists a multitude of specification code numbers, specifically for the ZF auto transmissions Chrysler/MOPARChrysler MOPAR* 68157995AA (Mopar ZF 8 & 9 Speed ATF), SP-IV, 68218925AB.

Here’s my story, my 2021 Gladiator transmission imploded at 32,814k kms, end of December 2021. I’ve been without my truck since then but still making its payments.

Back in the fall of 2021 I took a trip to BC with the wife. The transmission started to whine during the trip at about 20k kms. I didn’t know at the time it was coming from there but later on when the transmission imploded, the whine stopped. Most likely the screen was plugged, starving the pump. When we got home, I took an oil sample from the transmission and took it to the lab for analysis. Lab ALERTED to glycol contamination from the factory, copper and iron metal numbers were at extreme levels and stated that I needed to change the oil and filter. I did, but not before talking with my service manager who instructed me to “drive it into the ground, I have a good warranty OR we can do 2 pan drops at $3400 to get the glycol out.” He said Chrysler would not pay for this as they wouldn’t see this transmission as “broken”. He also did not have me bring the truck in through service to have FCA make that decision. I should have insisted, I trusted him. (First mistake)

The owners manual states to change oil and filter in the transmission if it becomes contaminated with water ECT and also states in the lube section in the manual to “use only Mopar 8/9 Speed ATF, or equivalent”. I’ve used AMSOIL for many years and decided to have the transmission flushed and oil upgraded to AMSOIL FUEL-EFFICIENT ATF if it complied with the specifications for this transmission. AMSOIL said it did and showed me their data sheet that contained the codes. So I went ahead and had the flush done and AMSOIL put in. (Second mistake)

The transmission ran wonderfully for the next 8k kms except for the whine. The transmission ran cooler, shifted smoother and any shudderings I had, went away. At 32k, transmission wouldn’t come out of park and blew some codes. I had it towed to the dealership and was called by the service assistant manager at that time that they suggested I have them do 2 pan drops at $3400 to get the AMSOIL out before they inform Chrysler that I had AMSOIL in there. I said NO, tell them, the oil meets the codes. I also had a second oil sample analysis done. Glycol was gone but copper and iron metal counts was extreme.

Chrysler was informed and my warranty was axed and complaint was filed with FCA Canada January 3rd, 2022. The service manager quit his job and moved on. 6 months of many emails, phone calls to FCA and AMSOIL dug up a lot of drama and at the end of it all I had to write the president/CEO of Stalantis and his executives asking for help.

An investigation was done by FCA Canada and after 3 weeks, they called to say ZF does not approve of AMSOIL and warranty was denied. They dismissed lab results saying I decided to self diagnose. AMSOIL said their oil did not damage the transmission and would not allow a claim to replace transmission. I told them if they would have provided a warning on their data sheet that ZF will void my warranty for using their oil, I would not have used AMSOIL. Their data sheet is deceptive and not accurate and information in it can not be taken as safe to use. AMSOIL further suggested that once the transmission gets replaced, to not use their oil until the warranty expires.

I made mistakes his time from many years of looking after my vehicles. At the end of the day, I should have insisted FCA engineers look at the transmission and I should have let it die but I didn’t know if this would have done so after warranty. I expressed serious concern to my dealership and they did not handle it right.

I spoke with another service manager in town that questioned how glycol could have gotten in the transmission and he had me tow the truck to him so he could check out the coolers. They were both fine after pressure and heat tests were done. He said antifreeze was deliberately put in there at the factory, there’s no other explanation. I’ll be getting out of this truck once I get this fixed. (There’s still my issue with the engine consuming coolant at 10-12ounces every oil change duration) FCA doesn’t have a problem with this either.

We live, we learn, we make better choices.

 
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CrazyCooter

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So everyone just points the finger at everyone else? Who can be held accountable here?

We know the trans probably failed because of the fluid contamination that you have documentation of.

Amsoil says warranty safe........ZF says no Amsoil or void warranty.

Chrysler just says pound sand......

This whole thing is BS!
 

FLGladiator

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The days of automakers caring about reputation is far gone. Having owned many Porsche 911 cars, I remember having a 993 convertible top develop a small tear 10k out of warranty and a rep came and oked the replacement. They were known to go above and beyond to keep customers happy. Today you need have a good counter intel game to make sure your covered.
 

DailyMoparGuy

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That’s just ridiculous. Sorry you gotta deal with this OP. You would think at least one of the parties would step up (preferably FCA/Stellantis).

I hope this thread stays up for awhile because there’s definitely other forum members using AMSOIL
 


vegajf

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It sounds like your radiator was leaking coolant into the transmission fluid. I had a honda ridgeline and it's somewhat common up north on models 10 plus years old for the bottom of the radiator to corrode and mix with the tranny fluid, that's where the coolant is going and why glycol was in the tranny fluid, sounds like a bad radiator, probably only a tiny leak when hot.

The honda guys call it SMOD (strawberry milkshake of death)
 
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FLGladiator

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That’s just ridiculous. Sorry you gotta deal with this OP. You would think at least one of the parties would step up (preferably FCA/Stellantis).

I hope this thread stays up for awhile because there’s definitely other forum members using AMSOIL
Was thinking how many threads I heard them using AMsoil for oil changes. Looks like im sticking with Mopar oil until warranty over.
 

CrazyCooter

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It sounds like your radiator was leaking coolant into the transmission fluid. I had a honda ridgeline and it's somewhat common up north on models 10 plus years old for the bottom of the radiator to corrode and mix with the tranny fluid, that's where the coolant is going and why glycol was in the tranny fluid, sounds like a bad radiator, probably only a tiny leak when hot.

The honda guys call it SMOD (strawberry milkshake of death)
Trans fluid does not pass through the coolant on the JL/JT platform. Had to be in the fluid or on the parts prior to assembly.
 

CrazyCooter

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That’s just ridiculous. Sorry you gotta deal with this OP. You would think at least one of the parties would step up (preferably FCA/Stellantis).

I hope this thread stays up for awhile because there’s definitely other forum members using AMSOIL
I am an Amsoil dealer and use all of thier products....... No way I'd put it in the trans at this point! MM act says the manufacturer has to supply the parts if they specify what must be used, but that doesn't help a guy in a case like this one.
 

NachoRuby

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I am an Amsoil dealer and use all of thier products....... No way I'd put it in the trans at this point! MM act says the manufacturer has to supply the parts if they specify what must be used, but that doesn't help a guy in a case like this one.
Op is in Canada, so no MM act.
 


vegajf

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Trans fluid does not pass through the coolant on the JL/JT platform. Had to be in the fluid or on the parts prior to assembly.
Aww.... I didn't know that. Very interesting. Thanks for the correction
 

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It sounds like your radiator was leaking coolant into the transmission fluid. I had a honda ridgeline and it's somewhat common up north on models 10 plus years old for the bottom of the radiator to corrode and mix with the tranny fluid, that's where the coolant is going and why glycol was in the tranny fluid, sounds like a bad radiator, probably only a tiny leak when hot.
Trans fluid does not pass through the coolant on the JL/JT platform. Had to be in the fluid or on the parts prior to assembly.
Yeah, there's a large cooler low and ahead of the radiator.

In any case, the cooler was pressure tested, no leaks.

You can look up "jeep gladiator transmission cooler" on google and see pictures, or go look through the grill and down...........

Horizontal flow radiators don't lend themselves to having transmission cooler tubes in the bottom tank because there is no bottom tank.
 
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Maximus Gladius

Maximus Gladius

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The service manager that actually wondered how glycol got in the transmission in the first place took 2 minutes to get up off his chair and go print off the schematics of the coolers and hoses and located the one where coolant and oil bypass each other. #10 in the diagram is the cooler.

Also, back in March, I provided all my evidence and owners manual to my lawyer. He drafted and sent a legal demand letter to FCA and dealership to fix the transmission, engine coolant consumption and the failed electrical system the dealership left my truck in when they told me to tow my truck home back in January. He also told me if I choose to take them to court, it would be 2 years before I would see a court room due to Covid backlog. Magnuson Moss Act does not apply in Canada and to also rub more salt into this, anyone in Canada that holds a Chrysler warranty HAS NO FEDERAL ARBITRATION since FIAT bought Chrysler in 2021 which switched the US brand to a Netherlands company. Chrysler is not American though it has the appearance of such. This would prove too big a fight for me and I’m not able to go down that road.

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Mr._Bill

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I've read in other threads that Glycol is used during production of the transmission housing. If it is not fully rinsed, it will appear if a lab test is done on the fluid. How much it takes to damage a transmission after assembly is not clear. I bet a lot of these would show some Glycol in the fluid if tested. ZF probably accounts for that during production.

The transmission was whining, so it needed to be checked. Other threads have reported transmission issues that resulted in a valve assembly needing replaced. The first Service Advisor said to drive it until it breaks and have it repaired under warranty. Not the best advice, but a valid option.

The big mistake was putting AMSOIL in the transmission instead of Mopar fluid. He took AMSOIL printed literature at face value and relied upon their claim that it was an acceptable replacement fluid. FCA defers to ZF on technical issues, since they designed and built the transmission. ZF says AMSOIL is not an acceptable fluid. Since AMSOIL was used, instead of Mopar fluid, they denied warranty coverage for the transmission repair.

The owner is screwed by a decision over which fluid to use. The dealer did offer to do a fluid swap, before making the warranty claim, which I would not have expected.
 
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Maximus Gladius

Maximus Gladius

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I've read in other threads that Glycol is used during production of the transmission housing. If it is not fully rinsed, it will appear if a lab test is done on the fluid. How much it takes to damage a transmission after assembly is not clear. I bet a lot of these would show some Glycol in the fluid if tested. ZF probably accounts for that during production.

The transmission was whining, so it needed to be checked. Other threads have reported transmission issues that resulted in a valve assembly needing replaced. The first Service Advisor said to drive it until it breaks and have it repaired under warranty. Not the best advice, but a valid option.

The big mistake was putting AMSOIL in the transmission instead of Mopar fluid. He took AMSOIL printed literature at face value and relied upon their claim that it was an acceptable replacement fluid. FCA defers to ZF on technical issues, since they designed and built the transmission. ZF says AMSOIL is not an acceptable fluid. Since AMSOIL was used, instead of Mopar fluid, they denied warranty coverage for the transmission repair.

The owner is screwed by a decision over which fluid to use. The dealer did offer to do a fluid swap, before making the warranty claim, which I would not have expected.
The dealership didnt offer to do the oil swap, they were charging $3400 to me to do that. It was an option out of reach for me and was told Chrysler would not pay for this. Yes, glycol is used in the tooling wash system the assembly plant utilizes. I think the final wash to clear the glycol was missed, maybe disgruntled employee added more than they should have or the end of day buzzer went off and didn’t get done or the coffee buzzer went off at that time …I don’t know but the new service manager said, (where my truck sits) the glycol was deliberately put in there. It doesn’t take much glycol to destroy a transmission, a teaspoon I’m told.

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