New bumper/winch

[wchevron]

Thinking of replacing my plastic bumper with a knock-off factory steel bumper. On the fence about a winch. If I install the new steel bumper with a winch plate, do I need to remove the bumper if I decide to add a winch later. Would lean towards the Harbor Freight Badland 12,000. If bumper would need to come off again might just bite the bullet and do bumper/winch at the same time rather than the bumper twice.

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[ShadowsPapa]

Thinking of replacing my plastic bumper with a knock-off factory steel bumper. On the fence about a winch. If I install the new steel bumper with a winch plate, do I need to remove the bumper if I decide to add a winch later. Would lean towards the Harbor Freight Badland 12,000. If bumper would need to come off again might just bite the bullet and do bumper/winch at the same time rather than the bumper twice.

Do it all at the same time if you can swing it. Yes, you need to pull the bumper forward to get a winch in there.
Over a year later I'm still extremely happy with the eBay bumper I put on- finish is holding up well, no rust, looks decent.

These aren't hard to do - but there's just enough inconvenience pulling the bumper loose again to get a winch in there, I'd do both at once.

 

[wchevron]

Thanks, I figured as much but thought I'd ask

 

[BAT]

I just recently went this route and can say if at all possible get all your stuff ahead of time and do everything in one shot.

 

[wchevron]

How much time should I figure to install the new bumper and winch. I'm fairly mechanical. Would probably be working alone unless I can convince my daughter to help me.

Bought the knockoff steel bumper and the Badlands Apex 12,000. Also got the 1/4" bumper spacers plates. Looks like some people end up needing longer bolts on some parts? Have most of the day Saturday to work on it.

 

[RufusMalloy]

Watching to see what happens here. This seems like an option for me.

 

[wchevron]

May try to tackle it tomorrow. Don't have it completely unwrapped yet but overall am impressed with the bumper. Appears sturdy, paint looks good. Came with a bunch of hardware but no instructions. Then they sent me some, which makes it look like there are 4-6 bolts you need to remove and re-install. But I have some brackets and 2 bags of bolts I could build a new bumper with so will see how it goes. Instructions don't mention any of that.
I do have to say, it was packaged extremely well. Whole thing bubble wrapped. Came in a sturdy cardboard box with that spray foam filling that fills up the air space around it. Surprised. Heard horror stories of others getting bumpers (from other manufactures) and no padding, boxes damaged etc.

 

[tommyp]

@ShadowsPapa or others Did you need to get rivnuts with this bumper? was watching the trail recon video where they mounted a mopar steel bumper and they needed some brackets off the steel bumper that needed rivnuts to mount. I am wondering if I should get the rivnuts and maybe the brackets? I am placing an order for the fog light harness and some other things and want to get everything at once.

Edit to add - Nevermind. The brackets and riv nuts come with the correct rubicon skid plate. #82215183AB

 

[ShadowsPapa]

@ShadowsPapa or others Did you need to get rivnuts with this bumper? was watching the trail recon video where they mounted a mopar steel bumper and they needed some brackets off the steel bumper that needed rivnuts to mount. I am wondering if I should get the rivnuts and maybe the brackets? I am placing an order for the fog light harness and some other things and want to get everything at once.

Edit to add - Nevermind. The brackets and riv nuts come with the correct rubicon skid plate. #82215183AB

The skid plate I bought (online from a dealer) came only with the skid plate. I went to another site to buy the bracket "kit" which was the bolts, rivnuts and brackets.
I didn't have to buy anything to install the bumper at all - only the bracket/bolt/nut kit for the skid plate.
I bought the kit from justforjeeps dot com

NAME	CODE	QTY	PRICE
Mopar Front Skid Plate Brackets and Hardware for 2018-2021 Wrangler JL and 2020 Gladiator JT (Shipped) Fedex Tracking Number:	FSPBH	1	50.32

 

[wchevron]

I've got a Rubicon. There is a bracket on each side of the frame. The skid plate bolted to those brackets. There were 4 center screws that screwed into the plastic of the original plastic bumper I had. Haven't re-installed yet but looks like i'll need to put some nuts/bolts where the screws went. I'm pretty sure the steel bumper has 4 holes along the bottom where the skid plate attaches.

 

[ShadowsPapa]

I've got a Rubicon. There is a bracket on each side of the frame. The skid plate bolted to those brackets. There were 4 center screws that screwed into the plastic of the original plastic bumper I had. Haven't re-installed yet but looks like i'll need to put some nuts/bolts where the screws went. I'm pretty sure the steel bumper has 4 holes along the bottom where the skid plate attaches.

If you have the plastic front bumper you may also have a plastic air dam - it's not a skid plate, those are steel.
If you DO have the plastic bumper and steel skid plate, the skid plate is different used with plastic bumpers is very different from the skid plate that is used with the steel bumper.
The skid plate used with plastic bumper uses 4 brackets to attach it.

If you put on the MOPAR steel bumper and the steel skid plate that goes to it, you use only the rear or lower skid plate brackets and the front edge bolts to the bottom of the steel bumper. There are 7 screws that attach the steel skid plate to the steel bumper.

 

[tommyp]

Thanks all I will have to pick up the skid plate kit. Looks like prices are pretty similar across the board. Just got the bumper delivered today.

 

[wchevron]

Did you go with the knockoff steel bumper? I just finished installing mine. I had to replace the bolts that attach the bumper to the frame with longer 3" bolts. Shadowspapa and I bought the same bumper but he was able to keep the 2" bolts that came with it. Mine weren't long enough for some reason.
I used the Badland Apex 12000 winch. The winch plate that came with the bumper had 2 sets of bolt holes. Installed mine in the more forward set of holes. When I went to install the bumper, it was hitting across the front of the winch. Even with the 1/4" steel plates I purchased to push the bumper out off the winch. So I moved the winch back to the rear set of holes. Then it was hitting the grille. So I took my 1/4 in plates and sandwiched them between the frame and winch plate (where they bolt to the frame). This pushed the winch forward enough to get it off the grille.
With the winch in the rear winch plate holes, the front of the bumper no longer hits the winch.
I did also move the positive power cable from the rear of the winch to the side, which others have done.
I mounted the winch on 2-1/2" washers to raise it up a bit so the clutch handle wouldn't hit. It still does. 4 washers may clear it. If I lift up on the handle a little can get it over the bumper. Like others, I'm going grind off the bottom of the lever so it doesn't hit.
I had to remove the removable end pieces (of the bumper) to be able to bolt on the plastic covers that go in the fog light area. Couldn't get my hand in the hold the nut when trying to bolt the piece in from the outside.
Took me maybe 7 hrs total to get everything done by myself. There was a lot of head scratching and trial and error. Probably knowing what I know now, I could get another one done in 3 hrs.

I looked at my skid plate again, been sitting in my back office. It's steel. Only has 2 bolt holes on each end, which bolt into the angled brackets which are bolted into my frame. Didn't attach to my plastic bumper like I originally thought, my mistake.

If you are going to go with the knockoff steel bumper I'd recommend the following.

Have a screwgun with a couple of hex shank socket adaptors. There are a lot of screws on the plastic bumper to remove to pull out the connector wiring for the fog lights. You basically have to take the whole plastic bumper apart.
Also lots of allen screw head bolts on the steel bumper. You'll need 4mm, 5mm, 6mm. so much easier unscrewing everything with the screwgun.

I'd order the 3" long M12x1.75 bolts. I got on Amazon so if you don't use you could always return.

I'd also order the 1/4" thick steel spacer plates.

 

[tommyp]

Did you go with the knockoff steel bumper? I just finished installing mine. I had to replace the bolts that attach the bumper to the frame with longer 3" bolts. Shadowspapa and I bought the same bumper but he was able to keep the 2" bolts that came with it. Mine weren't long enough for some reason.
I used the Badland Apex 12000 winch. The winch plate that came with the bumper had 2 sets of bolt holes. Installed mine in the more forward set of holes. When I went to install the bumper, it was hitting across the front of the winch. Even with the 1/4" steel plates I purchased to push the bumper out off the winch. So I moved the winch back to the rear set of holes. Then it was hitting the grille. So I took my 1/4 in plates and sandwiched them between the frame and winch plate (where they bolt to the frame). This pushed the winch forward enough to get it off the grille.
With the winch in the rear winch plate holes, the front of the bumper no longer hits the winch.
I did also move the positive power cable from the rear of the winch to the side, which others have done.
I mounted the winch on 2-1/2" washers to raise it up a bit so the clutch handle wouldn't hit. It still does. 4 washers may clear it. If I lift up on the handle a little can get it over the bumper. Like others, I'm going grind off the bottom of the lever so it doesn't hit.
I had to remove the removable end pieces (of the bumper) to be able to bolt on the plastic covers that go in the fog light area. Couldn't get my hand in the hold the nut when trying to bolt the piece in from the outside.
Took me maybe 7 hrs total to get everything done by myself. There was a lot of head scratching and trial and error. Probably knowing what I know now, I could get another one done in 3 hrs.

I looked at my skid plate again, been sitting in my back office. It's steel. Only has 2 bolt holes on each end, which bolt into the angled brackets which are bolted into my frame. Didn't attach to my plastic bumper like I originally thought, my mistake.

If you are going to go with the knockoff steel bumper I'd recommend the following.

Have a screwgun with a couple of hex shank socket adaptors. There are a lot of screws on the plastic bumper to remove to pull out the connector wiring for the fog lights. You basically have to take the whole plastic bumper apart.
Also lots of allen screw head bolts on the steel bumper. You'll need 4mm, 5mm, 6mm. so much easier unscrewing everything with the screwgun.

I'd order the 3" long M12x1.75 bolts. I got on Amazon so if you don't use you could always return.

I'd also order the 1/4" thick steel spacer plates.

Yes I got the amazon karfu or whatever knock off. I should have picked up the 10th anniversary because it doesn't have the PDC holes in the wing. Didn't realize that till I read it after I bought this one. Not a huge deal and I could always weld the holes closed and paint if it bothers me too much.

I am going to toss the winch plate that came with the bumper. Looking at the Barnes at $230 or may go to the warn. I just don't trust the thickness of the stock plate.

Still deciding on the winch but probably will go with the apex. But I am going to mount the bumper now and then take it off and put the winch and winch plate on when I buy them. I didn't realize I was going to be into the bumper for another $300 for the skid plate and other stuff. $500 is turning into $1600 real quick. Not a huge deal but I try to limit my jeep spending right now as I am working on a couple other project vehicles.

I ordered a new fog light harness from allmopar parts. So I am not going to take apart the plastic bumper. It was only $22. I am just going to take the plastic bumper off and store it like everything else I have pulled off this thing. So if I trade it or sell it I can just revert everything and swap my add-ons over to the newer Glad.

I also got the steel skid plate kit and a hole less fog light cover or whatever its called. I picked up one side off amazon for $13 the side from all mopar was like $15.

I should be able to get the 3" m12 bolts local if it is an issue.

Thanks for the all the info!

 

[ShadowsPapa]

I used the stock factory original Jeep hooks and bolts. The bolts are very long and in fact could be shorter. I don't know why they aren't working out for others.

Seriously, look how long these are - original hooks, original bolts and nuts and the threads stick through so much I could have used spacers and still been more than ok..

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