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Retaining tow rating with lift and tires

TheSolarWizard

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Can it be done?

specifically this pertains to the diesel NOT the 3.6 gas

I’m looking an off road travel trailer that’s 4600 dry but including the weight of all the solar and batteries. It’s got 100 gallon fresh and 26 gallon grey. Toilet is composting so no black tank. Electric brakes And weight distribution hitch.


expedition overland had good luck with airbags and they’re on 37s
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whiteglad

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That is 800 pounds of water! If the trailer is boxy in shape, it will be buffeted by winds strongly. You don't want the tail to wag the dog. I'd suggest less trailer and not making mods that could hurt the tow rating. You also may get into the mountains and really tax that 3.6 to pull it.
 

eaglerugby04

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Probably would be fine, but close to the limit, but the biggest issue would be we don't know what the disel's tow numbers will be. Its possible the Disel will have lower tow numbers than the gas Rubicon and Max Tow configs.
 
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6.4 Hemi swap, 8-speed trans upgrade (for Hemi swap), and 4.88’s, and you’ll be alright. ;)
 

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PyrPatriot

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I had a couple threads on the topic. You cannot retain the tow rating with the lift and tires. Lift means changing the rear springs and thus losing tongue weight ability. Larger tires means more mass to rotate and thus more stress on the engine/transmission - and the cooling system responsible for the tow rating is already pushed to its limits.

Now, take that with a grain of salt because the tow rating is based on certain harsh conditions. Links to threads inbound

https://www.jeepgladiatorforum.com/...-than-sticker-outside-of-the-mountains.28052/

https://www.jeepgladiatorforum.com/forum/threads/performance-cost-benefit-to-accessorizing.24139/

https://www.jeepgladiatorforum.com/...ze-gear-ratio-affect-on-payload-towing.24058/
 
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TheSolarWizard

TheSolarWizard

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6.4 Hemi swap, 8-speed trans upgrade (for Hemi swap), and 4.88’s, and you’ll be alright. ;)
I have cash for one ton axles potentially and for whatever suspension but not also a V8. This only works if the diesel sport version gets a similar GRoss combined rating of a rubicon V6 auto (getting at this by knowing the diesel weights 400 lbs more in the JL and that’s what a rubicon weighs more than a sport in the JT) AND the shop feels like they can account for the weight of the diesel and boost my payload capacity to somewhere between the V6 maxtow of 1650 and rubicon 1200

400 ish pounds of passengers with the pug +650 trailer weight. Need to be able to carry about 300lbs of extra stuff. Spare will ride on the trailer and backseat removed so that’s around 100lbs in savings


this is all conjecture till we get the ratings for the diesel but I think if I’m accounting for the stress of bigger tires and suspension via one ton axles with bigger brakes plus adding strength to the frame like the Mojave’s, this could be just inside of the numbers so I’m covered legally


i don’t many doubts about the drivetrain being able to move that much weight and even with the reduced cooling And aerodynamics surely the same diesel and trans that’s rated to tow 12000 lbs in a similar weight ram can pull 40% less in the gladiator with a corrected final drive ratio


am i way off here?
 

whiteglad

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The whole premise of the Gladiator is to fill a niche, being like a quarter or three-eights ton truck in effect, with a relatively small (about 220 cubic inches) engine. The diesel will improve the engine area, but at a cost in weight that is significant for the Gladiator platform. If I planned on towing 5000 lb plus, especially with a big boxy trailer having a lot of wind resistance, I would go to a Ram and accept its different compromises, such as size and off-road ability. Bigger axles won't address all the issues. Differential strength and brakes are two points, but you can do only so much with the frame, wheelbase, width of the Gladiator. It would be sort of like trying to make something with a hacksaw and a file instead of a lathe and end mill.

If you are really interested in towing a fairly heavy trailer with a diesel Gladiator, lets wait and see what FCA thinks--what tow rating to they give that setup. Maybe the Gladiator will prove more capable than I anticipate. I tend to be conservative. My Cummins=powered Ram is rated to tow 17,000 pounds and I don't tow over half that amount with it. It does the job easily, comfortably, and safely.
 
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TheSolarWizard

TheSolarWizard

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Those are valid points but any other truck limits where both the trailer can go and I can go when unhooked and exploring


this guy seems to be doing ok and it looks like he’s got 35s or 37s on his rubicon

 

whiteglad

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That is a very interesting trailer. I have taken my 21' Airstream hunting, but not on rough trails. If I were in the market for a new off-road trailer, I would be very interested in Black Series and would probably get whatever length/weight the Gladiator would tow easily. Have you compared the HQ12 to the HQ15?
 

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TheSolarWizard

TheSolarWizard

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That is a very interesting trailer. I have taken my 21' Airstream hunting, but not on rough trails. If I were in the market for a new off-road trailer, I would be very interested in Black Series and would probably get whatever length/weight the Gladiator would tow easily. Have you compared the HQ12 to the HQ15?
i have ive seen both in person the 12 is a pop up
I want a fixed roof for strength because I’m adding to the solar system and I’ll have the capacity to run 4 seasons

there’s other brands in Australia that have similarities but these are solidly built and well insulated and they certainly appear to be capable. Taking this into Moab showed me all I need to see there
 

Teleblues

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The whole premise of the Gladiator is to fill a niche, being like a quarter or three-eights ton truck in effect, with a relatively small (about 220 cubic inches) engine. The diesel will improve the engine area, but at a cost in weight that is significant for the Gladiator platform. If I planned on towing 5000 lb plus, especially with a big boxy trailer having a lot of wind resistance, I would go to a Ram and accept its different compromises, such as size and off-road ability. Bigger axles won't address all the issues. Differential strength and brakes are two points, but you can do only so much with the frame, wheelbase, width of the Gladiator. It would be sort of like trying to make something with a hacksaw and a file instead of a lathe and end mill.

If you are really interested in towing a fairly heavy trailer with a diesel Gladiator, lets wait and see what FCA thinks--what tow rating to they give that setup. Maybe the Gladiator will prove more capable than I anticipate. I tend to be conservative. My Cummins=powered Ram is rated to tow 17,000 pounds and I don't tow over half that amount with it. It does the job easily, comfortably, and safely.
Mopar has already stated the diesel will definitely tow less than a 3.6 gasser. the extra weight more than offsets the diesels Power.
 
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TheSolarWizard

TheSolarWizard

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Mopar has already stated the diesel will definitely tow less than a 3.6 gasser. the extra weight more than offsets the diesels Power.
It’s not the weight at all. It’s the cooling capability of the grill opening.
Weight of the motor and EPA garbage will affect payload though
 

MadManMoheenid

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I keep hearing its a cooling problem preventing the diesel Gladiator from having higher tow ratings but I am surprised the engineers cant come up with a solution to redirect airflow from under or over the motor. Why not have a big hood scoop or scoops under the front somehow. We need someone smart like Gale Banks to sort this out..
 
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I keep hearing its a cooling problem preventing the diesel Gladiator from having higher tow ratings but I am surprised the engineers cant come up with a solution to redirect airflow from under or over the motor. Why not have a big hood scoop or scoops under the front somehow. We need someone smart like Gale Banks to sort this out..
:CWL: :LOL::CWL::LOL::CWL::LOL: That dude is the laughing stock of the MODERN diesel community. Only old folks still buy Banks crap. His stuff is caveman tech. I'd rather get the guys at AFE to figure it out, when it comes to intake air flow.
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