Who else is happy with the Pentastar?

[ShadowsPapa]

Full size pickups have been within an inch of 79" (most being 79.9") wide for the better part of 60 years. The JT is a lot closer in width to an old Ranger/Tacoma but with extra fenders that make its paper width similar to the modern Ranger/Tacoma. It's all visual tricks that come with design.

We perceive modern trucks as longer because on average, they are. They just aren't in any significant way when you compare similar configurations to what was available in the past. It's just way more common to see 4-door pickups than in the past.



A 2500 Suburban isn't a truck, it's an SUV and they've always had different sizes than their pickup counterparts. 2500 doesn't define a comparable size, it defines the platform underneath. Also your Gladiator is only 74" wide because the fenders.

1995 - 8' box was standard, anything else was a "short box". My ford was a large truck
2011 - 6'6" is standard, an 8' bed is a "long box". My chevy dwarfed my ford and barely fit in my garage.

By the way - Jeep never called their original Cherokee, etc. a "SUV" - that was the media. Jeep called it a station wagon and to this day, the Grand Cherokee is not an SUV, it's a station wagon. Just look at my registration papers. Jeep didn't start calling everything with 4x4 capabilities and a larger cargo area an SUV - the media did - those EVIL SUVs! Headlines "SUV kills pedestrian" that sort of thing, instead of pedestrian killed in accident. The media hyped the SUV nomenclature because they are hogs, evil, gas-guzzling killers.
Anyway, look at Jeep and how they named things in the 90s - station wagons, not SUVs.
What is marketed as an SUV today is not. But it sells better if they call it that because no one is going to go out and buy a station wagon these days - gasp - that's like driving a MINI VAN!

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[Adawg1203]

JT is a damned brick building standing high in the air. Same engine in a WK2 gets 25 easily.

Absolutely agree with you.

What I mean by ‘a bit more fuel efficient’ is, give me the MPG that is on the sticker (19 combined 17 city 22 highway). Those numbers are based on the styling and dimensions of the vehicle.

 

[Kevin_D]

By the way - Jeep never called their original Cherokee, etc. a "SUV" - that was the media. Jeep called it a station wagon and to this day, the Grand Cherokee is not an SUV, it's a station wagon.

My old ‘77 Wagoneer was a MPPV: Multi-Purpose Passenger Vehicle. Said so right on the VIN tag.

Oh, and on-topic, I’m satisfied with the Pentastar. I wish it had a bit more power, like my other V-6, but that one is in the wife’s 335i…

Kevin

 

[ShadowsPapa]

My old ‘77 Wagoneer was a MPPV: Multi-Purpose Passenger Vehicle. Said so right on the VIN tag.

Oh, and on-topic, I’m satisfied with the Pentastar. I wish it had a bit more power, like my other V-6, but that one is in the wife’s 335i…

Kevin

Pentastar engine - several years worth, several iterations and even today, what's in your JT isn't 100% the same as what's in our WK2 or in a car. That's one of the cool things, too - the basics are there, the details may differ depending on purpose and destination of said 3.6

You are talking Wagoneer - a framed vehicle much larger - and based on a truck chassis.. I'm talking things like Cherokee, circa 1990.
And by the way - some of that on the tags under the hood or on the door frame - for federal regs.

I have 3 2 door hatchback cars at my place - one outside that I'm giving away later this month so the guy's son can use it as a parts car, another is in my shop being revived/restored, and the third is my 2 door hatchback CAR - and yet, check this out right below the Vehicle Emission Control Information text, left side - "light duty trucks (LDT)" ->

But these were never marketed or advertised or sold as a light truck LOL - they are a car - so the tag on the firewall or door jamb is for government purposes in many cases.
They are licensed/registered as cars, 2 door in some states, called a "3 door" in others because of the rear hatch that allows access to the passenger area. Not registered as trucks.

 

[redriderjf87]

Not even close to the size of my Chevy. It's feet shorter, and at least 6" more narrow than my Chevy and that's at the widest part of the JT.
A sheet of plywood fit between the wheel wells of my Chevy, no 2x4s needed. My LS engine could also run circles around the JT pulling a load.
The chevy could accelerate going up the big inclines on I80 with a bed loaded down with heavy car parts (transmissions, starters, engine parts) and car hauler on behind. My JT won't touch that.

Not that I dislike the JT and the 3.6 - not at all, it's just simply not even in the same league as my Silverado was.

I parked my JT next to a GMC Suburban same length (218 inches JT, 219 inches Suburban). 74 inches width JT vs 77 inches width 2500 Suburban. Anyone want to claim that a GMC 2500 Suburban is not a fullsize truck, & a big one at that? In practical terms, JT is a fullsize truck.

If we're talking length and height, there are most definitely full size trucks on the road that are smaller than the JT (if not on width, then close). By that logic I consider it full size.

 

[Knightindullarmor]

That was my thinking. I'm about 2" narrower & 2 feet longer than my boss's 06 Tahoe.

 

[LostWoods]

 

[ShadowsPapa]

My Javelin is a truck, it's 75.2" wide. But it's a mid-size truck as it's only a littler over 192" long.

 

[ThatStinging_Jeep]

It does the job but I dont even have a lift and big tires,and it already chugs 16 miles per fucken gallon......so.....Im trading it in for a Dieselel JTR,I cant wait for it too be here cause I got a lift inline for it and soon a set of beadlocks once I get the money for it :D

But yeah I'm kinda happy with it but it could be better if I regear it once I get big tires,but in that case I'd rather put the money for a new truck instead like in my case i got a super good price on my truck and that's why I'm here waiting for a new truck :D

 

[Fortus]

It was a 2010.

That's a second gen. Tacoma, which is considered the one with the "good engine". The 3rd generation Tacoma (latest) has much torque-less engine.

 

[kd1yt]

I'd be delighted if the Pentastar had additional low RPM torque, but overall, I'm very pleased with it as-is

 

[ShadowsPapa]

I'd be delighted if the Pentastar had additional low RPM torque, but overall, I'm very pleased with it as-is

Question - where would you put the added low-end torque if you could? (RPM range, that is) Just curious, no other reason.

 

[KevinC]

That's a second gen., which is considered the one with the "good engine". The 3rd (latest) generation has much torque-less engine.

What was the 1st Gen?
My experience was the 3.8L mated to the 4sp auto found in the 2007-2011 (1st. Gen?) was a terrible combo.

This same 4sp was also used in the 2003?-2006 TJ with the 4.0L and it was not without issues.

The 2012-2018 3.6L was mated to a more reliable 5sp auto (2nd Gen?)

The new 8sp is light years ahead of any auto ever offered in a Jeep. IMO

KevinC

 

[DanW]

What was the 1st Gen?
My experience was the 3.8L mated to the 4sp auto found in the 2007-2011 (1st. Gen?) was a terrible combo.

This same 4sp was also used in the 2003?-2006 TJ with the 4.0L and it was not without issues.

The 2012-2018 3.6L was mated to a more reliable 5sp auto (2nd Gen?)

The new 8sp is light years ahead of any auto ever offered in a Jeep. IMO

KevinC

Yeah, that 4 speed was a dog. The 3.8 with 4.10's and six speed was adequate. Certainly liveable, even with 33's.

The Gen 1 Pentastar wasn't that different from the current one. The current one, or PUG, has 14% more torque through the lower part of the power band. Peak HP and torque are the same, though. The PUG also had some friction taken out of it, so it is slightly more fuel efficient. It may have had some weight shaved, too.

What got the torque gain was the addition of 2 stage variable valve timing. That gave it a little bit of torque boost down. low.

Otherwise, the engines feel and sound identical. Hard to compare them directly because the transmissions and their gear ratios are different than the NSG370 and 5 speed autos that were in the Pentastar powered JK.

Also, the PUG has coatings on the high wear parts to reduce the wear and tear caused by ESS. Not sure how well it will work. If you don't use ESS, this thing might last 700k miles, Lol!

 

[DanW]

And I almost forgot, the oil sump capacity was reduced by 1 quart. Not sure all of the reasons for that, though.

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