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spectre6000

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Knowledge about to be dropped. Strap in:



When English dropped the "thee"s, "thou"s, and "thine"s a few hundred years ago in common parlance, and more recently in formal speech, the correct for the plural of "you" became "you". It's a bit confusing. "Did you mean me, or us?"

To accommodate for the confusion, various stand-ins have evolved. The most commonly known (and probably most effective) is the southern "ya'll". Others include "you'uns", "yins", "you folks" I guess... There's a bunch of them. "You guys" is absolutely one of them, and just as correct a "you (plural)" as any other. I wouldn't be critical of its use unless you are a strict adherent to the "you (plural)" idiom, and tolerant to all the requisite confusion it brings. I wouldn't get too hung up on it.

But wait! There's more!



"Guys" in modern parlance most typically means men, but that is not at all what it originally meant. It's one of the rare words that can trace its origin directly to an individual: Guy Fawkes. He of the Gunpowder Plot, lest ye forgot. "Guys" as a pronoun originally meant someone who was subversively plotting against the government. More specifically, the British government. It's not hard to imagine how popular that imagery would have been around the late 18th century here in the US. It's widespread use eventually evolved to come to mean just a male pronoun. Why male though? Because women were not viewed as capable (or whatever) of taking part in such activity as subverting the government.

So... You feel addressing a woman with a "male" pronoun is disagreeable? "Respect her womanhood," you say? Does this mean you disagree with the "incorrect" gender of "guys" as used in the regional plural-"you"ism? Why is it that women can't plot to subvert governments, I ask you? Seems awfully backward! Plot away, ladies!

-Speaker of the "you guys" form of "you (plural)"
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ShadowsPapa

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https://time.com/5688255/you-guys/

------------------------------------

y'all
/yĂ´l/

contraction
  1. you-all.
(Definitions from Oxford Languages)
---------------------------------

Don't say ''you people''. In the United States, that phrase could definitely be taken the WRONG way. Depending on who you say it to, it could have a very racial connotation to it.
I've seen it happen - a couple of people in a group were addressed as "you people" and whew - did that go wrong really fast.
it usually sounds derogatory as if one is subjugating a group or specific people... for example, "you gays" "you blacks" you Asians" etc. So... generally refrain from saying "you people".
 

heftysmurf

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Did you recently move to where ever this atrocity happened? Regional differences could play a part because here in South Florida, you're not hearing, "Hey Folks" all that often. Aside from this being the worst rant I've read in a while, does it really...like REALLY affect you that much?

I literally could be greeted with, "What's going on you muppet?" and it doesn't affect me one way or another.
 

KX L

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Not trying to offend any one, just a general assessment. The wife and I go out for a meal. The waiter or waitress come up and says "Hi Guys". Hold it right there, I am a Guy and she is a Gal. Masculine and Feminine. It may seem minor to most but the misuse of these terms is getting to be beyond irksome. It seems most humans simply run their mouths without thinking. Just rote phrases that make an English teacher cringe. So how do the women on this site feel about being lumped in with the "Guys" when a post begins with "... guys..."? I know, it may be a social media thing but did not any one learn how to speak properly? Rant over.
Just out of curiosity what do you think about the insistence [and in some places actual rule] that you call someone of the gender they "identify with" vice the gender they were born as and look like?

Or the insistence that there is no Mr or Mrs or Ms? You're trying to be polite and instead get insistence by the individual to be called "they"? [That sentence was hard to think up without using he/she in it.]. I need a :beer: or three.

As a guy who can read, write, [and spell] I personally don't like that text shortcuts are showing up in other written forms of communications. I notice it but it's not like I have any control over it anymore.
 

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ShadowsPapa

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....................
As a guy who can read, write, [and spell] I personally don't like that text shortcuts are showing up in other written forms of communications. I notice it but it's not like I have any control over it anymore.
Then you'll love this one..... when my son graduated college, he was disappointed in the lack of jobs in the states. He found that Japan was looking for people to come over and teach English. He went for that but it fell through - something on the Japanese end - not as many jobs there or something.
He found the same thing - for Korea. He applied (via internet, of course) - sent them his resume and letter of application.
They contacted him right away - he was the only person who wrote his emails like a business letter. No funky abbreviations, no TTYL, that sort of bull. It was written in his email exactly as a person would do in a business letter applying for a higher end job.
He was hired without much back and forth at all.
When he got over there he was told his writing in ordinary emails later so impressed them it made him their first choice. He was shown some of the stuff they received. It was like girls texting their BFF. Abbreviations, shortcuts, no introduction, no closing, no signature, and worse.

Social mediocre is dumbing people down and they treat business dealings like they were comparing their dates last night. No one can spell (look at "my breaks have axle lube on them" all over the internet. - and worse)
There, their, they're, is another biggy.

I screw up but with ADHD the brain goes faster than the fingers can keep up so I make common mistakes like teh instead of the and similar mistakes.
And computer smell chick doesn't always catch some mistakes.
 

KX L

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Then you'll love this one..... when my son graduated college, he was disappointed in the lack of jobs in the states. He found that Japan was looking for people to come over and teach English. He went for that but it fell through - something on the Japanese end - not as many jobs there or something.
He found the same thing - for Korea. He applied (via internet, of course) - sent them his resume and letter of application.
They contacted him right away - he was the only person who wrote his emails like a business letter. No funky abbreviations, no TTYL, that sort of bull. It was written in his email exactly as a person would do in a business letter applying for a higher end job.
He was hired without much back and forth at all.
When he got over there he was told his writing in ordinary emails later so impressed them it made him their first choice. He was shown some of the stuff they received. It was like girls texting their BFF. Abbreviations, shortcuts, no introduction, no closing, no signature, and worse.

Social mediocre is dumbing people down and they treat business dealings like they were comparing their dates last night. No one can spell (look at "my breaks have axle lube on them" all over the internet. - and worse)
There, their, they're, is another biggy.

I screw up but with ADHD the brain goes faster than the fingers can keep up so I make common mistakes like teh instead of the and similar mistakes.
And computer smell chick doesn't always catch some mistakes.
Good on you for teaching [convincing?] your son the importance of using business language and norms when doing business. There is no doubt he texts and talks differently when with his buds. This alone is going to take him far in life.

What amazes me is just how horrible the spelling is on this site---and with most I'm convinced it's because they don't even try to read what they wrote.

Nothing ever comes out right the first time---and if you're using Siri or Alexa without checking then you're in worse trouble. Check on smell chick :)

I'm also amazed at my friends who do everything on their phone--to include forums. I can't even imagine it.

My experience has shown me that a majority find it really hard to read their own work as if seeing it for the first time---and therefore suck at editing and fixing it.
 

spectre6000

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What amazes me is just how horrible the spelling is on this site---and with most I'm convinced it's because they don't even try to read what they wrote.
Misspellings don't amaze me all that much. The vast majority of people are dumb animals (biologically speaking, not necessarily social commentary), and it's to be expected. What amazes me is the... it's almost pride they take in that ignorance. There was a guy here recently who couldn't spell "Mojave", and misspelled it repeatedly. It's literally everywhere on the site, it's a major landmark, it's the thing he ostensibly came to this site to discuss. Among the numerous other misspellings from this tragic character was a misspelling of... It was either "Cadillac" or "Camaro" (I forget which) in his "Vehicle(s):" thing under his profile picture. When a few people called him on his atrocious spelling, he doubled down like it was a point of pride that he had a 4th grade reading level, and blamed others lack of "reading comprehension" like his intellectual failings were somehow their fault! It was astonishing. But that wasn't all, others on here backed him up!!!! I was floored. The entire premise of this site (and most websites) is predicated on the written word. If you can't manage those basics, how do you expect to be able to participate in this niche of society? Illiteracy used to be a binary, but in the modern era, it's more of a spectrum, and the population on the unfortunate end of that bell curve is astounding.
 

HopSlammer

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So true! It also infuriates me when people say, "What's up?"! Like, should we look up towards the ceiling when people say that and describe anything above us? Also frustrating is the callous use of the term "boys"! It is a word for males under the age of 18. Don Henley's song, "The Boys of Summer" should properly be called, "The Adult Males of the Summer" to be more precise. And the old TV sitcom should be called, "The Golden Senior Female Humans". What about American football? It should be properly called, 'Oblong Arm Ball' because of how the ball is actually advanced. I am glad someone is focusing on this critical issue instead of Gladiator topics, the economy, social welfare, human liberty or other such trivial distractions!
What’s up… guys?
 

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Not trying to offend any one, just a general assessment. The wife and I go out for a meal. The waiter or waitress come up and says "Hi Guys". Hold it right there, I am a Guy and she is a Gal. Masculine and Feminine. It may seem minor to most but the misuse of these terms is getting to be beyond irksome. It seems most humans simply run their mouths without thinking. Just rote phrases that make an English teacher cringe. So how do the women on this site feel about being lumped in with the "Guys" when a post begins with "... guys..."? I know, it may be a social media thing but did not any one learn how to speak properly? Rant over.
Lol, I’ve never given it a second thought. Life has punched me in the face so much that things like being able to sit at a restaurant and someone’s words not being 100% exact don’t bother me.
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