Vs. 2024 ZR2... (Edit- Test Driven, opinions inside)

[Chunky White]

Same here, 310hp and 430 torques with cylinder deactivation, vs the Taco at 326hp and 465 torques with all your cylinders and hybrid mileage.

The tundra hybrid only makes about 1mpg better than the non hybrid. I talked to one of the salesman at the local Toyota dealership that I've known for many years and he says the hybrid tundra isn't worth the price difference. I thought the truck was boring anyway when I drove it

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[bleda2002]

The tundra hybrid only makes about 1mpg better than the non hybrid. I talked to one of the salesman at the local Toyota dealership that I've known for many years and he says the hybrid tundra isn't worth the price difference. I thought the truck was boring anyway when I drove it

Terrible salesman then since he clearly doesn't understand the product. Not all hybrids are for mpgs, most are actually for more power. In the tundra it's for the added power, specifically 60hp\110ftlbs more power and better mpg than an equivalent gas engine would do at that power level.

Same with the 4xe, it's not for mpgs over the 3.6 or 2.0, it's for v8 power at 2.0 level fuel economy. A comparable engine, the 5.7 for example, would be 5ish mpg less city.

 

[Chunky White]

Terrible salesman then since he clearly doesn't understand the product. Not all hybrids are for mpgs, most are actually for more power. In the tundra it's for the added power, specifically 60hp\110ftlbs more power and better mpg than an equivalent gas engine would do at that power level.

Same with the 4xe, it's not for mpgs over the 3.6 or 2.0, it's for v8 power at 2.0 level fuel economy. A comparable engine, the 5.7 for example, would be 5ish mpg less city.

honest salesman in my opinion. I have zero experience with the 4xe but my next door neighbor has a 4xe JLU and he has shown me his mpg chart and he's averaging mid 20's mpg versus me averaging 15 in a JTR. The non hybrid tundra averages about 17 and hybrid 18 which isn't great but good for a full size truck in my opinion. Much better than the 11-12 the old tundra got. I have own 2 3.5EB F150's and all three would leave the Tundra behind in a drag race. I averaged around 15 mpg in those. I actually did better on fuel mileage with the 5.0. All F150 were the same body style thats out now. I had a Ram Limited with the 5.7 for a rental for a few days and got 17mpg which isn't any less than the Tundra

The Tundra would be my last choice if I was to buy a full size truck. I would probably buy a Ram if I was to trade now because I don't trust Fords reliability after my last F150 and Explorer ST

 

[bleda2002]

honest salesman in my opinion. I have zero experience with the 4xe but my next door neighbor has a 4xe JLU and he has shown me his mpg chart and he's averaging mid 20's mpg versus me averaging 15 in a JTR. The non hybrid tundra averages about 17 and hybrid 18 which isn't great but good for a full size truck in my opinion. Much better than the 11-12 the old tundra got. I have own 2 3.5EB F150's and all three would leave the Tundra behind in a drag race. I averaged around 15 mpg in those. I actually did better on fuel mileage with the 5.0. All F150 were the same body style thats out now. I had a Ram Limited with the 5.7 for a rental for a few days and got 17mpg which isn't any less than the Tundra

The Tundra would be my last choice if I was to buy a full size truck. I would probably buy a Ram if I was to trade now because I don't trust Fords reliability after my last F150 and Explorer ST

He's not honest, Toyota tells you it's not really better at mpg right on the sticker. He's bad because he's acting like the reason to buy it is mpg, not the extra power. The extra mpg is a possible bonus but it's missing the actual point of them. The hybrid is a full half second faster than the non-hybrid and almost a full second faster than the ram at basically the same to slightly better mpg.

A non hybrid jlu will get the same to better mpgs than the 4xe but with a massive performance deficit. The 4xe does have the all electric range to skew the numbers, but once they're both on gas engine running the non hybrid is slightly better except 100hp/200lbft less power so it's not really better mpg as it's not apples to apples.

 

[Chunky White]

He's not honest, Toyota tells you it's not really better at mpg right on the sticker. He's bad because he's acting like the reason to buy it is mpg, not the extra power. The extra mpg is a possible bonus but it's missing the actual point of them. The hybrid is a full half second faster than the non-hybrid and almost a full second faster than the ram at basically the same to slightly better mpg.

A non hybrid jlu will get the same to better mpgs than the 4xe but with a massive performance deficit. The 4xe does have the all electric range to skew the numbers, but once they're both on gas engine running the non hybrid is slightly better except 100hp/200lbft less power so it's not really better mpg as it's not apples to apples.

Hes saying its not worth buying the hybrid in his honest opinion. I didn't like either and probably wouldn't buy any Toyota available so it doesn't matter.

 

[maSS-hole]

It's odd, my wife's 6 speed 1.8t golf wagon with a tune (est 230 hp) feels like a rocketship compared to the Jeep. I know it isn't, but it feels quick. I suppose I can't be too harsh considering I'm asking the Jeep to get moving with 37s. I echo @maSS-hole about the ZR2's "meh" feeling of power. It didn't feel torquey to me at all, and I was bracing for it. It went forward, sure. But not at any pace that either squished me into the seat nor felt fast. With 37s, (which is can't even fit), it would be nightmarishly slow I think.

But there isn't a review out there of the 392 that echoes these sentiments. I could sacrifice a little towing for a proper V8 or V8 level power. 400+ is probably sufficient.

Yeah, IDK. I felt like I was waiting for it the push me back in the seat based on the paper numbers, and it should have, but it just didnt.

I went back and test drove a JTR EcoD the next day after the ZR2 test drive and my wife and I are both in agreement that the Jeep is the better truck for us. The ZR2 sounds fantastic on paper, and has all the nice options, but the interior feels cramped in comparison and the engine did not impress me. With the car seats in the back my wife had to be up against the dash and the roof felt really low. The JT with the hard top has a lot more headroom(except around the roll bars but thats not where your head is)

The cooling issues with the JT Ecodiesel is what's scaring me at this point. I already fought that battle with my F150 and I don't really want to again.

The tundra hybrid only makes about 1mpg better than the non hybrid. I talked to one of the salesman at the local Toyota dealership that I've known for many years and he says the hybrid tundra isn't worth the price difference. I thought the truck was boring anyway when I drove it

The Tundra hybrid is a pretty poor attempt IMHO.

Terrible salesman then since he clearly doesn't understand the product. Not all hybrids are for mpgs, most are actually for more power. In the tundra it's for the added power, specifically 60hp\110ftlbs more power and better mpg than an equivalent gas engine would do at that power level.

Same with the 4xe, it's not for mpgs over the 3.6 or 2.0, it's for v8 power at 2.0 level fuel economy. A comparable engine, the 5.7 for example, would be 5ish mpg less city.

I get what you are saying, it does have more power and torque, but because it adds almost 600 lbs to the truck the performance is not realized for the most part. My guess is the initial thrust off the line is better but up top it starts to fall flat.

It certainly doesn't help with towing much since the 1.8kwh battery can't sustain a meaningful amount of thrust for very long.

And I find the hybrid MPG vs performance thing an excuse. Ford made the Powerboost that gives great MPG's and is also very fast. Ford Powerboosts are averaging in the 19's on fuelly.com(vs 16's for the regular 3.5L Ecoboost) while the Tundra iforce Max is 16's. 0-60 and quarter mile times between the two are not even close. And then on top of that, Powerboosts have the 7.2kW on board generator which is something Toyota doesnt offer at all and would be useful for anyone towing travel trailers or just for general use.

Toyota missed the mark in my opinion.

And if you look at my sig, I own vehicles from both brands and have a fully electric Bolt, so i am not biased. I was looking really hard at 3rd Gen Tundras but their lack of Full-Time 4wd and some other stuff really turned me off on it.

 

[bleda2002]

Yeah, IDK. I felt like I was waiting for it the push me back in the seat based on the paper numbers, and it should have, but it just didnt.

I went back and test drove a JTR EcoD the next day after the ZR2 test drive and my wife and I are both in agreement that the Jeep is the better truck for us. The ZR2 sounds fantastic on paper, and has all the nice options, but the interior feels cramped in comparison and the engine did not impress me. With the car seats in the back my wife had to be up against the dash and the roof felt really low. The JT with the hard top has a lot more headroom(except around the roll bars but thats not where your head is)

The cooling issues with the JT Ecodiesel is what's scaring me at this point. I already fought that battle with my F150 and I don't really want to again.



The Tundra hybrid is a pretty poor attempt IMHO.



I get what you are saying, it does have more power and torque, but because it adds almost 600 lbs to the truck the performance is not realized for the most part. My guess is the initial thrust off the line is better but up top it starts to fall flat.

It certainly doesn't help with towing much since the 1.8kwh battery can't sustain a meaningful amount of thrust for very long.

And I find the hybrid MPG vs performance thing an excuse. Ford made the Powerboost that gives great MPG's and is also very fast. Ford Powerboosts are averaging in the 19's on fuelly.com(vs 16's for the regular 3.5L Ecoboost) while the Tundra iforce Max is 16's. 0-60 and quarter mile times between the two are not even close. And then on top of that, Powerboosts have the 7.2kW on board generator which is something Toyota doesnt offer at all and would be useful for anyone towing travel trailers or just for general use.

Toyota missed the mark in my opinion.

And if you look at my sig, I own vehicles from both brands and have a fully electric Bolt, so i am not biased. I was looking really hard at 3rd Gen Tundras but their lack of Full-Time 4wd and some other stuff really turned me off on it.

600lbs for a 1.8kwh battery? What the hell did they add to get to that weight? The 4xe is about that much more and its got a 17KwH battery

 

[maSS-hole]

600lbs for a 1.8kwh battery? What the hell did they add to get to that weight? The 4xe is about that much more and its got a 17KwH battery

Best I can tell. Its a NiMh battery I believe so its probably a lot heavier, but still shouldnt be much more than 100 lbs. Then you have the motor, electronics and cooling system.

The Powerboost is ~500 lbs.

 

[BearFootSam]

I'd frame the decision in the context of which vehicle you'll remember in twenty years. It may very well be that the JT will become the last (4-wheeled) ICE vehicle we'll buy and if that comes to pass, it'll be a good one to go out on.

 

[maSS-hole]

I'd frame the decision in the context of which vehicle you'll remember in twenty years. It may very well be that the JT will become the last (4-wheeled) ICE vehicle we'll buy and if that comes to pass, it'll be a good one to go out on.

My 2006 Pontiac GTO 6 speed will be forever remembered. Wish I never sold it.

I agree with you that the Jeep has that appeal. I went and test drove the ZR2 and then the next day went and test drove another JTR EcoD, and was giddy. My wife was like, just stop thinking about the ZR2, you didnt like it.

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