Sunrider owners - MY mess-up, or theirs?

[ShadowsPapa]

I've got a '21 JT Sport S and now am learey of getting a sunrider for mine especially after following along.

It's a mixed bag......some fit ok, others sit too low up front - and that includes the Bestop branded units!
This is NOT just a Jeep brand issue.

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[WILDHOBO]

I've got a '21 JT Sport S and now am learey of getting a sunrider for mine especially after following along.

It’ll be fine. You’ll love it. Get it from bestop, not Jeep.

 

[Reddout99]

It’ll be fine. You’ll love it. Get it from bestop, not Jeep.

They're so expen$ive new, I didn't know if I should take a chance. Now I just have to find used one with the new style clips (not z clips).
I don't need one and am in no hurry, so I'll keep an eye out locally

 

[Eagle22]

I've got a '21 JT Sport S and now am learey of getting a sunrider for mine especially after following along.

That's something you have to decide for yourself.

I've been reading this forum for about four years now...a couple of things stand out to me:

1. Many of the longest threads seem to come from people who have a problem with x, y, or z and are either venting, trying to get it fixed, or looking for advice.

2. The extent of problems with x, y, or z across the Jeep fleet are hard to determine, because it's usually the folks with the problems who chime in...not a lot of scientific poling and or research goes into it...the folks who are satisfied with x, y, or z tend to stay quiet.

3. Some people with problems purport to speak for dozens/hundreds/thousands who have the problem (once again, unscientific).

I seldom chime in on these types of issues, but I did this time because it was Shadow's Papa who was having the problem - I have always respected his posts and commentary - and, it appeared that he might be having a problem with Bestop, a company that I have been very satisfied with dealing with.

Repeating, that getting a Sunrider is something you have to decide for yourself...that's exactly what I did...and I ONLY speak for myself, and my experience.

I think I am the only person who has chimed in, who owns two Bestop Sunriders - one purchased in 2021 and another purchased in 2024, both directly from Bestop. When I did my research (YouTube videos and other customer reviews) the ONLY complaint I found was the difficulty in dealing with the Z-clips that were used to connect the tension cables during installation. Bestop has since changed that, substituting bolts for the z-clips. My 2021 and 2024 Bestop Sunders are identical, with the exception of the z-clip change.

I have used these two Bestop Sunriders on a 2021 Gladiator and a 2024 Wrangler. They are completely interchangeable. I use the Sunriders exclusively, year round, in all types of weather. I have never used the Freedom panels...they sit in their bags in my basement.

I have never had a problem with fit...I get no wind noise, no rain leakage. There is more road noise, but I have mitigated that with a recent installation of a Hot Heads headliner for Bestop Sunrider.

One other thing that I can say - Shadow's Papa has a Mopar Sunrider. I have never owned a Mopar Sunrider. But I have studied his pictures and his commentary, and I have concluded that his Mopar Sunrider is significantly different from my Bestop Sunriders.

He has not tried a Bestop Sunrider on his Gladiator, and I have not tried a Mopar Sunrider on either of my Jeeps....these are facts.

My reason for this (hopefully) last post on this topic for me, is exactly for the reason you expressed. I would hate to see someone miss out on the great experience I've had with the Bestop Sunriders due to the complaints in a forum. Just wanted to balance the conversation.

 

[Reddout99]

Thanks Eagle22.

 

[heretic]

Eagle22

You have a point…
But I think it’s not so much the top/brand. I had a figment issue with my BESTOP brand. As MANY have reported. What you are missing is the way the weather seal is constructed more precisely the muck flap. Seems newer 2023ish Glad, Wran are different from before which is when you MAY have an issue with the fit. That’s really all that needed to be reported, yes the thread had has a long life…

 

[heretic]

Also if anyone was willing to help/solve this problem maybe start a poll/database.

What year?
Glad,Wran?
What brand top?
Muck flap?
Issues yes or no?

This could help EVERYONE.
Just a thought.

 

[ShadowsPapa]

It’ll be fine. You’ll love it. Get it from bestop, not Jeep.

Won't matter, check my pictures of the Bestop ones doing the same thing. That's the point, both have issues. Proof in the photos I've posted.
It doesn't matter who supplies, read and look at the pics.

 

[WILDHOBO]

They're so expen$ive new, I didn't know if I should take a chance. Now I just have to find used one with the new style clips (not z clips).
I don't need one and am in no hurry, so I'll keep an eye out locally

If you find a good condition twill one with z clips, it takes 5 minutes to switch them out. Mine originally had them. Not anymore. And they are not the big deal some think they are. They’re easy and work fine. I wouldn’t pass one up for that.

 

[ShadowsPapa]

If you find a good condition twill one with z clips, it takes 5 minutes to switch them out. Mine originally had them. Not anymore. And they are not the big deal some think they are. They’re easy and work fine. I wouldn’t pass one up for that.

Yup - there's a number of them for sale, and can be updated. OTOH, I think part of the Z clip is the user. I've read about the Z clip thing and thought it to be an easy fix.

A person would be a lot better off buying a used one - and making sure of the fit.

This post here shows proof that it's ALSO A BESTOP ISSUE (but people see mine is a Jeep unit and get all hooked on that and just can't let go of that part) ->
https://www.jeepgladiatorforum.com/...-mess-up-or-theirs.95640/page-19#post-1552328

And - I found people in other Wrangler forums who said Bestop told them it wasn't right, and they contected Bestop support and never got a solution.
So it's really a craps shoot - get it from Jeep it may fit PERFECTLY - or not
Get it from Bestop and it may fit perfectly - or not.
And the support will be the same way - if it doesn't fit, well, good luck with that. The guy never got a solution from Bestop - at least not that he posted in the forum I found that on.

Also if anyone was willing to help/solve this problem maybe start a poll/database.

What year?
Glad,Wran?
What brand top?
Muck flap?
Issues yes or no?

This could help EVERYONE.
Just a thought.

Yeah, the problem is that the responses in this thread are often the OLDER Jeeps or older sunriders and a mix of where it came from. There's nothing solid other than I've found several 2023 Wrangler owners with the exact same issue.

There's a big bottom line here - IF the sunrider fit like the freedom panels, there would be no issue. However, going back years, they were pretty close on the front end and if there was any deviation in any measurement, it was a problem. Again, maybe stack-up of tolerances.

"Stack-up of tolerances" - that's a term we've used for decades to describe why Joe had an engine that went 150,000 miles and had high oil pressure and no noised but Sam had the same engine, treated it the same, and his oil pressure was lower and he had to replace rod bearings at 100,000 miles.
Joe had a crankshaft at the large end of the spec range and the bearings were at the tight end of the range while Sam got a crankshaft at the small end of the specs and bearings that were a tad loose to begin with. Joe's clearances were as tight as the spec allowed, Sam's clearances were as loose as the specs allowed. Both within specs.
We live in a world where manufactured parts have a range of "ok". Same for these sunriders - but you can bet their specs are a bit "looser", the range "wider" than engine parts.

 

[Gatorized]

What year was Bill's "Mopar Sunrider" built for? The same as your "Bestop"?

like the freedom panels, they are built to be universal fit across the entire generation, JT and JL.
there is no listing for different part numbers for different years.

 

[ShadowsPapa]

like the freedom panels, they are built to be universal fit across the entire generation, JT and JL.
there is no listing for different part numbers for different years.

And that leads me to another thought - these were created years back. Any that sat too low in the front, people ignored the inequality of the gaps and said "it fits, it works" and were ok with it, even if the gap looked like it was too low up front - no one cared, it worked.
Then comes along 2021 and later - and suddenly that lack of a uniform gap, lack of a level fit was showed off by the crushing of the water control Jeep introduced in 2021. Now the inconsistency of fit was magnified.
Now there was proof that the fit was inconsistent. That there was an issue all along - but it didn't matter before.

Even if I had a 2020 Wrangler with a sunrider made in 2019, if that gap dwindled down to nothing at the front, I'd ask what's up - why.
Now it's a necessity that they be uniform and consistent and the gap remain the same rear to front.

Why wasn't anything changed?
Multiple reasons -
*Jeep people ran into the problem, went online to find posts and videos and they were told by those posts or videos to "tuck that seal" (Bestop says do not tuck the seal) I've found proof of this in posts on other forums.
*Jeep people accepted it, hey, they have a sunrider, just ignore the seals or the fit - it works.
* People DID contact Bestop (and I have PROVEN THAT with prior post, and snippets here!) and after one or two "back and forths" - the communication ended. Some were told don't worry about it, others simply posted in other Jeep forums "they stopped getting back to me and have been silent" (that's pretty much a quote)

It's likely expensive vs. the low number of units sold to make any changes at this point. It would also open a big can of worms because all of those who have contacted the company in the past suddenly see a different design, a solution - and would be wanting it, maybe to be compensated. So it's risky to issue a fix at times.
If this is resolved, no matter by who, I'll go back to those people I found and let them know that there's a solution and what will Bestop or Jeep do when people come asking about that solution? Hmmmm - better to not offer a solution at all.

 

[Main Line Willys]

I was reading about the Hothead liner and came across this…

https://www.jeepgladiatorforum.com/...ider®-–-order-now-🚀.90074/page-2#post-1449817

Thank you for bringing this to our attention. We’ve seen a couple of similar cases and discovered that while the Bestop Sunrider is compatible with all Gladiators, there seem to be two different versions with slight differences in the inside crossbars. Can you please email us at [email protected] and we'll make sure to make things right!

 

[ShadowsPapa]

I was reading about the Hothead liner and came across this…

https://www.jeepgladiatorforum.com/forum/threads/new-hothead-headliner-for-the-bestop-sunrider®-–-order-now-.90074/page-2#post-1449817

Thank you for bringing this to our attention. We’ve seen a couple of similar cases and discovered that while the Bestop Sunrider is compatible with all Gladiators, there seem to be two different versions with slight differences in the inside crossbars. Can you please email us at [email protected] and we'll make sure to make things right!

Interesting.........
Assuming that Jeep and Bestop get mine resolved, I'll definitely need the headliner. Mine got REALLY HOT inside with the sunrider.
(it's a bestop design, so although Jeep is responsible for the product at the consumer end, modifications to the design would likely need to involve Bestop)

So i'd probably contact Hotheads before ordering to ensure I get the correct product and correct fit. Don't want to go through more hassles! I'd ask them a couple of questions, let them know what I have - and go from there. Sounds like their support is responsive. That's as important as product quality, IMO. You can have a decent product but if support stinks.......

 

[ShadowsPapa]

Well well well. Guess who got back to me.
NO, not Jeep!
Bestop - yeah, Bestop reached out to me via PM.
Ticks me off - NOT at Bestop, but at Jeep.......
It's their label on the unit, I paid JEEP for it, it came with the truck, it's a JEEP WARRANTY, but crickets from Jeep.
@JeepCares was supposedly going to keep me informed - and that was as of June 19th. LOL, right.

It should not have been Bestop who worked directly with me - if there's a solution (they say yes) then that solution should go to Jeep, Jeep should then have the dealer contact me, and the dealer should make any changes or repairs as per @Bestop.
Yes, it's a Bestop design, and patent, it's their baby, but....... Jeep sold the part.
Bestop is ultimately responsible for fit and function- and they are obviously working on this! I expected the real fix to come from Bestop since they own the rights, but Jeep warrants the part.

So, @JeepCares - if I am to make this mod myself - I will track the time and use my dealership's normal shop rate and expect ME to be reimbursed for what YOU - Jeep, should be taking care of.
I believe their rate is $175/hour. So if it takes me an hour, you owe me $175. If it takes 90 minutes, then take 1.5 x 175 and that's what I'll expect.
Warranty means you fix what's wrong at your expense, not mine.
If an axle leaks on my 2025 with only 3,200 miles on it, I do not expect that you send me a seal and I do all of the work. Doesn't work that way.

Bestop is trying, Jeep has fallen flat on their butts on this one.
STAR case, Jeep engineers looking into it - sounds to me like someone else did all of the work.

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