Rattle from engine when accelerating (sounds like keys)

[LoJac963]

But that is not a long term fix if they can become dirty again correct?

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[DAVECS1]

Could be casting or new engine break in junk in the original oil that got stuck. A phazer clean and regular oil changes may do it.

 

[flipmode]

So the dealer wants to charge me $500 for doing a 'Cam Phaser Cleaning Cycle' and check for ECU updates. Sound like a scam for a new truck under warranty?

Does anyone know how to purchase one of these Electronic Service tools? Is there any reason I can't do this myself, other than of course voiding a warranty?

 

[DAVECS1]

Wow that is outrageous! This is a tuff spot. They need to fix the condition but there is not bullet proof way to prove it is a condition, that is, until the motor is damaged. I would say make them fix the sound or prove it is harmless by extending your drivetrain warranty, but I. Fully aware of how dealership s will just play that talk off like your nuts.

As for the service tool, good luck. That is kept under dealer lock and key, O would offer GOOD MONEY for one, though I believe they need to be linked into the chrysler intranet to work correctly.

 

[flipmode]

I was afraid of that, and honestly that is more infuriating than the engine rattle. There MUST be something we can do with the premise that we have the right-to-repair our vehicles.

 

[Hipbilly]

Funny this popped up on "new" today, cause I just experienced this condition for the first time this morning driving my kid to daycare....
Just put on 35" tires, manual transmission with 3.73 gears, and was seriously digging some torques this morning... whenever I'd really let 'er eat in that 2,000-2,500 RPM power band, it'd rattle....
I'll be re-gearing soon, now I'm mildly concerned and curious if that'll keep the engine from having to work that hard.
31,000 miles here, never heard it before.

 

[flipmode]

Quickly searching around I found this:

YouTube Link​

Behind the 8 minutes of content here, the premise is that the Cam Phasers get 'gunked' up in newer engines. He doesn't use a Jeep or even a Chrysler engine in his example, but I think the situation is similar. @DAVECS1 mentioned that it could be break in junk, which is something even I can understand.

So the process is as follows: (1) Add this BG Engine Performance Restorer solution to the engine oil, (2) run it through the engine for 10-ish minutes, (3) Drain and replace in new motor oil and filter.

I'm interested in everyone's thoughts on this idea, I'm up against either $500 at the dealership, or maybe a simple fix like this. I'm prepared to go the dealer route, if this sounds like a BS quick fix or it may damage my brand new 3.6L.

Thanks again everyone, really appreciate the conversation and support here.

 

[DAVECS1]

So I was having lifter issues on my 64 corvair. A tribologist on that forum recommend this stuff, and I was blown away. It really worked and luckily was not snake oil. May be worth a try in this application
http://www.auto-rx-plus.com/

 

[flipmode]

Wow that is outrageous! This is a tuff spot. They need to fix the condition but there is not bullet proof way to prove it is a condition, that is, until the motor is damaged. I would say make them fix the sound or prove it is harmless by extending your drivetrain warranty, but I. Fully aware of how dealership s will just play that talk off like your nuts.

As for the service tool, good luck. That is kept under dealer lock and key, O would offer GOOD MONEY for one, though I believe they need to be linked into the chrysler intranet to work correctly.

YouTube Link​

This guy uses a tool by Autel, but the one he has is around $2,500, haha i think that qualifies as 'good money'.

 

[bettybo1119]

You would think that the dealer would have check that too since they have had it 5 different times. Will check, but doubtful. Thanks

 

[bettybo1119]

Not yet. Mine just started doing it like a week ago. Same thing. Seems to be worse when engine under load (during take off, hill climb, etc).

I'm have same problem with my 2020 jeep gladiator just brought it May of 2021 just started hearing this noise like a week ago

 

[SelfmodJT]

I have the same noise, 5k on the odometer but it seems to be coming from the middle of the gladiator and not the engine. So i switched to top tier gas( mobil) and the noise is less pronounced and does it less. But if it was dentonation or pre ignition why is the noise coming from the transmission area? Maybe mine is just a rattle, looks like ill have to check with a mallet. 2021 willys manual. Looks like ill be getting the mechanical breakdown policy from geico?

 

[ShadowsPapa]

I have the same noise, 5k on the odometer but it seems to be coming from the middle of the gladiator and not the engine. So i switched to top tier gas( mobil) and the noise is less pronounced and does it less. But if it was dentonation or pre ignition why is the noise coming from the transmission area? Maybe mine is just a rattle, looks like ill have to check with a mallet. 2021 willys manual. Looks like ill be getting the mechanical breakdown policy from geico?

Detonation - fuel self-ignites AFTER the spark event. Second flame front from the fuel self-igniting collides with flame front created by the spark ignited gases.

Pre-ignition - fuel ignites BEFORE the spark event. Generally caused by heat, hot spots, carbon build up, poor valve job leaving sharp edges on the valves, may be caused by high compression in a hot engine and low octane or unstable fuel.

Detonation - after the spark.
Preignition - before the spark.

Because both can cause sonic waves due to flame fronts colliding at high speed, which in turn resonates in the block itself, it's heard in the engine. The sound is the block transmitting the sound waves.
This is why knock sensors are in the block (I've seen them in the heads as well years ago)

Manual transmission vehicles are more prone because with automatics, USUALLY (not always) it will downshift to stop lugging the engine. Manual transmissions the drivers MAY tend to leave it in a higher gear too long instead of downshifting to get out of the range where detonation occurs. Detonation is almost always a low speed or low RPM event because it takes TIME for the conditions to occur. You don't get detonation at 6,000 RPM - engines built for drag racing or constant higher speeds can get away with high compression and high heat because they don't get lugged and don't run low RPM. They are almost always out of the detonation RPM range. 2,000 RPM or lower is ripe for detonation.

 

[DAVECS1]

The pre-ignition happens on these engines because the VVT is tuned not in sync with the throttle. There is a transition spot were the valves are closed and the throttle has let in to much air and it causes a dynamic high compression event like the video. It goes away once the valves get caught up. I heard this numerous times when tuning my VVt

 

[SelfmodJT]

Detonation - fuel self-ignites AFTER the spark event. Second flame front from the fuel self-igniting collides with flame front created by the spark ignited gases.

Pre-ignition - fuel ignites BEFORE the spark event. Generally caused by heat, hot spots, carbon build up, poor valve job leaving sharp edges on the valves, may be caused by high compression in a hot engine and low octane or unstable fuel.

Detonation - after the spark.
Preignition - before the spark.

Because both can cause sonic waves due to flame fronts colliding at high speed, which in turn resonates in the block itself, it's heard in the engine. The sound is the block transmitting the sound waves.
This is why knock sensors are in the block (I've seen them in the heads as well years ago)

Manual transmission vehicles are more prone because with automatics, USUALLY (not always) it will downshift to stop lugging the engine. Manual transmissions the drivers MAY tend to leave it in a higher gear too long instead of downshifting to get out of the range where detonation occurs. Detonation is almost always a low speed or low RPM event because it takes TIME for the conditions to occur. You don't get detonation at 6,000 RPM - engines built for drag racing or constant higher speeds can get away with high compression and high heat because they don't get lugged and don't run low RPM. They are almost always out of the detonation RPM range. 2,000 RPM or lower is ripe for detonation.

So i have to choose between detonation or gas mileage? ? my gas mileage is horrible as is because i dont drive much on the highway. Im around 15 to 16mpg, lol.

To be honest, idc anymore. Im assuming most people want their jeeps to last more than 100k miles and i hope mine does too without too many issues but anxiety will make it hard to just drive and enjoy what the jt offers. Im just going to get the mechanical breakdown added to my policy and let the pentastar do whatever it wants to do. My next mod will be a beater to drive just in case i have a major issue.

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