Jeep ceo…. Wants zero emission freedom brand

[BAT]

I’m surprised you don’t see how silly your arguments are. You think texas’ power problems are anyone’s fault but Texas voters? They have an unregulated grid, and the results are clear as day. You also really latch onto how china is somehow the argument for not improving things. Nonsensical at best. When steam and then internal combustion engines were invented, and there were only a few on the roads, people on horses laughed at them because it was never going to take off mainstream. How many people do you see rolling down interstates on horses? I like it when history repeats itself, sometimes.

Wrong Texas problem had nothing to do with voters it had to do with a multitude of things. Greedy management that instead of putting money that was earmarked to bolster the grid (This money was voted on by the voters years ago earmarked for building up and protecting the grid) Instead it was spent on pork projects by the power company and others. Second poor decisions by the power company to bring down so many suppliers for maintenance at the same time thinking all the new fancy renewables put in place would cover. The renewables failed right along with what little of the grid that was left on line. Thirdly is building laws and codes this does fall on the voters. The homes here are not designed for the cold. Giant open floor plans with tons of windows and minimal insulation make for homes that are not efficient to warm in hard cold along with the continued use of poor building materials like copper and other types of pipe instead of PEX, etc. I have neighbors who have solar on their houses and it did none of them any good during the freeze. They were in bad spot along with everyone else. The only one's who were ok were those like me who keep a big ass generator for Hurricane season or those who had natural gas generators on their houses.

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[ShadowsPapa]

At present, distributed charging at residences is the best option, and is easy and cheap to implement. To answer your question, it depends on battery size. A plug-in hybrid with a medium pure electric range, but then extended range via ICE, will average around 2 hours to fully charge with 40amp 240v. Pure electrics with 200-350 miles of range easily charge at the same voltage and amps in 8-10 hours at home while you sleep. Rapid chargers give 75-80 percent on long range pure electrics in 30 minutes or so.

Ford has developed a 10 minute charge cable. Granted, it means there has to be something to SUPPLY that sort of massive wattage.......... but it's not that far off, really.
On the other end, there's no infrastructure to handle that sort of load in concentration.

Iowa could easily handle the load - our capacity is great, we've got plenty of power and are the 11th cheapest electric in the country.
But certain other states can't even handle their air conditioning in the afternoon so good luck charging a vehicles with rolling blackouts.

 

[ShadowsPapa]

I believe there is a misconception in your statement.
EV owners do not “charge every single day”
Just as I and many others do not gas up every day.
With comparable range, most will only need to charge maybe once a week if they are used as daily commuters.
Just saying.

Hmmm, depends on your definition of commute, and your location. I know of people who commute 60 minutes each way. It's not uncommon.
I'd have to charge almost daily myself - it's half an hour to anywhere. 90 minutes of drive time are not uncommon. Since it takes more "power" to start moving than to maintain movement, a lot of up and down, slow and go, will take more power than maintaining a constant 45 mph speed.
Yes, you aren't using power to motive the vehicle when stopped - it's still going to be used for lighting, HVAC and so on. Stop and go traffic is actually more "moving very slowly" than sitting. so it would still be a drain........

 

[Outside Reality Check]

Actually, it'll be a banner day for improving the environment.

Humans cannot go on forever doing whatever they want that pollutes the water, air & soil, destroys animal habitats like forests, deserts, natural areas. There is simply a finite amount of these three and the faster we use them and/or pollute them which BOTH eventually destroys them then there is less for ourselves and a shorter future for us all.

Yeah, you can call me names, i.e. tree hugger, etc. Name calling is the last refuge of those who have no cogent argument. It's simply fact that things have change DRAMATICALLY in just my short 67 years of life so I can imagine what it would seem to someone who might have been around 100 or 200 years ago. They wouldn't recognize the world's condition. And 100 or 200 years is a microsecond of history.

I would like to add, you probably can remember a time in CA when the air was so unhealthful in summer you couldn’t go outside. When the beaches from Santa Barbara to HB were so fouled with tar you couldn’t walk or swim without getting that crap on you. I remember traveling to the largest city in South America in the 90’s and thinking how the air pollution reminded me of CA in the 70’s. It was horrible. We have made a tremendous amount of progress toward cleaner air and water. How is this trend a bad one? The world will follow us when we lead. Lead forward. They have followed us so far toward a cleaner environment. I have faith in future innovations that will address all concerns. The first cell phones had serious limitations, raise your hand if you still just have that one radial dial phone in the hallway on a 20’ cord. No one I’m guessing. My grandmother still had that phone into the 80’s, that was 40 years ago. So in 100 or 200 years if we don’t move forward, what will that look like?

 

[Gladman]

A tax credit is different than a tax deduction. It has zero to do with your income or tax bracket. If the vehicle qualifies for the credit, you get it. Period. If you don’t want to finance what you’re getting back in the spring, you do a $7,500 down payment, which is refunded to you after you file your taxes. And in many states you get some there as well. We got a $10,000 tax credit on one we bought this year, so put 10k down before financing, and not including our trade.

When and how much do you pay for road taxes that ICE vehicles pay when fuelling? I read that some states have already implemented such taxes at annual registration renewals For EV’s.One state I believe is at least $600.00/year. Add to that current charge times, voltages and $/kw hour and I wonder what the operating costs are and how they compare to an average ICE.

 

[ShadowsPapa]

When and how much do you pay for road taxes that ICE vehicles pay when fuelling? I read that some states have already implemented such taxes at annual registration renewals For EV’s.One state I believe is at least $600.00/year. Add to that current charge times, voltages and $/kw hour and I wonder what the operating costs are and how they compare to an average ICE.

Yes, road taxes are a substantial part of gasoline costs. And I've also heard that some are padding registration fees for electric to compensate.

Here's what Iowa has done so far - the problem is that it doesn't come anywhere even close to compensating for the loss of revenue for road maintenance.


Iowa
$65 additional annual fee for battery electric vehicles (BEVs).
$32 additional annual fee for plug-in hybrid electric motor vehicles (PHEVs).
In 2021, the fee increases to $97 for BEVs and $48.75 for PHEVs.
In 2022, the fee increases to $130 for BEVs and $65 for PHEVs.

Gas tax in Iowa is .305/gallon. If you use 15 gallons a week, that's 4.50 a week x 52 = $234/year.
So this year they'll still be paying much less than what most working people in this state will pay.

 

[Gladman]

Yes, road taxes are a substantial part of gasoline costs. And I've also heard that some are padding registration fees for electric to compensate.

Here's what Iowa has done so far - the problem is that it doesn't come anywhere even close to compensating for the loss of revenue for road maintenance.


Iowa
$65 additional annual fee for battery electric vehicles (BEVs).
$32 additional annual fee for plug-in hybrid electric motor vehicles (PHEVs).
In 2021, the fee increases to $97 for BEVs and $48.75 for PHEVs.
In 2022, the fee increases to $130 for BEVs and $65 for PHEVs.

Gas tax in Iowa is .305/gallon. If you use 15 gallons a week, that's 4.50 a week x 52 = $234/year.
So this year they'll still be paying much less than what most working people in this state will pay.

Yes that is true. However, politicians are notorious tax-grab artists and I think in the next few years the hammer will come down through the registration process. At some point there will be a balance, and then it will swing again one way, the other, or more likely, both ICE and EV will have to pay. It is the legislative creed - “Make ‘‘em Pay”.

 

[am1978]

Wrong Texas problem had nothing to do with voters it had to do with a multitude of things. Greedy management that instead of putting money that was earmarked to bolster the grid (This money was voted on by the voters years ago earmarked for building up and protecting the grid) Instead it was spent on pork projects by the power company and others. Second poor decisions by the power company to bring down so many suppliers for maintenance at the same time thinking all the new fancy renewables put in place would cover. The renewables failed right along with what little of the grid that was left on line. Thirdly is building laws and codes this does fall on the voters. The homes here are not designed for the cold. Giant open floor plans with tons of windows and minimal insulation make for homes that are not efficient to warm in hard cold along with the continued use of poor building materials like copper and other types of pipe instead of PEX, etc. I have neighbors who have solar on their houses and it did none of them any good during the freeze. They were in bad spot along with everyone else. The only one's who were ok were those like me who keep a big ass generator for Hurricane season or those who had natural gas generators on their houses.

Most people who have solar are grid-tied with little to no battery bank from SolarCity, Vivint, etc., for the sole purpose of trying to get a discounted rate by essentially leasing the system with a predatory lease contract. During the freeze, if they had their own battery banks and a failover LP or gas generator to charge the bank if they didn’t get enough sun then they would have been able to scale back on frivolous appliance usage and keep some critical things online. My whole family is in TX and I am from there. Most were to naive to put their perishable foods outside to keep it cold.

 

[VBDiesel]

Are Chevy and ford un-American as well then? Both are pushing hard for full electric in the next several years. Americans are supposed to be innovators. When did it become un-American to try to make things better?

I love my Diesel because it has so much low end torque. Imagine full torque at 0 rpm and a motor for every wheel?!?!

 

[Gladman]

What?
Apparently you are not aware of EVs range currently and moving forward it will only increase. When traffic “piles” up is exactly when an EV excels. No movement, no loss of energy. If 4-500 kms of range is not enough to escape, then it won’t matter what your driving.

Not normally would this be a zero energy state the vehicle is in.
Most often you will need a/c. Or maybe heat.
There is no free lunch in watts.

 

[ShadowsPapa]

Not normally would this be a zero energy state the vehicle is in.
Most often you will need a/c. Or maybe heat.
There is no free lunch in watts.

My point exactly. You'd have to be lights off, HVAC off, and foot off brake pedal. Even then there will be some slight drain as it will still be looking for fob activity and doing other low draw monitoring.

Yes, far better than even a modern gas engine, but not zero draw.

What would be interesting would be to set up a solar power system to charge your vehicle when you park it at home. During the days generate power and store it - and use from that when you plug in. You'd truly achieve a more environmentally friendly vehicle.
Then you could say - no coal was burned in the charging of my EV........

 

[HouseOfWolves]

I am all about a non-plugin hybrid system. The current Wrangler offering is bullshit.

I think calling something "Freedom Series" -- when it requires a cord, is a bit ironic considering the Jeep brand is about adventure.

 

[Trickster]

Not normally would this be a zero energy state the vehicle is in.
Most often you will need a/c. Or maybe heat.
There is no free lunch in watts.

Nitpickers…
I should have said when stuck in traffic motionless there is “very little”
energy consumed.
My bad.

 

[Gladman]

Nitpickers…
I should have said when stuck in traffic motionless there is “very little”
energy consumed.
My bad.

Yes.

 

[Trickster]

Hmmm, depends on your definition of commute, and your location. I know of people who commute 60 minutes each way. It's not uncommon.
I'd have to charge almost daily myself - it's half an hour to anywhere. 90 minutes of drive time are not uncommon. Since it takes more "power" to start moving than to maintain movement, a lot of up and down, slow and go, will take more power than maintaining a constant 45 mph speed.
Yes, you aren't using power to motive the vehicle when stopped - it's still going to be used for lighting, HVAC and so on. Stop and go traffic is actually more "moving very slowly" than sitting. so it would still be a drain........

For those that are perhaps unaware, EVs get better MPGe in the city as opposed to highway use. Opposite of gassers.
I suppose if you drive 400-600 kms a day you are right you would have to charge daily.

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