Car and Driver has posted a 10,000 mile update to their long term Gladiator review. Pretty negative

NachoRuby

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I've had my manual Gladiator Rubicon for about a month so far, and put on 1500 miles so far. It isn't a Mojave, but they are close enough. Same size tires, same transmission. I have to say, so far so good for me. A lot of the complaints, apart from the clutch recall, are just normal jeep behavior. It's an off road vehicle on 33" tires. I've owned several performance oriented manual cars in the past, and I must say, the shifter and transmission in this truck feel superb. Sure, you have to downshift to get into the torque band. But thats to be expected. It's a 5000 lb pickup truck on 33 inch tires, with only 285 horsepower. I think the manual transmission in this vehicle is a superb one. The throws are short, th clutch take up is perfect, and the gear ratios seem well chosen, to make the most of the engine we have.





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NachoRuby

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A couple of things struck me in this review:

this section: "Once our truck completed Jeep's short 300-mile break-in period, a brutal high-rpm clutch drop in 4HI launched it to 60 mph in a lazy 8.5 seconds"

and this one: "On level ground and with the manual in sixth gear, the Mojave required a staggering 24.3 seconds to complete the 30-to-50-mph and 50-to-70-mph passing tests."


I'm shocked that the transmission even lasted to 7000 miles after that, they should probably only allow those that know how to drive stick shift and understand automobiles drive their test vehicles.

the top gear 30-50mph and 50-70mph passing is also insane, not sure why that would even be a metric when some vehicles (like the jeep) have double overdrives making top gear unusable below 50 or 60mph
Yes, what is the point of a 30-50 test and 50-70 test in top gear? They seem to do that with all the manual vehicles they test, and it makes no sense on modern 6 speeds, with the gear ratios used. Why would I do that in real life without downshifting? Also, why would one be in 6th gear at 30 miles per hour? Or try to pass in 6th at 50? The owner's manual says 6th gear in this truck is for 65mph and above. Even at that speed, If I want to pass, I'm downshifting.
 

FloridaMan655321

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Yes, what is the point of a 30-50 test and 50-70 test in top gear? They seem to do that with all the manual vehicles they test, and it makes no sense on modern 6 speeds, with the gear ratios used. Why would I do that in real life without downshifting? Also, why would one be in 6th gear at 30 miles per hour? Or try to pass in 6th at 50? The owner's manual says 6th gear in this truck is for 65mph and above. Even at that speed, If I want to pass, I'm downshifting.
Agree, nobody is passing anyone in 6th gear. I kind of wish everything was geared a little lower. I mean, I'm not going to be doing 90 in this truck, so I kind of wish 6th was a little closer to 5th, and 5th a little closer to 4th, etc..etc.. and 1st not be as tall.


On the article....I kind of wonder with sites like Car and Driver if they still hire people who know how to drive a manual ;)
 

AZCooWhip

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People still “read“ that rag. I liken it to movie critics. All “opinion” that quite frankly is irrelevant To why people buy a Jeep. If you want quiet and no noise, you clearly didn’t do your home work.

Insert roll eyes to C&D.
 

cleatus

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Does your have the aluminum steering box? I had mine upgraded last week and it is a absolute night and day difference
my upgrade made zero difference. and of course i mentioned it when i was in the shop another time and they said it was "normal"
i dont think its the actual wander--as this brick will wander as its not aerodynamic---i think that its the DEAD SPOT in the steering. any other vehicle you just move the wheel a bit to keep it on track-- this one you have to TURN the wheel to keep it in the lane. like driving a 1968 school bus.
 

stickshifter

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Yes, what is the point of a 30-50 test and 50-70 test in top gear? They seem to do that with all the manual vehicles they test, and it makes no sense on modern 6 speeds, with the gear ratios used. Why would I do that in real life without downshifting? Also, why would one be in 6th gear at 30 miles per hour? Or try to pass in 6th at 50? The owner's manual says 6th gear in this truck is for 65mph and above. Even at that speed, If I want to pass, I'm downshifting.
So true. No way you are ever in 6th gear doing 30. That’s just silly. If you are cruising at 50, you’re probably in 5th, but even if you were in 6th, if you want to accelerate you downshift. That’s driving a manual 101. It seems that C&D wants to standardize tests and grade on that scale. In a supercharged Audi S4 you can accelerate from 50 in 6th gear. If you want to do that, buy an S4. This is like 4 Wheel Drive magazine taking an S4 on the Rubicon Trail and pointing out terrible ground clearance, and - oh my gosh, body panel damage!
 

Mojave Gladiator

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So true. No way you are ever in 6th gear doing 30. That’s just silly. If you are cruising at 50, you’re probably in 5th, but even if you were in 6th, if you want to accelerate you downshift. That’s driving a manual 101. It seems that C&D wants to standardize tests and grade on that scale. In a supercharged Audi S4 you can accelerate from 50 in 6th gear. If you want to do that, buy an S4. This is like 4 Wheel Drive magazine taking an S4 on the Rubicon Trail and pointing out terrible ground clearance, and - oh my gosh, body panel damage!
I usually run 4th gear all the way up to 60. The truck still has plenty of passing power, manages decent fuel economy and easily maintains speed when driving in elevation. If I'm on flat ground with minimal traffic, 50 mph in 5th is not an issue.
 

XJADDICTION

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my upgrade made zero difference. and of course i mentioned it when i was in the shop another time and they said it was "normal"
i dont think its the actual wander--as this brick will wander as its not aerodynamic---i think that its the DEAD SPOT in the steering. any other vehicle you just move the wheel a bit to keep it on track-- this one you have to TURN the wheel to keep it in the lane. like driving a 1968 school bus.
Maybe they didn’t reset the computer? I was skeptical of the TSB until so many on here had it done with great results. My Jeep was manufactured 05/2019.

When I bought it at a dealership 80 miles from my house ( I have a trusted dealer 20 miles from my house) they had 60 JTs including two Hellcats Rubicon Launch Ed builds. My trusted dealer had 5 JTs 4 stripped down basic sport S and one overland. The sport s without Tow package, running boards, no winter package , hard top, base stereo was $45,0000 and no haggle price.

The other dealer 80 miles away had the only Max Tow in my area and it was Red(my Jeep Color) This Max Tow was loaded, hard top, with 4S, middle stereo with dealer installed top line speakers and sub, winter package, running boards, factory aux switches (option back then on the MT) tinted front windows, ceramic coating I bought for $42,000 out of the door and they gave me $500 more for my 2016 rubicon trade in. They said no free Jeep oil changes because I got a cut throat deal.

When I test drove it it felt fine, even on the interstate, but I noticed it had 120 miles on it. Another reason for cheaper price. They said it was a demo.

The dealer didn’t fess up thatnit was a return, and I’ve had the vin checked for previous ownership (it was sold as new) and nothing showed up on the vin.

I speculate my Max Tow was an order and returned because of sketchy steering. After 1st commute I noticed wander, and I’ve had a lot of Jeeps, actually traded a JKUHR 2016 with 35’s on this JT. I lowered the tire pressure from 50 psi to 32 and that seemed to take care of it. Then this forum convinced me to do the TSB for the steering box.

Huge difference, I took my JT to my trusted dealer Premier Dodge Jeep in Mt Juliet, TN. I had the TSB printed out and they didn’t even need to see it. They ordered the parts, and 4 weeks later I was driving with the new box and computer program. Huge difference! That dealership even honored the oil changes synthetic with no up charge and threw in tire rotation for free.

Make sure they did the computer reset, make sure you see that black steering box on there.
 

Mojave Gladiator

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I've had my manual Gladiator Rubicon for about a month so far, and put on 1500 miles so far. It isn't a Mojave, but they are close enough. Same size tires, same transmission. I have to say, so far so good for me. A lot of the complaints, apart from the clutch recall, are just normal jeep behavior. It's an off road vehicle on 33" tires. I've owned several performance oriented manual cars in the past, and I must say, the shifter and transmission in this truck feel superb. Sure, you have to downshift to get into the torque band. But thats to be expected. It's a 5000 lb pickup truck on 33 inch tires, with only 285 horsepower. I think the manual transmission in this vehicle is a superb one. The throws are short, th clutch take up is perfect, and the gear ratios seem well chosen, to make the most of the engine we have.
I've owned both a 2018 JL Sport Manual 2D and 2021 JT Mojave Manual. Both transmissions shifted well; however, the JT requires more driver input (downshifting) due to increased weight and tire size. My only complaint is clutch pedal feel, I can physically feel gear changes through the clutch pedal when downshifting. Perhaps it's just a characteristic of a manual Mojave, or the clutch is potentially not adjusted correctly and slightly dragging?! I'm currently at 1200 miles, if nothing changes within another 1200 miles, I'll caulk it up as a characteristic and move on with life lol.
 

NachoRuby

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I usually run 4th gear all the way up to 60. The truck still has plenty of passing power, manages decent fuel economy and easily maintains speed when driving in elevation. If I'm on flat ground with minimal traffic, 50 mph in 5th is not an issue.
Yeah, I shift about the same as you. I shift to 5th in this truck at about 55 mph, and don't use 6th until I'm on the interstate. Rather than a close ratio 6 speed, like a sporty car, we have basically a 5 speed with an extra overdrive. My wife's jeep compass with a manual transmission is the same way.
 

NachoRuby

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The lower the rating of a vehicle by the woke consumer magazines, the more likely I am to purchase it.
It just depends on the car I'm looking at. If it's a sports car, then I trust C&D. Their reviews are pretty well written and accurate. But if it's a jeep, this isn't the place to go.
 
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redrider

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I would guess the not downshifting test is a holdover from the carburetor/ points ignition era. A heavy load at low rpm reveals things like poor fueling and engine timing/knock/octane. The timed portion relates to torque levels at low rpm. These days, the electronics has it covered but still done because that is how it has always been done. The speed limit is still applicable when passing.
 

NachoRuby

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I would guess the not downshifting test is a holdover from the carburetor/ points ignition era. A heavy load at low rpm reveals things like poor fueling and engine timing/knock/octane. The timed portion relates to torque levels at low rpm.
I guess that kind of makes sense, but no one had double overdrive gears back then. 5th and 6th are both overdrive. The 6th gear on these is intentionally useless for acceleration, because it's geared for low rpm cruising at highway speeds. Highway speeds back then were also a lot lower, meaning vehicles were geared accordingly.
 

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