Stinging article on Stellantis on CNN. Not looking good.

[ShadowsPapa]

If $100 bucks is a deal killer, then they probably shouldn't be buying a new Jeep. In today's economy, $100 bucks per month is chump change. People spend that much on Starbucks.

Wow, really? That's your perspective?
There's a lot of people out there who would be ok with $500/month payment, but 600 is a no-go (using those numbers just for example as I can recall US being in that same position)
100 might be chump change for you and some, but I also recall helping my son pick out a vehicle when they were moving back here from Korea - and yes, they had a monthly number to deal with. So he had to make choices on options and so on.
100 bucks makes a difference.
Me - never been to a Starbucks in my life. You only rent coffee anyway. To pay that much for burned coffee only to pee it out in an hour............

When I bought my 2020, yes, I had a cap on the monthly number. Was looking at a Sport but after looking at a few things, we decided we could move up to an Overland but a Rubicon was out of reach at that time.
Things have since changed a bit, but yes, in 2019, I was one of those where that 100 made a difference. Told the dealer I had a number and could not go over it (probably could have, but then it would have meant cutting back somewhere else)
It's budgets, choices, and what each person decides "value" means to them.

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[biodiesel]

Wow, really? That's your perspective?

Yes, that's my perspective. Financial experts are going to say the same thing. Folks have no business buying a new vehicle if they are living so tight that $100 bucks in a month is going to be a deal breaker.

In today's economy, people looking to make a little extra cash can do side work and make $100 bucks in a day super easy. @BourbonRunner is right, most people are willing to pay $100 more per month to move up to a much nicer trim level with more options. $100 dollars is so insignificant that many buyers will find ways to cut back on unnecessary spending over a 30-day period without any issues.

Don't get me wrong, I don't live like Dave Ramsey would like me to, but I'm also not living so tight that $100 bucks per month is going to be a dealbreaker. And back when I was a poor college kid, I wasn't buying new vehicles.

 

[Hugh Jorgan]

The posters that called it the “communist news network” or the “Clinton news network” don’t mean anything in particular you say?

I never said I liked CNN. I don’t care or watch it. But the same folks calling it stupid, politically charged names are likely the same ones focusing on Newsmax like it’s legitimate.

absolutely. Couldn’t fkn agree more.

 

[Master_Cylinder]

$100 is a huge deal breaker for me. Hell, that’s one of the main reasons why I don’t have a Gladiator yet! $100 May not go as far as it did, but it is still a lot of money.

 

[Cabel]

The last jeep I bought new off the lot was a stripped 1997 TJ. hard top with roll-up windows, no A/C, no radio. Only "tech" on it was the two front airbags. I paid $13,800. Factoring in inflation, in 2024 dollars that would be about $27,141. Remember however, that the median household income in 1997 was about $27,000, so you could buy a Jeep for about 50% of your annual income. They could not keep TJ's on the lot, as they "sold like hot cakes." The charm and appeal of the Jeep brand back then was that a lower to median-income family could actually afford an all-weather vehicle that would get you to work relatively reliably, and that could double as a weekend toy that if it broke, wouldn't break the bank, as there were tons of common parts in the junkyards (since they made tons of them).

Stellantis really screwed up by not leaving well enough alone. To go into a Jeep dealership today and buy a Jeep for 50% of your annual income means you need to make at least $90k a year when the current median household income in the US is about $62k. That $90K+ demographic is not the one that led Jeep to success. They traded high volume with narrow margins for low volume with high margins, however they forgot that when your customers are now in the upper income brackets, they have a LOT more choice now that you are competing against almost every other manufacturer (there are a lot of bloated SUVs on the market to choose from).

 

[biodiesel]

$100 is a huge deal breaker for me. Hell, that’s one of the main reasons why I don’t have a Gladiator yet! $100 May not go as far as it did, but it is still a lot of money.

Bingo! If $100 bucks is a lot of money, then buying a new Gladiator wouldn't make financial sense to do so. I'm glad you recognize it. Many financial experts recommend that vehicle buyers keep their payment within 20% of their monthly take-home pay which includes insurance, maintenance, and fuel.

 

[Zachanadandy]

$100 is a huge deal breaker for me. Hell, that’s one of the main reasons why I don’t have a Gladiator yet! $100 May not go as far as it did, but it is still a lot of money.

Hope you don't plan on driving it anywhere when you get it then. I'm $240 into the fuel tank in the last 9 hours on this road trip. If you can't afford to throw $100 out the window if you felt like it at least one a month you shouldn't be buying a new truck period.

 

[Zachanadandy]

The last jeep I bought new off the lot was a stripped 1997 TJ. hard top with roll-up windows, no A/C, no radio. Only "tech" on it was the two front airbags. I paid $13,800. Factoring in inflation, in 2024 dollars that would be about $27,141. Remember however, that the median household income in 1997 was about $27,000, so you could buy a Jeep for about 50% of your annual income. They could not keep TJ's on the lot, as they "sold like hot cakes." The charm and appeal of the Jeep brand back then was that a lower to median-income family could actually afford an all-weather vehicle that would get you to work relatively reliably, and that could double as a weekend toy that if it broke, wouldn't break the bank, as there were tons of common parts in the junkyards (since they made tons of them).

Stellantis really screwed up by not leaving well enough alone. To go into a Jeep dealership today and buy a Jeep for 50% of your annual income means you need to make at least $90k a year when the current median household income in the US is about $62k. That $90K+ demographic is not the one that led Jeep to success. They traded high volume with narrow margins for low volume with high margins, however they forgot that when your customers are now in the upper income brackets, they have a LOT more choice now that you are competing against almost every other manufacturer (there are a lot of bloated SUVs on the market to choose from).

I know math is hard, but 50% of $62k...is the price of a new base model JL. Your stripped TJ hasn't increased in price at all when you factor in inflation. But you get infotainment, AC, and power windows standard in a 2025. If the economy was booming like it was and interest rates were where they were in 1997, sales wouldn't be down.

 

[biodiesel]

the current median household income in the US is about $62k.

Yeah, but 37% of households in America make over $100,000 per year. That's tens of millions of people.

$75,000–$99,999: 12.1%
$100,000–$149,999: 17%
$150,000–$199,999: 9.5%
$200,000 and over: 14.4%

 

[ShadowsPapa]

Hope you don't plan on driving it anywhere when you get it then. I'm $240 into the fuel tank in the last 9 hours on this road trip. If you can't afford to throw $100 out the window if you felt like it at least one a month you shouldn't be buying a new truck period.

LOL comparing your use, which isn't even close to how most other buyers would use them ...how about at least apples to oranges instead of of apples to rocks. Not many of us spend that much on fuel in even two months, or make trips of that distance very regularly.
Really love it when people compare like that. They live very different realities.

 

[Zachanadandy]

LOL comparing your use, which isn't even close to how most other buyers would use them ...how about at least apples to oranges instead of of apples to rocks. Not many of us spend that much on fuel in even two months, or make trips of that distance very regularly.
Really love it when people compare like that. They live very different realities.

The point is $100 doesn't buy much these days. If $100 is breaking your monthly budget you should either be buying a vehicle that gets double the JTs fuel economy or if you need a truck you should be shopping used. An oil change is pushing $100. A tank of fuel $100. At this point it feels like I can't walk out of any store under $100. I'm all for having an idea of what you'd like to pay when you're shopping for a new vehicle and staying below your means. If your purchase is truly within $100 of stretching you financially you're over buying.

 

[BourbonRunner]

Bingo! If $100 bucks is a lot of money, then buying a new Gladiator wouldn't make financial sense to do so. I'm glad you recognize it. Many financial experts recommend that vehicle buyers keep their payment within 20% of their monthly take-home pay which includes insurance, maintenance, and fuel.

Ultimately we live in the payment and though a $10K jump sounds like a lot but in financing terms it's minimal in the grand scheme of things, that was my point. And yes, that 20% is real and too many folks mix up need with want and put themselves into financial peril.

No disrespect meant to folks who are tighter on cash, this is just financing a purchase and how the terms work out in real numbers.

If you start backfilling the cost of mods, you'd have easily been able to step up in trim for what you spent if the trim adds features you like/want.

 

[ShadowsPapa]

Ultimately we live in the payment and though a $10K jump sounds like a lot but in financing terms it's minimal in the grand scheme of things, that was my point. And yes, that 20% is real and too many folks mix up need with want and put themselves into financial peril.

No disrespect meant to folks who are tighter on cash, this is just financing a purchase and how the terms work out in real numbers.

If you start backfilling the cost of mods, you'd have easily been able to step up in trim for what you spent if the trim adds features you like/want.

And if you buy it because it's a truck and you need a truck, lean toward Jeep because of your history with Jeeps and the reliability factors and so on, and your wife keeps spreadsheets and lists of expenses and incomes........

Here we go with people in other brackets, with other lifestyles, wants and needs trying to determine what others should be doing. It's laughable.
It reminds me of the 17 educated idiots someone recently referred to - who the hell listens to financial advisors and economists when vehicle shopping?
People trying to tell me and others how we should be viewing things - like they are right and over half the rest of the country is wrong.
Stick to your own finances and how you use, or why you buy, what you can afford and so on and stop preaching to others how they should be spending THEIR money, or that if 100 bucks is a limiting factor, they are foolish.
Stand up there and tell those others how wrong they are.
Seems to me, ignoring certain people talking about the costs of things was a huge deal in recent weeks.

Yes, 100 can be a limiting factor. NEVER said it would cause financial hardship, but those with means here are assuming that's the case. Maybe that number has other effects, maybe it means that you can no longer save for an item you plan on in the next 5 years.
Stop assuming you know about other peoples' situations, or plans.
If I spend that extra 100/month, it means I can't get a certain project done after 5 years - that 100 would be going into another account for other things wanted in the near future.
Could it be afforded? Sure, and maybe even easily - but it would mean something else goes.

But as forums go - here we have people who can easily kick in to the next level, spend thousands on mods, trying to tell others what they can't or shouldn't be doing.
Really helps explain some of the other rifts in the country.
You don't know me, my future plans, needs, budgets, but are all telling me I shouldn't have bought a new jeep to begin with if 100 makes a difference.
How about maybe I'm planning on that 100/month times 12 each year for 1200 x 5 years going to pay for another item I've been needing to get done?


(There's also reasons things are prices 29.95 instead of 30.00. That's also a factor. Those book learned financial people live in their offices crunching numbers, never really knowing the people factors)

I bet that my whole house would fit inside the house of some of those judging others financially - but they are telling others that 100 means they shouldn't even be looking at a Jeep.
Nice.

 

[ShadowsPapa]

If you start backfilling the cost of mods, you'd have easily been able to step up in trim for what you spent if the trim adds features you like/want.

Yeah, more assuming - like everyone who buys a Jeep has plans on expensive mods.
Another laughable bit.
Most who buy do NOT end up with the thousands spent on mods that many forums members here do. Almost every JT I see around Iowa is stock or close to, maybe a slight lift, slightly bigger tires, and that's it. Around Florida, most of those I saw were pretty much stock.
People assume Jeeps are sold to people who will then spend thousands on mods and could have gone up a trim level with that money.
Wrong - had I gone up a trim level, I'd not be able to afford the power steps we need. Rubicon doesn't come with those power steps. So there's a case where that 100 bucks a month saved helped pay for those steps.

People keep looking at it from their own little cubicle.
I don't have thousands in mods, and keeping a trim level down in 2022 allowed me to add things I could not have done if I'd spent the extra money on a Rubicon.

Things have since changed, and today would be quite different for me, but then, yes, that 100 meant I could get a snow plow and add power steps.
The extra cash for a Rubicon would have given me totally useless junk for my needs, and cost me enough more I'd not afford the stuff I really wanted.

 

[BourbonRunner]

Bill, take a step back and breathe. I am saying "you" in a generic form, not you specifically.

I'll be clear: I'm not throwing shade on anyone.

I began this by saying IN MY AREA. Baltimore-DC Metro, one of the wealthiest in the nation. Cost of living in MY AREA is among the highest east of the Mississippi before you get north of NJ/NY. My average client's home sale is north of $600K. The median and average in my county is right about that, too.

But none of this changes the fact that a jump in $10K equals around $100 at prevailing interest rates no matter where you are.

Nor does it change the concept that if you're at or near 20% of your take home pay in vehicle expenditures (in total, not just payment) you may very well be living outside your means. Given the variance in costs of living between our respective areas, it balances out.

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