TPMS unavailable after tire swap

[Hootbro]

On the 2022 gladiators where is the TPMS module located?

It is integrated into the radio frequency hub on the back cab wall.

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[grein46087]

If it works with stock wheels, what is the defect?

The problem had sensors that are simply not being picked up.
The Last statement they told me, is the signal receiver looks to be defective. and had to order a new one,.... Still waiting.

 

[grein46087]

The problem had sensors that are simply not being picked up.
The Last statement they told me, is the signal receiver looks to be defective. and had to order a new one,.... Still waiting.

@Hootbro do you have any ideas what is going on Like the other guy, every time thy use the tool the TPMS sensors are fine,

 

[Hootbro]

@Hootbro do you have any ideas what is going on Like the other guy, every time thy use the tool the TPMS sensors are fine,

I am not a TPMS expert by any means but do know RF systems in my day job working in the aircraft industry.

We first must baseline the situation. If the vehicle with stock wheels and stock TPMS sensors work, then the system is working as designed. Once aftermarket wheels are installed and assuming the OEM TPMS sensors are installed and the system does not report, then something has taking the system outside its design tolerance parameters.

From my understanding, the mid 2021 and up Gladiators went to a single antenna TPMS system that eliminated the dedicated TPMS module that also had 3 dedicated TPMS antennas and rolled that to our current system with the Radio Frequency Hub doing dual duty with a single antenna shared with the FOB and remote start.

Now we are presented with a problem of why with new wheels does the TPMS not report? TPMS sensors transmit on a very low power of like one-millionth of a watt to maintain long battery life and to also not stomp and overpower other vehicles you may be close to and vice-versa. That means our single antenna TPMS system has to comparative power readings of the TPMS sensor transmit power to determine which wheel each sensor to transmitting the data from and report on the cluster display for each wheel tire pressure.

My speculation is when you introduce wheels that may have more mass and put the TPMS sensor farther out on the offset, the RFH single antenna can no longer interpret the wheel TPMS sensor transmit power wattage strength because it is outside the design parameters of the system.

As to why the TPMS sensors seem to report when initialize by a TPMS tool? My speculation is the TPMS tool is using RFID to trigger the sensor that would normal transmit by wheel speed using an accelerometer, the TPMS sensor knows the difference of the RFID initialization and transmits a higher wattage signal briefly for the tool and RFH and antenna then now can pickup that signal but will eventually drop out once the wheel is rotating again and the TPMS sensor start transmitting again at the lower wattage.

I guess the million-dollar question is what can be done to fix a set of aftermarket wheels and tires with no TPMS sensor data reporting? Outside of making sure you have fresh manufacture TPMS sensors with high battery life remaining, I really do not know what can be done here. You are not going to find at least commercially, higher power TPMS sensors because of the previously mention issue of stomping on and overpower other near vehicle TPMS systems. When it comes the RFH and antenna, pretty much the same as if there was any way to adjust the signal gain, it would then run the risk of picking up other near by vehicle TPMS systems and give false reporting. The FCC regulates this kind of stuff and keeps both transmit frequency assignments and wattage transmissions into narrow swim lanes they must maintain.

 

[ShadowsPapa]

Beat me to it. There are articles out there in the wheel/tire world about how a wheel can actually "shield" the radio waves from getting to the module. Sort of like a Faraday cage in a way - or maybe just like one.
Yes, they did move that module from a discrete module into the RF hub.
There's a TSB out there talking about reduced range for remote start and how it may be coupled with certain tire pressures not showing up due to a defect in the antenna.
So it's pretty sensitive.

I sometimes wonder if it's possible that a TPMS sensor with a weak, but still working battery being replaced by one with a new, unused battery would make a difference in signal strength? I'm no radio expert but part of me says no - it will work until the battery is low enough that it stops working and the "range" won't fade with battery getting weaker....... another part says it's possible. I'm just guessing.
If the one thought is correct, it means that the TPMS sensor batteries will only make it work for a certain time and things would stop working sooner than if it was on stock wheels.

 

[ShadowsPapa]

I know this will rub many the wrong way - but Jeep people love the "Lego methods" of Jeeps. and people love their beautiful wheels, even if they aren't exactly right for the vehicle, throwing things off and causing future problems because they were chose for looks, not function or fit into the rest of the suspension and steering geometry.

So - no one thinks of side effects, only "I want this to LOOK good".
But - the selling dealer MUST think of side effects - because it's federal law.
Law states that no dealer/shop can cause a TPMS system to be non-functional.
In other words, whatever they do with that vehicle - the TPMS system must still be operational when it goes out the door. Otherwise, that shop or WHEEL MANUFACTURER, has violated federal law.
The TPMS system is there by law. It's illegal for anyone you pay to work on it, or selling you parts or equipment to cause it to be non-functional.
If you break it, it's on you.
If they cause it to not function, it's on them and they have violated federal law.

There's a lot of "if this, then............" and "not necessarily..........." and "what if this happens.............." in there, it's not totally cut and dried, but bottom line is if it was working when taken into the shop then it needs to be working when it leaves the shop.
(example of an exception - if you were on a trail and busted off the factory valve stem and the TPMS was damaged, and not working, and you took it to a shop - they could technically just put in a plain rubber valve stem because they would not be the cause of the malfunction)

This is from a tire dealer's group -

So technically, if the TPMS stopped working due to them putting those wheels on, that vehicle MAY NOT BE RETURNED TO SERVICE until they fix it.

 

[Ice Man]

Hey guys, having a little issue. Went to Discount tire, swapped my stocks for aftermarket wheel/tire, transferred the TPMS sensors from my original tires. Since then TPMS not working on the dash. Drove over the weekend, tried slow, tried freeway speeds over 15 min stretches. Nothing, since unavailable. Stopped by Discount tire yesterday again, asked them to initiate the sensors with their scanner, again tried driving, still nothing.

Any suggestions? I figured going with my OEM TPMS that came off was the safe bet, I guess not.

This is why I don't go to discount tire shops or quick oil places. The swap you made should have been fine. They may have messed up your sensors.

 

[Splenda]

This is why I don't go to discount tire shops or quick oil places. The swap you made should have been fine. They may have messed up your sensors.

Discount Tire is great, as long as all you need is tires, and everything goes smoothly. The problem with Discount Tire is that they hire a lot of kids who have very little experience. They don't do alignments. They have very little technical experience. When you run into a problem like this, they may not have the resources to fix it.

I've said it before, and I'll say it again...TPMS is way too complicated and mysterious, and there is no excuse for it to be this way.

 

[ShadowsPapa]

I've said it before, and I'll say it again...TPMS is way too complicated and mysterious, and there is no excuse for it to be this way.

Yeah, why not just run wires from the sensors into the BCM?

 

[Splenda]

Yeah, why not just run wires from the sensors into the BCM?

Why not build the hardware into the vehicle to reset and calibrate the system? I just want to know if I am going to have trouble with my TPMS when I go to do a tire rotation this weekend.

 

[ShadowsPapa]

Why not build the hardware into the vehicle to reset and calibrate the system? I just want to know if I am going to have trouble with my TPMS when I go to do a tire rotation this weekend.

No reset is necessary in these. You simply rotate the tires, and it picks up the tires in the correct location.
I do a five tire rotation with matching wheel and tire, and it never picks up the spare when it's under the truck or even in the truck bed. It only ever picks up the wheels in the proper locations.

No reset, no calibration.
Even when I put on Rubicon take-offs on my 2020 - slapped those on with new MOPAR TPMS sensors (the seller kept the sensors) and it simply worked with the new wheels and sensors.

 

[Splenda]

No reset is necessary in these. You simply rotate the tires, and it picks up the tires in the correct location.
I do a five tire rotation with matching wheel and tire, and it never picks up the spare when it's under the truck or even in the truck bed. It only ever picks up the wheels in the proper locations.

No reset, no calibration.
Even when I put on Rubicon take-offs on my 2020 - slapped those on with new MOPAR TPMS sensors (the seller kept the sensors) and it simply worked with the new wheels and sensors.

Yeah, I have a matching spare tire and wheel with TPMS installed and will be working it into the rotation.

 

[ShadowsPapa]

Yeah, I have a matching spare tire and wheel with TPMS installed and will be working it into the rotation.

I had on my 2020 and 2022 Overlands - need to find a 5th wheel for the Mojave now. But I have a few miles to try to find one.

 

[Splenda]

I had on my 2020 and 2022 Overlands - need to find a 5th wheel for the Mojave now. But I have a few miles to try to find one.

Yeah, how much more would it really cost them to put a matching spare on the JT? I mean, it's already the same tire. How much price difference can there be between that steel wheel and the other four?

 

[ShadowsPapa]

When talking tens of thousands of vehicles- a lot. Even at a discount, the wheels for a Mojave, for example, sell for well over $250 each.

There's also the consideration that some people simply don't give a rip. I do.

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