OIL, 0-20 or otherwise (couldn't find the other oil threads)

[Reddog]

Why are people comparing two very very different engines?
They aren't even close other than they both burn gasoline and make things go.

Here's what insiders are saying - The problem has to do with connecting rod and crankshaft components with unspecified manufacturing defects.
It doesn't cover 2025 model year.

“A series of crankshaft and connecting rod manufacturing improvements implemented on or before June 1st, 2024, addressed contamination and quality issues. Model-year 2025 vehicles were built after these improvements and are not included in the recall.”



You likely know that the numbers, W and other, overlap a lot in measured viscosity so you really haven't ventured out of the yard very far.



Where's the popcorn and where's that chairman?
Is this a "here we go again thing?

What GM is doing is tossing a BAND AID at the problem with the change in oil viscosity. It's so funny - gee, we have defective parts, we'll put some tape over it for you with heavier oil.
And this will lead people to believe - gee, I should run heavier oil, too! GM is fixing their problem with it.
No, they are making customers shut up and go away - they are still running defective engines!
What a hoot.

Being a GM man all my life it makes me sick that they can’t even put out a tried and tested engine anymore without screwing up and then screwing their customers. Get that woman out of the head office and get rid of the union and start making good products again. What are they doing, copying China?

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[ShadowsPapa]

Being a GM man all my life it makes me sick that they can’t even put out a tried and tested engine anymore without screwing up and then screwing their customers. Get that woman out of the head office and get rid of the union and start making good products again. What are they doing, copying China?

I loved that little LS that was in my Chevy truck. Some are even adapting LS rocker arms and such onto AMC engines.

 

[Hootbro]

Curious if you, or anyone, has tracked any gas mileage deviation or poorer performance upon switching to a thicker viscosity. As the majority of people have often claimed Jeep is only running 0W-20 to squeeze .0125 extra MPG to meet a certain CAFE milestone. How much data do we have to debunk that claim, or confirm it does help MPG?

Any reduction is nothing that I have noticed or been measurable to any degree of significance.

 

[ShadowsPapa]

the topic of Chevy changing from 0W-20 to 0W-40 shows that most of these modern engines to include the Pentastar can safely run in multiple higher viscosity ranges.

I have no doubt the bearings - lower end, etc., can, but my questions are more around the 2-stage followers, and heat transfer. Heavier oil generally increases heat from sheer and it slows oil flow or "turn-over" in the engine, slowing heat dissipation as showed by studies on real engines measuring temperatures in the same engine with different viscosity oils.
Will a "typical user" see this? Doubtful. But then I'm also a "this works, it's recommended, never a problem with it - why change to something else" sort.

from switching to 5w-30

We circle back to the - those viscosities overlap quite a bit so you're change isn't much at all.
Difference between 5W and 0W - the circles overlap
Same for 20 vs 30 - the circles overlap. So you really haven't ventured far at all from the "recommended" oil viscosity.
When you check the details of 0w20 vs. 5w30 - they share quite an area.

 

[Reddog]

Any reduction is nothing that I have noticed or been measurable to any degree of significance.

Agree. I think this has largely been an urban myth perpetuated by kitchen experts. Guys add hundreds of pounds to their JT and then worry about how much gas mileage will suffer due to higher viscosity engine oil

 

[ShadowsPapa]

Agree. I think this has largely been an urban myth perpetuated by kitchen experts. Guys add hundreds of pounds to their JT and then worry about how much gas mileage will suffer due to higher viscosity engine oil

There are SO many variables to mpg, I can't see how anyone can actually tell anyway. Every day is different, loads, temperatures, humidity levels, it all varies so very much you'd have to track it over a very long time. Even then, how can one know what a .2 mpg change over time is due to?

 

[Hootbro]

Agree. I think this has largely been an urban myth perpetuated by kitchen experts. Guys add hundreds of pounds to their JT and then worry about how much gas mileage will suffer due to higher viscosity engine oil

True. Biggest hit I took on MPG's on my base Sport is when I took off the plastic under bumper air dam and converted over to a Rubicon metal skid plate. That dropped my MPG and easy 1.5 MPG. Then when I went to 33's that was another 1 MPG lost. I am afraid to guess when I am done putting on my EVO 1/4 pounder bumper and winch is going to do to the MPG's.

Nothing I have done with regard to motor or gear oil viscosity increase has made a measurable blip that I noticed.

 

[sharpsicle]

If you use a heavier weight oil, your tow capacity also decreases due to the added weight that must be subtracted from the GCWR. Right?

 

[Reddog]

There are SO many variables to mpg, I can't see how anyone can actually tell anyway. Every day is different, loads, temperatures, humidity levels, it all varies so very much you'd have to track it over a very long time. Even then, how can one know what a .2 mpg change over time is due to?

I agree. I don’t know why so many people get hung up on mileage. No one likes to pay high prices for gas but if mileage is that important to someone perhaps a JT is not a good choice for them. Generalizing here, if you are going slow, weight is a big factor in mileage. If going at highway speeds, aerodynamics plays a big factor in it. I just stopped thinking about it and decided that if I wanted or needed to drive a JT, then I accepted the downside.

 

[ShadowsPapa]

I agree. I don’t know why so many people get hung up on mileage. No one likes to pay high prices for gas but if mileage is that important to someone perhaps a JT is not a good choice for them. Generalizing here, if you are going slow, weight is a big factor in mileage. If going at highway speeds, aerodynamics plays a big factor in it. I just stopped thinking about it and decided that if I wanted or needed to drive a JT, then I accepted the downside.

I try to take a middle road - of course my needs are a lot different. I do try to consider the weight of accessories and so on - but - I don't get crazy about it. I wanted better snow and winter and rain performance so changed tires. Lost 1.5 mpg but - the payback was safter, better winter driving. A trade-off. Taking off the plastic bumper and going steel lowered it more, but the lighter bumpers weren't out when I made that change (and the steel bumper was cheap on eBay - that saved a lot of gas money.
It's a truck, but it's also a daily driver so I have to make some compromises.
I consider oil choices for many other factors, not fractions of a mpg. If I'm that concerned, I stop driving it and make my wife the primary driver. She can max out mpg with ease.

 

[SaiintNick]

I ran 0w20 on factory fill for 500 miles. Then had 5w30 put in. Then they went back to 0w20 because I didn't tell them otherwise. I don't notice any difference at all.

 

[Reddog]

I try to take a middle road - of course my needs are a lot different. I do try to consider the weight of accessories and so on - but - I don't get crazy about it. I wanted better snow and winter and rain performance so changed tires. Lost 1.5 mpg but - the payback was safter, better winter driving. A trade-off. Taking off the plastic bumper and going steel lowered it more, but the lighter bumpers weren't out when I made that change (and the steel bumper was cheap on eBay - that saved a lot of gas money.
It's a truck, but it's also a daily driver so I have to make some compromises.
I consider oil choices for many other factors, not fractions of a mpg. If I'm that concerned, I stop driving it and make my wife the primary driver. She can max out mpg with ease.

Yep, Im 77 now and do most of the stuff I used to do, just slower. I had many many hot rods and performance cars over the years with most getting mileage in the single digits. Wouldn't change a thing even if I could. JT’s are what they are, a good all around daily driver and fairly practical. It hauls my fishing gear, camping stiff and firearms when I want it to. Pulls my boat just fine. My only knock on the Jeep is the overall lack of quality control at the factory. The folks that designed it are clearly a bunch of bargain basement college grads right out of school. Just too many dumb or shortsighted features that rookies would make. Done whinning here.

 

[Splenda]

I try not to second-guess the manufacturer too much. My go-to oil is Pennzoil Ultra Platinum 0w20. It's a little expensive, but my cars run smoother with it than any other oil I have used. I still have 10 quarts of Castrol 10w60 EDGE for my old V10 BMW M5 on the shelf in the garage.

 

[ShadowsPapa]

Yep, Im 77 now and do most of the stuff I used to do, just slower. I had many many hot rods and performance cars over the years with most getting mileage in the single digits. Wouldn't change a thing even if I could. JT’s are what they are, a good all around daily driver and fairly practical. It hauls my fishing gear, camping stiff and firearms when I want it to. Pulls my boat just fine. My only knock on the Jeep is the overall lack of quality control at the factory. The folks that designed it are clearly a bunch of bargain basement college grads right out of school. Just too many dumb or shortsighted features that rookies would make. Done whinning here.

I can't lay under a vehicle any more and look up at the underside without getting really sick - so I'm really limited since I lost the functionality of my left inner ear/balance.
Ticks me off as I've got so much to do, including on my cars where almost everything requires being UNDER them.

Quality? The paint on my 25 is absolutely horrible compared to my 22. It's like it was sprayed in a local shop.
When I was wiping down the door sill area to put some clear paint film protection on the sill area, the rubbing alcohol dissolved the paint on the sill.
i assume it failed inspection after assembly and they did some touchup?
Paint should not come off on a paper towel with cheap rubbing alcohol.

 

[Splenda]

I can't lay under a vehicle any more and look up at the underside without getting really sick - so I'm really limited since I lost the functionality of my left inner ear/balance.
Ticks me off as I've got so much to do, including on my cars where almost everything requires being UNDER them.

Quality? The paint on my 25 is absolutely horrible compared to my 22. It's like it was sprayed in a local shop.
When I was wiping down the door sill area to put some clear paint film protection on the sill area, the rubbing alcohol dissolved the paint on the sill.
i assume it failed inspection after assembly and they did some touchup?
Paint should not come off on a paper towel with cheap rubbing alcohol.

It's odd that your paint doesn't seem very high quality. I feel the opposite about my 2024 High Velocity paint. I have yet to find any imperfections in it.

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