Different Lift Methodology = Different Results?

[Maddaw]

Metalcloak is an awesome brand as well! To be honest, our company started almost 20 years ago in 2001 and for the most part, grew and spread by word of mouth primarily, so I don't doubt that there are many areas where our name hasn't quite reached yet! It wasn't until recently that we decided it was time to start showcasing what we had to offer to a larger audience online. As Jeep and wheeling enthusiasts, our goal was always to improve upon the already strong foundation Jeep had built by offering the absolute best solution possible for somebody that wanted the best of everything when it came to their Jeeps suspension. Off-road capability, on-road comfort, the ability to handle heavy payloads and equipment, we want you to have it all! Our company has never been about reinventing the wheel, we're about perfecting what works, fixing what doesn't, and providing peace of mind with 100% Made-In-The-USA parts and materials and a lifetime warranty! Always happy to talk more or answer any questions you have about our products if you are interested, but either way you are not making a bad choice

Is there a minimum backspacing requirement for the Clayton Overland lift Kits? I was not able to find the info on the website. The reason I ask is that I purchased AEV wheels with a 5.77" BS before I even considered looking at lifts. A lot of the lifts I look at require a 4.5" or less BS. This leaves me with options of an AEV lift, wheel spacers, or new wheels. None of which I really want to do. I love the wheels and the minimal poke that they have and my brain cannot process adding a 2.5" lift only to lose the ground clearance with correction brackets. I just can't understand how the AEV lift works with the wheels but most others will not.

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[Clayton Off Road]

Is there a minimum backspacing requirement for the Clayton Overland lift Kits? I was not able to find the info on the website. The reason I ask is that I purchased AEV wheels with a 5.77" BS before I even considered looking at lifts. A lot of the lifts I look at require a 4.5" or less BS. This leaves me with options of an AEV lift, wheel spacers, or new wheels. None of which I really want to do. I love the wheels and the minimal poke that they have and my brain cannot process adding a 2.5" lift only to lose the ground clearance with correction brackets. I just can't understand how the AEV lift works with the wheels but most others will not.

It's because those kits utilize factory arms with relocation brackets. Our kits have a recommended backspacing of 4.5 to 4.75, or 4.75 to 5 if you have a Rubicon with the wider axles. We did have one customer who was on this forum a while ago who had a JT with max tow, and ran our lift and AEV wheels with what he stated was minimal rubbing, so those wider axles really do help. Alternatively, I'm not sure what size tires you were planning on running but if you were only planning on running 35's or even better something that is 11.5" wide you probably would hardly have any issues.

 

[Maddaw]

It's because those kits utilize factory arms with relocation brackets. Our kits have a recommended backspacing of 4.5 to 4.75, or 4.75 to 5 if you have a Rubicon with the wider axles. We did have one customer who was on this forum a while ago who had a JT with max tow, and ran our lift and AEV wheels with what he stated was minimal rubbing, so those wider axles really do help. Alternatively, I'm not sure what size tires you were planning on running but if you were only planning on running 35's or even better something that is 11.5" wide you probably would hardly have any issues.

Thanks for the info about the control arms. I have not had any other company offer me a reason or the location of the rubbing issues. I am currently running 35"x12.5 and do not have max tow so sounds like I am down to adding a 1.5" spacer so I can run the Clayton lift that I actually want. Thanks again.

 

[Binfordtools]

Just my two cents...I happen to know a couple of the Engineers at AEV. Both of them were ex-Chrysler (back when they were called that still) working on Wrangler programs, both are total Jeep fanatics. I've been to Moab and a few Jeep Jamboree's with them and I can attest that they are not your typical "sitting behind the desk" type of Engineers. Both have some serious off-road credentials and that translates right back into the design of their products.

 

[mx5red]

Thanks for the info about the control arms. I have not had any other company offer me a reason or the location of the rubbing issues. I am currently running 35"x12.5 and do not have max tow so sounds like I am down to adding a 1.5" spacer so I can run the Clayton lift that I actually want. Thanks again.

I was gonna say, might be worth adding some wheel spacers. they'd poke out a little more but could be a good compromise.

 

[Renegade]

Thanks for the info about the control arms. I have not had any other company offer me a reason or the location of the rubbing issues. I am currently running 35"x12.5 and do not have max tow so sounds like I am down to adding a 1.5" spacer so I can run the Clayton lift that I actually want. Thanks again.

You might search the JL forum for someone else running the combo you are looking to run. The reason the MetalCloak lifts require more backspacing is that their lower shock mounts put the shock outboard of the factory location. Rock Krawler lifts require more because their arms have a ground clearance bend, but not a tire clearance bend. I know you can run 37x12.50s on Rubicons with AEV wheels and stock control arms. I think it will be close on a Sport/Overland, but they may work with 35s.
https://www.jlwranglerforums.com/forum/threads/aev-borah-wheels-on-jl.21702/
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[KurtP]

@Maddaw My truck has AEV wheels, a full @Clayton Off Road control arm kit, 37s, AEV geometry brackets. No rub so far at full lock.

Have not dont full lock and full stuff yet; but i dont expect an issue. I think my axles are wider though, if you arent max tow

 

[Maddaw]

@Maddaw My truck has AEV wheels, a full @Clayton Off Road control arm kit, 37s, AEV geometry brackets. No rub so far at full lock.

Have not dont full lock and full stuff yet; but i dont expect an issue. I think my axles are wider though, if you arent max tow

Good to know. You do have wider axels since in my purchasing excitement "tow package" turned out to not be "max tow". Insert delayed profanities and dad noises here. Either way I don't think there would be an issue on road. Pretty sure the rubbing starts at full stuff/droop at full steering lock if you can get that far. It may end up being not that bad and I live with it.
Anyway, I am thinking about doing this in stages. Start with ride height+ since it uses factory lca's. Test for a while then add the rest of the Clayton control arms later, repeat test. Worst case I need to install spacers.

 

[KurtP]

Good to know. You do have wider axels since in my purchasing excitement "tow package" turned out to not be "max tow". Insert delayed profanities and dad noises here. Either way I don't think there would be an issue on road. Pretty sure the rubbing starts at full stuff/droop at full steering lock if you can get that far. It may end up being not that bad and I live with it.
Anyway, I am thinking about doing this in stages. Start with ride height+ since it uses factory lca's. Test for a while then add the rest of the Clayton control arms later, repeat test. Worst case I need to install spacers.

Sounds good. Just keep an eye on your caster if you dont do brackets/lca’s.... good luck!

 

[Maddaw]

Sounds good. Just keep an eye on your caster if you dont do brackets/lca’s.... good luck!

Shouldn't be an issue. Probably only going with a 2.5" lift because I am married. Apparantly l am not allowed to argue that size matters?. The ride height+ comes with adjustable upper arms so the caster and pinion angle should be ok until I install lca's.

 

[KurtP]

Shouldn't be an issue. Probably only going with a 2.5" lift because I am married. Apparantly l am not allowed to argue that size matters?. The ride height+ comes with adjustable upper arms so the caster and pinion angle should be ok until I install lca's.

Hahaha have her talk to my woman. She’s a total size queen.

Honestly, 2.5” lift and 35’s is pretty good. Dont get me wrong, i totally dig my jeep as it sits, but i should have gone one size down across the board.

 

[aevgladitorrubi]

This was originally posted in another thread but I thought it may warrant its own considering I want to talk about many different lifts.

I have decided not to rush into lifting my truck but the end goal is 2"-2.5" w/ 35s on my Sport S 6mt. My truck is my daily driver first and foremost but is also used to haul mulch for my yard in the spring, load up the bed with home depot supplies for house projects, and then....take me off road and camping in places like Imogene Pass CO. Taking all of this into consideration I have found a few lift kits that have caught my eye for my needs and similar in cost (money is also a consideration for me).

1. MOPAR lift: 2" fixed LCAs, no track bars, linear rate springs, comes with Fox 2.0
MOPAR 2"

2. Rusty's 2" Basic: Adjustable LCAs, front and rear adjustable track bars, dual rate progressive springs by Eibach (will pair w/ Fox 2.0)
Rusty's 2"

3. Clayton 2.5" ride right: Adjustable UCAs, adj front and rear track bars, linear front springs and triple rate rear springs (will pair w/ Fox 2.0)
Clayton 2.5"

4. AEV 2.5" Dualsport: Control Arm relocation brackets, track bar relocation brackets, triple rate coils springs, Bilstein shocks, rear driveshaft shims
AEV 2.5"

It's a little bizarre to me that there are so many different ways of achieving the same goal: compliant street ride, more flex offroad, and bigger tires. Not one of these manufacturers take the same approach to making that happen but they all seem fairly high quality.

After actually reading through AEVs site and the install instructions it seems to me there was rational for everything they chose to do (even a small spring spacer for the front right because there is more weight on that side of the vehicle). I had initially wrote off this system but after reading through the product page it may be at the top of my list, even though I am not psyched about their shock choice.

I know this is super long winded but I am hoping for some conversation about the kits listed above as I think they should be a consideration for anyone in the market for a 2" suspension kit for under $2k. I would love to hear from anyone with some expertise that can dissect why some companies choose linear vs double and triple rate springs, adj UCA's vs adj and fixed LCA's vs brackets, etc. Thanks for reading

Buy the kit that matches what you do with the vehicle, not the other way around. I.E.-- if you spend 80-90% time on-road, not off road, don't buy a kit for the opposite.

 

[RodRecket]

I'm bringing this back up to answer my own question: I went with a MOPAR frankenlift.

MOPAR 2" lift
1" Teraflex spacer
JKS swaybar discos
Teraflex adj front trackbar
EVO adj rear trackbar
AEV geo correction brackets (stock control arms)
Rockjock rear carrier bearing
AEV salta xr wheels w/ 35/11.5r17 no rub yet

...and added a Fox TS steering stab

I'm happy with the ride. Angles are all in check, tracks well, handles well.

 

[j.o.y.ride]

Huge differences in how it's measured.

I believe mopar is measuring vs the stock vehicle. Add a bunch of steel parts like sliders or bumpers or bed rack and any lift comes down some, but if your max was 2" you won't be left with much if you add a bunch of weight.

Also, when you add the weight and bring it down your caster angle will change. The adjustable kits let you dial in for your own vehicle.

Clayton is setup to result in stated lift height on the Rubicon model with added weight. I started with that 2.5" on mine and it was closer to 4" initially on a non Rubicon model. That would be about 3" on the Rubicon straight up, and about 2.5" with added weight.

 

[aevgladitorrubi]

I think I commented on your last thread and will throw in my 2 cents again for MetalCloak...I think we all love or hate lifts that we choose for our rigs. I don't have experience with Rusty's or Clayton or Mopar or AEV, but I did have a MC lift on my JKR and loved it. They are pricey, but there was zero on road compromise. The ride was better than stock. I'm sure Clayton has a great product, but when I was in my JK and talking to other guys building Jeeps, they weren't talked about much in my circles and I can include Jeep forums in that experience, so I never even looked at them...but back in 2012-2013 when I was building my JK, everyone was talking about MetalCloak. When I am ready to lift my truck, I will go with MC unless I can learn more about Clayton and they change me mind...to me, the Mopar lift is nothing but a budget boost.

You need a new Circle-- Clayton is brought up all the time in every top lift company conversation that I hear...

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