8 Speed Auto Transmission slipping problems at 13,000 miles (3rd time in for repairs)

[ShadowsPapa]

There are many variants of 8HP. But your gasser does not carry the 8HP75. And it is not made by ZF.

Where did I say it did get the 8HP75
I know the 3.6 gets a different transmission than the diesel. There are books-worth of information out there about each, the gear ratios, the max torque ratings and so on.

3.6 Pentastar - yes including mine - gets a 850RE - it's on my build information as I recall
3.0 EcoDiesel gets 8HP75
8 simply means 8 speed
I suspect the 50 is for 500 pound/ft torque and the 75 is for 750 pound/ft of torque

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[Maximus Gladius]

I could only wish that all of us who are experiencing early transmission failure would get an oil analysis done BEFORE anything is done.

I did 2 reports. First at 24k kms and second at 32k kms where it died.
-1. First shows glycol from the factory assembly and extreme abnormal numbers for copper, iron and sodium. Lab comment ALERT: change oil and filter.
-2. Complete flush done, Chrysler code compliant for 850RE transmission Amsoil Signature Series Fuel Efficient ATF installed.
-3. Second analysis report 8k later at first transmission ESS code P1B14-00 (PARK BY WIRE, UNINTENDED PARK POSITION) won’t come out of park mode, - report shows NO glycol present but again, extreme abnormal copper and iron. Sodium not highlighted. Lab comment ALERT: change oil and filter.
4. Chrysler VOIDS warranty and blames my use of AMSOIL in transmission then unilaterally voids my entire drivetrain warranty for choosing AMSOIL over MOPAR.
5. AMSOIL legal department now involved.
6. I’ve cited District Service Manager for malice and for contravening and violating my legal rights to use a lubricant that meets or exceeds manufacture recommended oils and for contravening Canada’s Consumer Protection Act and America’s Magnuson Moss Act.

That’s where she sits today.

 

[Minty JL]

I could only wish that all of us who are experiencing early transmission failure would get an oil analysis done BEFORE anything is done.

I did 2 reports. First at 24k kms and second at 32k kms where it died.
-1. First shows glycol from the factory assembly and extreme abnormal numbers for copper, iron and sodium. Lab comment ALERT: change oil and filter.
-2. Complete flush done, Chrysler code compliant for 850RE transmission Amsoil Signature Series Fuel Efficient ATF installed.
-3. Second analysis report 8k later at first transmission ESS code P1B14-00 (PARK BY WIRE, UNINTENDED PARK POSITION) won’t come out of park mode, - report shows NO glycol present but again, extreme abnormal copper and iron. Sodium not highlighted. Lab comment ALERT: change oil and filter.
4. Chrysler VOIDS warranty and blames my use of AMSOIL in transmission then unilaterally voids my entire drivetrain warranty for choosing AMSOIL over MOPAR.
5. AMSOIL legal department now involved.
6. I’ve cited District Service Manager for malice and for contravening and violating my legal rights to use a lubricant that meets or exceeds manufacture recommended oils and for contravening Canada’s Consumer Protection Act and America’s Magnuson Moss Act.

That’s where she sits today.

Wow, can't wait to hear how this pans out (seriously).

Many techs around the nation are claiming manufactures are cutting corners and using shitty bottom of the barrel fluids in brand new cars/trucks. I watched this one tech do a front and rear differential service on a 25,000 mile Jeep.........the fluid was black AF. It was a DD/mall crawler........spotless.

My '19 JLUR only has 15k on it (bought brand new) next month I will do DOT3, transmission (fluid/filter), transfer case and front & rear differential fluids.........cheap insurance so I do not have to F with the dealer BS.

I've been using Royal Purple fluids for over 10 years and have never had a problem whether a DD, racetruck or my old 300k Yukon bush beater.

 

[rharr]

I could only wish that all of us who are experiencing early transmission failure would get an oil analysis done BEFORE anything is done.

I did 2 reports. First at 24k kms and second at 32k kms where it died.
-1. First shows glycol from the factory assembly and extreme abnormal numbers for copper, iron and sodium. Lab comment ALERT: change oil and filter.
-2. Complete flush done, Chrysler code compliant for 850RE transmission Amsoil Signature Series Fuel Efficient ATF installed.
-3. Second analysis report 8k later at first transmission ESS code P1B14-00 (PARK BY WIRE, UNINTENDED PARK POSITION) won’t come out of park mode, - report shows NO glycol present but again, extreme abnormal copper and iron. Sodium not highlighted. Lab comment ALERT: change oil and filter.
4. Chrysler VOIDS warranty and blames my use of AMSOIL in transmission then unilaterally voids my entire drivetrain warranty for choosing AMSOIL over MOPAR.
5. AMSOIL legal department now involved.
6. I’ve cited District Service Manager for malice and for contravening and violating my legal rights to use a lubricant that meets or exceeds manufacture recommended oils and for contravening Canada’s Consumer Protection Act and America’s Magnuson Moss Act.

That’s where she sits today.

You may want to repost this in your thread about your trans fluid change as a FYI.

 

[Maximus Gladius]

You may want to repost this in your thread about your trans fluid change as a FYI.

Thanks for that, I did post it. I did not mean to take over this thread and apologize. After reading here that we’ve got some trannys acting up so early and now mine is dead at 32k kms, 1. We all should do an oil analysis on the tranny, but don’t stop there! Do all units on the truck. 2. We may just have a glycol problem from the factory. You won’t know, if you don’t look.

 

[ShadowsPapa]

For engine oil and hypoid gear lube I don't pay a lot of attention to the color. It's all over the internet with some reading that very dark may not mean squat.
Automatic transmissions that is a different animal. There aren't additives that turn dark with heat, it's very different in structure and additives. But engine oil or hypoid lube color can be very deceiving.

I just wonder how I've gotten by all of these years with zero failures of any drivetrain component - never a differential failure, never a transmission issue, never an engine failure.
And for the most part - I've always used fluids that meet factory specs and sometimes use their own fluids (depending) I use off-the-shelf stuff that meets factory specs.

 

[DAVECS1]

It was clear me that there was excessive material in the oil analysis when he first showed it. So much so, I jaust assumed it had to be collect break in debris in the pan that has been captured by the filter. Of it was a normal pan, I would of automatically said the transmission was shot. His second analysis after the flush proves that, it was not breakin material. It shows on of two things. The new oil slowed the destruction, or most of the destruction was done before the flush.

 

[ilovebikes99]

In theory, you can beat it easily. Get a certified shop to record entire process of disassembly and disassemble the transmission. Then you just have to prove your oil wasn't the one that did the damage. Being that the damage was done in 6000 miles, it's highly unlikely damage could have been done during that time even with out of spec oil.
Also, keep in mind these guys you're dealing with are very low level. Their job is to shaft you. You need to knock on an executive's door with a medium sized hammer, so he hears it well. Their doors are thick.

 

[ShadowsPapa]

Thanks for that, I did post it. I did not mean to take over this thread and apologize. After reading here that we’ve got some trannys acting up so early and now mine is dead at 32k kms, 1. We all should do an oil analysis on the tranny, but don’t stop there! Do all units on the truck. 2. We may just have a glycol problem from the factory. You won’t know, if you don’t look.

You did a great job of documenting things. That's one if the biggest issues when trying to get people to comply with rules and laws. Too often it was "I think with did this twice last year" - no dates, no numbers, no miles, no specifics. They get ripped to shreds.
Since you have analysis from certified lab, you have miles, dates, products and more - it will exhaust you, it will take time, but you have evidence on your side. And from what I've seen, have stayed factual and not getting off track ranting like an angry person running on pure emotion.
I'm about to the point of wanting to have engine oil and transmission fluid analyzed myself - just for baseline if no other reason, but I'm curious as heck, too!

 

[Gladman]

In theory, you can beat it easily. Get a certified shop to record entire process of disassembly and disassemble the transmission. Then you just have to prove your oil wasn't the one that did the damage. Being that the damage was done in 6000 miles, it's highly unlikely damage could have been done during that time even with out of spec oil.
Also, keep in mind these guys you're dealing with are very low level. Their job is to shaft you. You need to knock on an executive's door with a medium sized hammer, so he hears it well. Their doors are thick.

He does not have to prove anything. Under the laws already quoted here it is up to Stellantis to prove the oils did the damage. Call them out on it and demand a full engineering analysis with complete details of the failure, and how the oil caused the failure.
Get together with Amsoil and share the report with them IF, and it is a big IF, Stellantis takes it that far. It will cost them many times more to produce that report than to replace your transmission.

 

[ShadowsPapa]

He does not have to prove anything. Under the laws already quoted here it is up to Stellantis to prove the oils did the damage. Call them out on it and demand a full engineering analysis with complete details of the failure, and how the oil caused the failure.
Get together with Amsoil and share the report with them IF, and it is a big IF, Stellantis takes it that far. It will cost them many times more to produce that report than to replace your transmission.

AMSOIL is already standing at attention, hackles raised.
All that has to be done is show it meets or exceeds specs (easy-peasy and Amsoil will be proud and happy to do that)
He's in Canada but their laws will be on his side as well.

I know how he's got things documented - I think he can sit back and relax a bit. It's written up almost like an attorney might do it from what I've seen.
No need to take it apart, no need for any outside anything.
Few people would have the ammo he's already got in the way of records and the side of right. He more than maintained it, he exceeded intervals, he used compliant fluids.
In a way it would be interesting to see the Amsoil folks duke it out with Jeep.

 

[Gladman]

AMSOIL is already standing at attention, hackles raised.
All that has to be done is show it meets or exceeds specs (easy-peasy and Amsoil will be proud and happy to do that)
He's in Canada but their laws will be on his side as well.

I know how he's got things documented - I think he can sit back and relax a bit. It's written up almost like an attorney might do it from what I've seen.
No need to take it apart, no need for any outside anything.
Few people would have the ammo he's already got in the way of records and the side of right. He more than maintained it, he exceeded intervals, he used compliant fluids.
In a way it would be interesting to see the Amsoil folks duke it out with Jeep.

Yes, it would be interesting to see that, however I think Jeep will back-off and not want to go down that road. It will be very expensive for them compared to the cost of a transmission.

 

[Maximus Gladius]

AMSOIL has asked today for a hard copy on letterhead from Chrysler of the warranty restriction and for reason of restriction.

Dealership has now asked the District Service Manager to provide the letter as they don’t want to write right.

 

[ShadowsPapa]

AMSOIL has asked today for a hard copy on letterhead from Chrysler of the warranty restriction and for reason of restriction.

Dealership has now asked the District Service Manager to provide the letter as they don’t want to write right.

AMSOIL has a vested interest in the outcome of this........ Love it!

 

[IslandFalconer]

Here’s what I know, I have the ZF 8 speed in two vehicles. My Gladiator, and it works fairly well.
im not super impressed by the shift points and programming. And it avoids 8th like the plague.
than in my BMW X4M, in that car it’s a beast. Shifts like a race car, downshifts like a race car, and behave like it should. You can tell how different programming parameters make a huge difference.
and for the sake of comparison Jeep Gladiator 285, BMW X4M 475. That’s nearly 200 hp more than the Jeep, and the transmission handles it just fine. My guess is bad valve body, but at this point planetary clutch is probably toast. Hopefully you get a new transmission and you‘re good to go

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