Installed the Midland MXT500 GMRS radio and their Ghost 3db antenna

[doc-ketamine]

Finally got time to install the Midland MXT500 GMRS radio and their MXTA25 Ghost 3db antenna. Prior to this I was using handhelds (Baofeng UV-5R then the 8W version of that, the 9S). The handhelds are fantastic and I plan to use the 9S out of the truck, loan to friends etc. But I was getting some bad static with the handhelds unless I held them out the window, no matter if anyone was translating or even in the vicinity of me. I figure the cab, or the Hotheads Soundassassin foil, or the Armorlite, etc all combined to make some sort of signal block - as the interference always went away when I held the handheld out the window.

Anyway, the real reason I installed a mounted unit was because it’s cool and I like installing tech.

So I mounted it to the console in the passenger well, and used the Magnetic Mic mount attached to my 67designs / Vector Off-Road E-dock setup. Very happy with how everything came out.

I connected power to AUX3 as the leads were right there, and I had read that the power should route separate from the antenna cable. The antenna cable ran up the door frame and out the A-pillar, under the hood. Used the Midland MXTA27 universal lip mount.

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[Jabtano]

Oh I like that set up. I'm thinking of getting the Anvil bar

 

[rharr]

how does the ghost work, mine (275 setup) does not do very good, when reaching out the my UV-5R a few miles from home. I can hear the 5R but the 5R can't hear the 275 w/ ghost. I haven't tried switch antennas yet to see if it helps .

 

[doc-ketamine]

how does the ghost work, mine (275 setup) does not do very good, when reaching out the my UV-5R a few miles from home. I can hear the 5R but the 5R can't hear the 275 w/ ghost. I haven't tried switch antennas yet to see if it helps .

I haven’t done any real testing yet, will need to wait until I can get a buddy to visit. There are some stellar reviews and some other reviews saying the stubby antennae are crap. I figure it was worth the money to try it out for myself, can always swap for the 6db whip.

 

[Sportsbiz]

Where did you run your ground wire? I’d like to mount my Midland MXT275 similarly.

 

[doc-ketamine]

I took off the trim panel on the passenger foot area in the cockpit - there are two good ground points there. It’s best to take off the trim and take off the connector for the door sensors but I’d managed to do it with lots of swearing and skinned knuckles in the past. This time I took off the trim and had a lot less swearing.

 

[gouacats]

how does the ghost work, mine (275 setup) does not do very good, when reaching out the my UV-5R a few miles from home. I can hear the 5R but the 5R can't hear the 275 w/ ghost. I haven't tried switch antennas yet to see if it helps .

Mine is the same...doesn't work very well with my 275. I basically use it when I'm not on the trail because I like the look better. When I'm actually planning on using it, I'll put on one of their 6DB antennas. It works much better.

 

[rharr]

Mine is the same...doesn't work very well with my 275. I basically use it when I'm not on the trail because I like the look better. When I'm actually planning on using it, I'll put on one of their 6DB antennas. It works much better.

You a Tucson guy? U of A?

 

[gouacats]

You a Tucson guy? U of A?

Yep! Bear Down!

 

[rharr]

i might have to hit you up to test and tune GMRS radios. I am the white JT with the white cap on the back floating around central tucson

 

[steelponycowboy]

how does the ghost work, mine (275 setup) does not do very good, when reaching out the my UV-5R a few miles from home. I can hear the 5R but the 5R can't hear the 275 w/ ghost. I haven't tried switch antennas yet to see if it helps .

The Ghost Antenna as mounted sends most of the transmit signal to the front and very little to the rear as the signal is being blocked by the Jeep behind it. Ghost antenna is a great antenna if it is mounted high on the vehicle without ANY obstructions.

As shown, the superoir performance of the MXT500 and even your MXT275 is not able to work to it's potential because the signal to the back is being blocked by the Jeep and everything in it.

Being very familiar with radios, etc for 50years, the antenna (quality) and where it is mounted is critical to maximum range.

Years ago I could not hit a repeater with my 100 watt Ham radio because my 36" whip antenna was mounted on a ditch light mount on my Jeep. The repeater was only 20 miles away. I moved the antenna to the top of my light bar mount and problem was fixed.

Many people think the height of the antenna matters but it doesn't. The whip assists with reception but the power is radiated from the coil at the base of the antenna. If that base is obstructed, the distance of your transmissions is severelty affected in areas behind the obstruction.

Midland does make a few top loaded antennas such as their MXAT04VP Highland Tall Antenna, a 6.6 DB Gain HD Bull Bar antenna. Serious Overlanders worldwide use Bull Bar Antennas but beware NOT all Bull Bar antennas are created the same, the cheap Asian brand bull bars will not perform the same as the Midland bull bar. It's pricey but you get what you pay for. If you are going to spend $400 on a top line 50 watt GMRS radio, you should do it justice with a top line GMRS antenna, https://midlandusa.com/collections/...cts/mxat04vp-6-6db-heavy-duty-bullbar-antenna

 

[steelponycowboy]

i might have to hit you up to test and tune GMRS radios. I am the white JT with the white cap on the back floating around central tucson

Stop at the Midland booth near the entrance of the Overland Expo West in Flagstaff every May. You can see and have antenna dynamics explained to you along with how and where to mount on your Jeep. https://www.overlandexpo.com/west/

Midland will be at the CA Overland and Powersports show next weekend (April 12 & 13) in Pomona at the fairgrounds for our CA friends. https://caoverlandadv.com/pomona/

 

[Radio Guy]

The Ghost Antenna as mounted sends most of the transmit signal to the front and very little to the rear as the signal is being blocked by the Jeep behind it. Ghost antenna is a great antenna if it is mounted high on the vehicle without ANY obstructions.

As shown, the superoir performance of the MXT500 and even your MXT275 is not able to work to it's potential because the signal to the back is being blocked by the Jeep and everything in it.

Being very familiar with radios, etc for 50years, the antenna (quality) and where it is mounted is critical to maximum range.

Years ago I could not hit a repeater with my 100 watt Ham radio because my 36" whip antenna was mounted on a ditch light mount on my Jeep. The repeater was only 20 miles away. I moved the antenna to the top of my light bar mount and problem was fixed.

Many people think the height of the antenna matters but it doesn't. The whip assists with reception but the power is radiated from the coil at the base of the antenna. If that base is obstructed, the distance of your transmissions is severelty affected in areas behind the obstruction.

Midland does make a few top loaded antennas such as their MXAT04VP Highland Tall Antenna, a 6.6 DB Gain HD Bull Bar antenna. Serious Overlanders worldwide use Bull Bar Antennas but beware NOT all Bull Bar antennas are created the same, the cheap Asian brand bull bars will not perform the same as the Midland bull bar. It's pricey but you get what you pay for. If you are going to spend $400 on a top line 50 watt GMRS radio, you should do it justice with a top line GMRS antenna, https://midlandusa.com/collections/...cts/mxat04vp-6-6db-heavy-duty-bullbar-antenna

Most of the entire upper part of a Gladiator is fiberglass and transparent to RF except for the thin steel A pillars and top windshield frame, but the windshield opening is very large in wavelength at UHF and not a problem. A hood mounted UHF antenna works very well on a Gladiator, I've done extensive testing and in my opinion a trunk lip mount on the hood is the easiest way to get good performance for little effort. This install looks great.

On RF radiating off the coil of an antenna, that is not how antennas work. On a full length 1/4 wave antenna, which is only 6" long at UHF or GMRS and has no coil, most of the radiation is off the lower 1/3 or so of the whip. The Midland and similar ghost antennas are shortened mostly from being fat but some are a short spring shape under the plastic and electrically a 1/4 wave which will also radiate mostly from the lower portion but that has nothing to do with being a coil. For any other antenna the maximum radiation will be higher on the whip like a 1/2 wave whip will radiate mostly from the center area and a 3ft tall stacked 5/8 over 5/8 UHF whip will radiate in two discreet areas of both the lower section of the bottom whip and lower section of the top whip. A base loaded CB antenna will not radiate much at all off the actual coil in the base but mostly off the lower portion of the whip. The coil on most any antenna is an area of least radiation and maximum radiation is where RF current is the highest in the whip, which will vary depending on what fraction of a wavelength it is.

In my area I can get in excess of 100mi to mountain top repeaters, some of which I own and easily 20+ mi simplex down the highway to a similar equipped vehicle on both VHF and UHF. Yes the top of the roof would provide even greater range but its all fiberglass or cloth up there and you would have to install a lot of sheet metal for a ground plane to pull it off. Stick with a hood mount antenna unless you want to start a real project.

On that 6.6dB gain bullbar antenna, it takes about 8ft of antenna to reach 6dBd gain at UHF so how are they getting 6.6dB gain in a 47 inch tall antenna? They are not and instead are making up their own numbers to sell antennas. The most efficient omni design for UHF is four exposed stacked 1/2 wave dipoles around a single mast and that is about ft tall at UHF. A stacked collinear with 6dBd gain is even taller. A stacked 5/8 over 5/8 whip which is about 3ft tall is around 3dBd gain but Midland claims something like 5dB which would be dBi gain and not dBd.

Bottom line is much of the consumer antenna industry lies or makes up gain figures including Midland. On the commercial side the major antenna mfrs usually advertise realistic gain figures and specify dBm or dBi to avoid confusion, or they are out of business as communications engineers designing repeater sites or cell systems will know better.

 

[steelponycowboy]

It all sounds good so why so many complaints by users about low mounted Ghost antennas? My club has 7 years experience with over 200 radios and the Ghosts mounted as shown have no real distance to the rear. The glass might be transparent to the signal but wveryitbg else in the Jeep is not. We've real world tested from Moab to Mexco to the high Sierras. While the fiberglass roof is a challenge any antenna mounted up high is better than one mounted on the hood. Anyone that does that move will tell you range difference is like night and day

 

[Radio Guy]

It all sounds good so why so many complaints by users about low mounted Ghost antennas? My club has 7 years experience with over 200 radios and the Ghosts mounted as shown have no real distance to the rear. The glass might be transparent to the signal but wveryitbg else in the Jeep is not. We've real world tested from Moab to Mexco to the high Sierras. While the fiberglass roof is a challenge any antenna mounted up high is better than one mounted on the hood. Anyone that does that move will tell you range difference is like night and day

Many if not most people mount the ghost antenna on a bracket that sticks out between the front fender and hood at the side of the cowl placing the antenna nearly 6" below hood line. That will severally distort the radiation pattern and there is no ground plane under the antenna and all of that adds up to poor performance and limited range. But some still do ok with that setup. I always recommend a high quality commercial brand (not Midland) of NMO trunk lip mount on the hood near a hood hinge on a Gladiator. Its a proven good spot.

Personally I would never recommend a ghost antenna as its worse performing than a 6" tall thin flexible 1/4 wave whip at UHF and the whip is a lot more durable. I've done actual antenna range testing with a directional wide band log periodic source antenna pointed at the antennas under test recording precise differences in gain on a Vector Network Analyzer using my Gladiator Mojave as the test bed comparing most of the commercial tri-band police/public service antennas on the market today plus a few ham antennas. A trunk lip mount on the Gladiator hood near the hood hinges performs a little better than the same antenna on most trunk lids, partially because the upper part of a Gladiator is fiberglass and doesn't block much at radio frequencies. The hood is also much larger than most trunk lids providing a good ground plane.

I've done some experimenting with sheet metal and a mag mount on my Gladiator roof and with a temporary mount on my roof level bed rack and getting the antenna up at roof level is noticeably better, but not practical for many Gladiator owners. Its a lot of work to provide a ground plane up there and a bed rack by itself does not have enough flat surface area to provide a good ground plane in most cases. Its better at UHF but for those installing a CB or 2m amateur rig those antennas need much more ground plane than a couple inch wide horizontal bar of metal on a typical bed rack can provide. Bottom line is yes we can do better antenna on a Gladiator than the hood but its not within the scope of what most owners can or are willing to do.

I own several repeaters on hill tops and mountain tops and am constantly range testing antennas at a distance and comparing them and also to friends setups with roof mount, trunk lid mount and many other mounting locations. My hood mounted Gladiator antenna hangs in there with the best of my friends setups with their antennas mounted in more favorable locations. From one of the repeaters at my house on the side of a hill at about 350ft HAAT, I can get out to about 75 to 80mi at UHF before things finally fizz out. That kind of range from an antenna mounted about 15ft off the ground is noteworthy. Talking from my Gladiator to other repeater sites on mountain tops I have not yet found the maximum range in some directions as I haven't driven far enough, but its well in excess of 100mi on both VHF and UHF.

My typical setup for GMRS is a Harris XG-100M radio into various VHF/UHF/700/800 multiband antennas which are all 1/4 wave equivalent on all bands including the Larsen Tri-band, PCTEL BMAXSCAN1000, Tram 8079 and a couple others from Sti-Co and Comtel. (I change some antennas as often as I change my socks). For 2/70cm amateur I use a Yaesu FTM-400DR into a dual band Larsen NMO2/70B, both hood mounted. BTW, the Larsen NMO 2/70B is a really big, good performing antenna no matter what you stick it on. My Gladiator is one of many vehicles I've used as an antenna testbed with most others having permanent roof mounts with lots of flat ground plane available. The Gladiator hood works surprisingly well compared to some of my previous setups. I'm all for the very best performance I can squeeze out of an installation and I've done some pretty insane things to get there but I'm happy enough with my two top of hood mounted antennas to be satisfied at the moment.

I might add that antennas have been a focus for most of my employment over the last 50yrs and at one point I was the range master for an indoor antenna/RCS range for the largest aerospace company in the US at the time. Part of my job was performing antenna gain and pattern measurements and radar cross section analysis for in house and external customers, most of which I can't discuss. What I'm trying to convey here is I like antennas and I get along really well with them.

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