Death Wobble Factors?

[MojaveMat]

Hey all, looking to get a new wheel/tire combo. I’ve heard some horror stories — what factors do you need to look out for to avoid the death wobble?

Does it mostly have to do with weight and quality of the products? Installation and balancing of tires? Random act of God? Any guidance would be helpful, thanks!

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[charliez]

It can be caused by many things. And each case can be differnt

 

[LouisvEarlleJT]

Balancing/weight play a factor, but making sure all front end components are tight/not failing is how you avoid it.

Large wheels/tires can exacerbate the issue.

Death wobble happens when something is no longer doing it's job to the fullest. As many have said here, the stabilizer just masks the issue.

 

[HooliganActual]

The reality here is that death wobble ultimately has more to do with factors other than your tire/wheel combination. It is typically caused by wear of things like ball joints, rod ends, mounting bolt holes, etc. Larger, heavier wheel/tire combos can exacerbate the situation and potentially speed it up; but that's not a given. I have had a big heavy wheel/tire combo (37" Toyo R/T's on Black Rhino Armory wheels) for 3 years now and no death wobble. But I also regularly check the tightness of the steering components, etc. Eventually, one of those bushings or bearings will wear out and will need to be replaced.

The key to avoiding death wobble is to stay ahead of the maintenance issues...

Buy whatever wheel/tire combo you want and then stay vigilant for worn parts.

 

[MojaveMat]

The reality here is that death wobble ultimately has more to do with factors other than your tire/wheel combination. It is typically caused by wear of things like ball joints, rod ends, mounting bolt holes, etc. Larger, heavier wheel/tire combos can exacerbate the situation and potentially speed it up; but that's not a given. I have had a big heavy wheel/tire combo (37" Toyo R/T's on Black Rhino Armory wheels) for 3 years now and no death wobble. But I also regularly check the tightness of the steering components, etc. Eventually, one of those bushings or bearings will wear out and will need to be replaced.

The key to avoiding death wobble is to stay ahead of the maintenance issues...

Buy whatever wheel/tire combo you want and then stay vigilant for worn parts.

Looking to do something similar — Black Rhino Arsenal on 37s…not sure what tires yet. I’d like a good looking All Terrain. I have 35” wildpeak
M/t now and they look awesome but really not practical. This is a daily drive and I’m on the road 98% of the time.

 

[HooliganActual]

Looking to do something similar — Black Rhino Arsenal on 37s…not sure what tires yet. I’d like a good looking All Terrain. I have 35” wildpeak
M/t now and they look awesome but really not practical. This is a daily drive and I’m on the road 98% of the time.

Personally, I am considering moving from the Toyos (which I love BTW and have on my 2 Wranglers as well) to the BFG KO2's because they are significantly lighter, something like 15# per tire. Any weight you can keep out of the wheel/tire combo will always be beneficial, and for more reasons than just death wobble.

 

[MojaveMat]

Personally, I am considering moving from the Toyos (which I love BTW and have on my 2 Wranglers as well) to the BFG KO2's because they are significantly lighter, something like 15# per tire. Any weight you can keep out of the wheel/tire combo will always be beneficial, and for more reasons than just death wobble.

Wow 15lbs! That’s crazy. I’ll have to take a look those. Do you use a Tazer to adjust cpu calibration? I’ve seen there’s a phone app too…

 

[Ghosts40]

So how hard is it to replace any of these front end component bushings? is this a DIY or something that a shop has to do?

 

[HooliganActual]

Wow 15lbs! That’s crazy. I’ll have to take a look those. Do you use a Tazer to adjust cpu calibration? I’ve seen there’s a phone app too…

Yes, I have the Tazer. Not sure what the phone app is. You will find that there are other tools such as the Jscan, etc. which can do a lot of the same things as the Tazer and there are plenty of benefits with those as well.

Personally, I like the Tazer because I don't really need anything else besides the device itself and it uses the Jeep's dash as it's display/menu. But do yourself a favor, if you decide to get a Tazer make sure you buy the extension cable as it will make installing and removing the Tazer infinitely easier.

 

[HooliganActual]

So how hard is it to replace any of these front end component bushings? is this a DIY or something that a shop has to do?

It's all DIY if you have tools and patience. As an example, if a rod end on your draglink wears out, you can replace the draglink with something better than stock, such as a SteerSmarts draglink. It only takes two bolts to replace. If a ball joint goes out, it's a little more effort and you need a ball joint press (which can be bought on Amazon). 2 months ago I replaced them on my Wrangler and it took about 3 hours per wheel to do the fronts...and I've never done it before. Now, I am mechanically inclined and have worked on my own cars my whole life, just never replaced a ball joint before.

There are YouTube videos that you can watch of people doing any of these parts replacements and then make a judgement call on whether or not you feel it is "within the scope of your course".

Not that I have a distrust of outside mechanics or dealerships, I just get a sense of satisfaction and accomplishment when I do it myself. It helps me understand how the things work and will likely help me in the event I ever need to affect a trail repair.

I'm also retired...so I struggle paying ridiculous shop labor rates while I'm sitting on my duff...LOL

 

[MojaveMat]

Yes, I have the Tazer. Not sure what the phone app is. You will find that there are other tools such as the Jscan, etc. which can do a lot of the same things as the Tazer and there are plenty of benefits with those as well.

Personally, I like the Tazer because I don't really need anything else besides the device itself and it uses the Jeep's dash as it's display/menu. But do yourself a favor, if you decide to get a Tazer make sure you buy the extension cable as it will make installing and removing the Tazer infinitely easier.

Yeah, a buddy uses it on his 392. I just asked him about it — this is the setup he uses, let me know what you think?

OBD JScan App
TTXSPP Cable Adaptor for Chrysler
OBDLink MX+ OBD2 Bluetooth Scanner

He said you do it once and it maintains all of the computer settings without need to be plugged in.

 

[HooliganActual]

Yeah, a buddy uses it on his 392. I just asked him about it — this is the setup he uses, let me know what you think?

OBD JScan App
TTXSPP Cable Adaptor for Chrysler
OBDLink MX+ OBD2 Bluetooth Scanner

He said you do it once and it maintains all of the computer settings without need to be plugged in.

I have no experience with that setup but others here do and like it.

Honestly, it's over the top for what I am doing and way more expensive than what I need just to change the tire size (before someone jumps on me about it, I know that it can do other things but I just don't need to do those other things). I'd rather put that money towards, oh I don't know, new tires, steering upgrades, etc.

@MojaveMat @Ghosts40

I should also note here that a lot of the steering components that tend to fail causing death wobble can be upgraded to much beefier parts which will likely never reach a point where death wobble enters the picture.

You have to remember that the stock components were engineered to provide a realistic service life for a stock vehicle. As soon as you put bigger tires on them, you increase the weight and leverage exerted upon all of those stock components. Then when you take them out to play in the rocks you really make them work. This will likely wear them out faster than if the stock components were only used to crawl to the top level of the mall parking structure.

Personally, when something like a rod end on my tie rod or draglink finally does start to wear out, I'll move to something like the RPM Steering 2.5 Ton Aluminum Steering Kit. The rod ends are rated for a 2.5 Ton application which is waaaaay more heavy duty than the stock parts. Same with things like ball joints...the after market replacement parts are usually way overbuilt and in many cases cost no more than the cheaper stock parts (thanks Jeep/FCA/Stellantis/whatever you call yourself today).

At the end of the day, most of this work can all be done by yourself and replaced with better than stock parts. My strategy is not to simply run out and replace things right now, rather to plan for the eventual upgrade with better components as things wear out. I've done that with both my Wranglers and over the years they now have all new Dynatrac ball joints and full Yeti/SteerSmarts steering setups and Chromoly axle shafts.

 

[Ghosts40]

I have this set up and do like it! Very easy to use and works great! But definitely buy the extension cables, the disconnecting and connecting is the worse part if you dont.

 

[MojaveMat]

I have no experience with that setup but others here do and like it.

Honestly, it's over the top for what I am doing and way more expensive than what I need just to change the tire size (before someone jumps on me about it, I know that it can do other things but I just don't need to do those other things). I'd rather put that money towards, oh I don't know, new tires, steering upgrades, etc.

@MojaveMat @Ghosts40

I should also note here that a lot of the steering components that tend to fail causing death wobble can be upgraded to much beefier parts which will likely never reach a point where death wobble enters the picture.

You have to remember that the stock components were engineered to provide a realistic service life for a stock vehicle. As soon as you put bigger tires on them, you increase the weight and leverage exerted upon all of those stock components. Then when you take them out to play in the rocks you really make them work. This will likely wear them out faster than if the stock components were only used to crawl to the top level of the mall parking structure.

Personally, when something like a rod end on my tie rod or draglink finally does start to wear out, I'll move to something like the RPM Steering 2.5 Ton Aluminum Steering Kit. The rod ends are rated for a 2.5 Ton application which is waaaaay more heavy duty than the stock parts. Same with things like ball joints...the after market replacement parts are usually way overbuilt and in many cases cost no more than the cheaper stock parts (thanks Jeep/FCA/Stellantis/whatever you call yourself today).

At the end of the day, most of this work can all be done by yourself and replaced with better than stock parts. My strategy is not to simply run out and replace things right now, rather to plan for the eventual upgrade with better components as things wear out. I've done that with both my Wranglers and over the years they now have all new Dynatrac ball joints and full Yeti/SteerSmarts steering setups and Chromoly axle shafts.

Thanks for all the info! Super helpful…definitely stuff to keep in mind! My truck only has 12k miles on it and mainly sees pavement so hopefully components should be in good shape. Although, there are some nearby sand dunes and off-road parks that I get to a couple times a year.

 

[Wheelin98TJ]

The inability to control precession is what causes death wobble.

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