Introduction and towing question.

[Jefe1018]

Howdy Jefe1018,

Thanks for your reply. Do you know if the cooling system is increased in the diesel, I have heard about a larger or more powerful electric radiator fan but can find nothing to do with larger radiator or large coolant capacity? I would think that the diesel simply because it's a diesel would come with a larger capacity cooling system but that kind of information if it's out there I haven't found it.

Dave

The diesel does have a heavier duty cooling system than its gas counterpart, but again, space and airflow seem to be the limitation. Many have found the 'limit' at extreme altitudes and hauling heavy loads.

In my experience, I have not had any derating or loss of power.

The Gladiator is not a 'towing rig' like others have said, but implying that the Gladiator diesel is incapable of regularly towing is arsenene in my opinion.

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[mr. cob]

The diesel does have a heavier duty cooling system than its gas counterpart, but again, space and airflow seem to be the limitation. Many have found the 'limit' at extreme altitudes and hauling heavy loads.

In my experience, I have not had any derating or loss of power.

The Gladiator is not a 'towing rig' like others have said, but implying that the Gladiator diesel is incapable of regularly towing is arsenene in my opinion.

Howdy Jefe1018,

Thanks again for your informative and detailed post. I don't plan on using the Gladiator only as a towing vehicle, based on the usage of the vehicle it will be replacing I might drive it 5-6K miles a year and only 10-15% of that would be towing. It's just that where I go it's usually up or down hill for many miles.

I usually travel using the Pete, as tow vehicle it carries a Smart Car, on a deck behind the sleeper and the SxS is carried in the garage of the huge toy hauler. When I am going for a longer distance for an extended period of time this setup works VERY WELL.

What I am looking for is an everyday small truck that I can use to take a trip to the dump, hauls some stuff from the hardware store, or carry small items in the back of and occasionally towing the trailer with the SxS inside for a weekend of camping on the other side of the mountains.

Dave

 

[brianinca]

Seriously, after putting in a full headliner on the JTR, my wife said "hey, the engine sounds pretty good!"

Dial back the tach and the actual performance would be front and center.

I've written this before, but since you are new here I'll say it again.

RPM will not hurt a modern engine. Both Saab and Subaru did record runs back in the 90s where they ran their cars flat out full throttle near redline for THIRTY DAYS and had zero failures in both of their attempts.

I've often said that if Jeep just set the Tachometer in the Gladiator to only show 60% of reality and tuned the transmission to hold lower gears, most people would think their jeep was pretty torquey.

 

[mr. cob]

Seriously, after putting in a full headliner on the JTR, my wife said "hey, the engine sounds pretty good!"

Dial back the tach and the actual performance would be front and center.

Howdy Brian,

Keeping the other half happy is more then half the battle, thanks for your reply.

Dave

 

[dcmdon]

Howdy dcmdon,

Thanks for your reply. Us old dogs are tryin to learn new tricks but it's hard to go against past conditioning based on many a blown engine. I guess my main UNEDUCATED concern is can the engine in the Jeep made by a company in Italy be accurately judged against those made by companies like Saab and Subaru who are known for quality?

Dave

Ha, I get your concern. But I'm no kid. Im 50+++.

I would never try to talk you out of a diesel. I think the only good reason to get one is that you simply WANT one. It drives more effortlessly. It tows more effortlessly . . . right until it derates (cuts its own power) because it is getting too hot. This typically only happens on extended uphills in the summer. So if you live somewhere flat, that's irrelevant. If you want to cross the rockies in July pulling a 5000 lb trailer, it matters.

Go drive both. You may find that you like the diesel so much more that you just want it. And then that's fine.

If you can't find a new one on a dealer's lot, I'm sure there is someone on this forum who isn't more than a couple of hours drive.

you are retired. Go on a road trip and buy the guy lunch. Ha.

 

[mr. cob]

Ha, I get your concern. But I'm no kid. Im 50+++.

I would never try to talk you out of a diesel. I think the only good reason to get one is that you simply WANT one. It drives more effortlessly. It tows more effortlessly . . . right until it derates (cuts its own power) because it is getting too hot. This typically only happens on extended uphills in the summer. So if you live somewhere flat, that's irrelevant. If you want to cross the rockies in July pulling a 5000 lb trailer, it matters.

Go drive both. You may find that you like the diesel so much more that you just want it. And then that's fine.

If you can't find a new one on a dealer's lot, I'm sure there is someone on this forum who isn't more than a couple of hours drive.

you are retired. Go on a road trip and buy the guy lunch. Ha.

Howdy Don,

Thanks for your reply. I must admit that deep down in my polluted heart I have a soft spot for oil burners, kind of a primal thing, no logic to it, it just is. As a retired, ( some would say retarded ) old fart, I no longer have the need for speed that defined my younger years and drained my wallet accordingly so if I have to back off a bit whilst climbing the grades, so be it.

I haven't yet hit the dealer lots, just done a lot of looking as I drive past but driving both will be the thing to do for sure. The last new vehicle I bought was in 2003 when I bought the Dodge Ram 3,500 at that time test drives were easy to do, I have heard, don't know for certain that nowadays you have to make an appointment and in some cases pay to take a test drive. I guess I am just gonna have to get off the couch and slam some doors.

Dave

 

[Jefe1018]

Howdy Jefe1018,

Thanks again for your informative and detailed post. I don't plan on using the Gladiator only as a towing vehicle, based on the usage of the vehicle it will be replacing I might drive it 5-6K miles a year and only 10-15% of that would be towing. It's just that where I go it's usually up or down hill for many miles.

I usually travel using the Pete, as tow vehicle it carries a Smart Car, on a deck behind the sleeper and the SxS is carried in the garage of the huge toy hauler. When I am going for a longer distance for an extended period of time this setup works VERY WELL.

What I am looking for is an everyday small truck that I can use to take a trip to the dump, hauls some stuff from the hardware store, or carry small items in the back of and occasionally towing the trailer with the SxS inside for a weekend of camping on the other side of the mountains.

Dave

For that use case, I wouldn’t hesitate recommending the JT, especially in diesel.

It tows more effortlessly . . . right until it derates (cuts its own power) because it is getting too hot. This typically only happens on extended uphills in the summer. So if you live somewhere flat, that's irrelevant. If you want to cross the rockies in July pulling a 5000 lb trailer, it matters.

I’m curious if you’ve owned a diesel or are going off of discussions on the forum? I haven’t quite had a summer with my JT but it has been in the 90’s and it’s done fine towing about 4,000lbs.

 

[Snake Eyes]

The Gladiator is IMO not a towing rig, even small trailers it is a bit jumpy.
The Diesel overheats, has lower capacity (even the petrol is not comfortable towing 50% the sticker weight in difficult conditions) limits down power and still has issues with the pump as well as the adblue system. On paper it is the better rig.
I just reread your post, you cannot compare the Gladiator petrol vs diesel as you can a F250 petrol vs diesel. Ofcourse the Ram Ford etc Diesel will tow much better, but the Diesel in the Gladiator is more an mpg improvement than a tow improvement. Yes for offroading it is an amazing engine. Put it in 1 and let it go....

If you live in an area were you can fix those issue on your own without running into legal troubles the Diesel can be amazing. Also if that is the truck that makes you happy go for it and screw any advice. Have fun.
For us a no go.

HAve you towed with it? If so I would like to know what size and why it was jumpy.
The Sport S Max Tow gas (petrol in your world) is a towing rig. It is not a wrangler with a bed. The rear is built off the Ram 1500. It has larger cooling, alternator, etc. made for towing. Sure it is not a 1500, 2500 or 3500If. Buy it can tow anything other mid size trucks can tow. Ask all the towing owners on this forum. I guess the same thought process could say that the gladiator is not an off-roader (too long), etc. But it is an off-roader, just maybe not the best. It is a tow rig, just maybe not the best.

 

[Barnaby’sdad]

Have you towed with it? If so I would like to know what size and why it was jumpy.
The Sport S Max Tow is a towing rig. It is not a wrangler with a bed. The rear is built off the Ram 1500. It has larger cooling, alternator, etc. If any other mid size truck can tow, so can the Gladiator. Ask all the towing owners on this forum.

In this scenario (small utility trailers), I don’t think it has anything to do with the tow vehicle. i.e. My 5’ x 8’ utility trailer is somewhere in the 800-900 lb range empty. I can feel the trailer ”jumping” around when it’s empty regardless of what I’m towing it behind, as the weight is nowhere near balanced (steel ramp on the back).

Load it up with a properly balanced payload and it feels just fine. That was my experience towing this trailer behind my Subaru Outback and the Gladiator. This particular trailer “likes” to be loaded, to get a decent ride/tow feel out of it.

 

[Snake Eyes]

In this scenario (small utility trailers), I don’t think it has anything to do with the tow vehicle. i.e. My 5’ x 8’ utility trailer is somewhere in the 800-900 lb range empty. I can feel the trailer ”jumping” around when it’s empty regardless of what I’m towing it behind, as the weight is nowhere near balanced (steel ramp on the back).

Load it up with a properly balanced payload and it feels just fine. That was my experience towing this trailer behind my Subaru Outback and the Gladiator. This particular trailer “likes” to be loaded, to get a decent ride/tow feel out of it.

Completely agree. Nice example Article from MotorTrend….

“During Truck Trend's 2020 Pickup Truck of the Year test, we had the chance to put the Jeep Gladiator to the test while towing a 5,000-pound trailer. The weight was our standard for the midsize truck class, and the vehicle was a Sport S with an automatic transmission and Max Tow package. We tested the truck empirically on a quarter-mile track, and subjectively towing up a tough 6-percent grade. Even with a 20-foot trailer in tow, the Gladiator was unflappable. It towed straight with not even the slightest hint of unacceptable sway. The Gladiator had plenty of power to ascend the grade and adequate brakes for coming back down. Our biggest complaint was found in the lack of a trailer brake controller, even with the Max Tow package added.”

Altitude will affect towing of course in a gasser. Incline also. If someone is going to spend all their time towing across the rockies and western mountain ranges that is a situation that requires a different assessment.

 

[PlayfulBird]

HAve you towed with it? If so I would like to know what size and why it was jumpy.
The Sport S Max Tow gas (petrol in your world) is a towing rig. It is not a wrangler with a bed. The rear is built off the Ram 1500. It has larger cooling, alternator, etc. made for towing. Sure it is not a 1500, 2500 or 3500If. Buy it can tow anything other mid size trucks can tow. Ask all the towing owners on this forum. I guess the same thought process could say that the gladiator is not an off-roader (too long), etc. But it is an off-roader, just maybe not the best. It is a tow rig, just maybe not the best.

You are not wrong. Ofcourse.
In Germany we can only get Launch and Overlands, these only as diesels. We live near Munich and tested them in the mountains.
We had an Overland with about a 2 tonne trailer. 2 problems. We did not load the trailer and the truck was empty. We started on the wet grass and if it had had a bit more tongue weight or something in the bed no issue there. As soon as we hit large climbs I wanted to see how the auto did and if I didn't have it in manual it hunted gears and even at full throttle it did not like going the 100 km/h but slowed to about 85km/h. In manual I had 0 Prroblems with speed but did rev it higher than older Diesels. It didn't not take our power but this was only a 2 hour test and it got very hot. Also this was a year ago. Maybe there have been changes. The Auto etc would be a software thing. Airflow improvements would be amazing.

We decided, to go for a Rubicon imported from the US with the pentastar as they did seem reliable, cheaper to maintain as well as easier not having all modern diesel stuff. Lots of Renegades had issues last winter with the adblue system crystallizing and needing replacement... so maybe inward scarred from that.

We have towed about a 750 kg trailer with it and well it has MT tires which you do notice on the Autobahn. We had about 200kg of gear in the truck bed, the 2 of us plus our giant dog. As soon as I let out a bit of pressure from the wheels it settled and drove fine.
Not being to used to petrol engines, I was concerned that we were driving much higher rpms, it can be noisy, but all temps stayed good. There are a few ruts from large trucks on the Autobahn and the truck did try and follow them. The light trailer was only a little more noticeable coming from a dead stop merging onto the right hand lane. Took a bit more pedal. Also she definitely guzzled noticeably more
We did tow a loaded GC (must also be like 2, something tonnes) from the Garage to the a friends as a favour, it was a little loud and then engine did work, there was a little surging joining the highway. Not sure why.

 

[sass JT]

I’m just stopping by to say hi and welcome… that is all

 

[PlayfulBird]

@mr. cob Honestly having seen Pete and your set up, buy which ever makes you happy. For dumping trips, or quickly towing something it will be fine either way. Also you should just enjoy it.

We love diesels too , just without all the environment gadgets.

I liked the idea of asking in the forum and driving both. First you get to meet cool people, second you get real feel with no one trying to get you to buy it.

 

[mr. cob]

@mr. cob Honestly having seen Pete and your set up, buy which ever makes you happy. For dumping trips, or quickly towing something it will be fine either way. Also you should just enjoy it.

We love diesels too , just without all the environment gadgets.

I liked the idea of asking in the forum and driving both. First you get to meet cool people, second you get real feel with no one trying to get you to buy it.

Howdy PlayfulBird,

I know it costs more money, needs more maintenance, and in my case will never be driven enough to make it to the break even point but I honestly think I would be happier with the diesel. Just wish a person could strip all the epa crap off of it and make it a proper truck.

I am pretty much a computer idiot but I long ago figured out it was smarter to go on a forum and ask questions then to blindly go into something that could be a big mistake down the road. I am going to start looking at truck and do some test drives that's the only way forward at this point.

I found a dealer in Idaho who sells for under msrp, I went to the Jeep web site where you can build a truck, spent hours checking different things until I finally got all the options I wanted, so I have summited that build sheet to the dealer waiting now to see what kind of price it will come to.

The way the build web site works is pretty wonky, I had everything done, my options all picked and decided I wanted the black wheels rather then the standard silver ones, clicked on black wheels and it took the diesel drive train away, another time I clicked on the insulating head liners, that took the diesel option away same with adding the hard folding bed cover, I am ASSUMING it had to do with weight and being able to keep the towing package, can't think of any other reason. I in the end sent in a build sheet for "Sport S" that had everything I wanted that's the only model that worked for me.

Dave

 

[Brekka]

Do not buy the diesel if you tow that load. I own the diesel, have towed that load, and walked away very unhappy. Great truck, bad diesel implementation.

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