Missfires/CEL, extended warranty coverage, Dealer wants to approve $1k for diagnostics

[DrJ]

Trying to keep this brief as I'm currently on hold with service department, thanks in advance!

Had CEL light go off, hesitation with shifting after 5k rpm. P0300, P0301, P0305 codes on my Tazer.

Have noticed engine ticking since as early as I can remember, always seemed underpowered, but I do have 33" tires and heavy black rhino wheels.

I have Maxcare 8yr/125k warranty and currently at ~77k and 5 years so out of powertrain warranty but within my Maxcare.

Plugs were changed at ~30k for another issue with valve timing/missfires.

Vehicle currently at dealer for 2 weeks, they have "been waiting for approval" of diagnostics but have not reached out once.

Get the following from service dept:

Service was pre-approved​

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[Primary]: EN001 : CHECK ENGINE LIGHT OR OTHER WARNING LIGHT: CEL ON IN DASH. ADVISE​

​

​

$1,076.82​

**Check Engine Light DiagnosiS: Customer Has Check Engine Light Concern. VERIFIED CUSTOMERS CONCERN, CHECK ENGINE LIGHT ON AFTER 5K RPM. PERFORMED DATA MONITOR OF MISFIRE COUNTS. FOUND 200 MISFIRE COUNTS ON CYLINDER 1 AND 166 COUNTS ON CYLINDER 5. RECOMMEND INSPECTING SPARK PLUGS, IGNITION COILS, AND PERFORMING COMPRESSION TEST ON ENGINE CYLINDERS.​

When the vehicle's computer senses that there is a problem with some of the components it stores, the corresponding trouble code(s) in its memory light up the "Check Engine" or "Service Engine Soon" light, to tell you that there is a problem and your car needs to be looked at.​

I am told that in order to diagnose the issue they will need to charge me for the above diagnostics.

I have done all my own oil changes/diff fluid and have built my rig completely unassisted (lift etc) etc so I am mechanically inclined, but I just assumed that with my extended warranty it's a no brainer to take it to the dealership.

I am honestly pissed that diagnostics aren't covered under the warranty if their diagnostics do not uncover a problem (ie. they can take me to the cleaners and charge me up the a$$ for any/all diagnostics in order to make their money).

What should I reasonably expect them to do for diagnostics before jumping to everything under the sun?

Coils/plugs first (but plugs changed less than 50k ago)? Then maybe injectors and if no issue then compression? They didn't even mention injectors on their work order.

Any advice would be helpful, thanks in advance!

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[Sandman 4x4]

Is this the dealer you bought from, including the extended warranty? If so I would be prepared to go in person on a busy day when the showroom is busy. Talk to the general manager about the situation you’re in, while getting hot under the collar. Continuously raising your voice in concern, while verbally outlining each detail, like price paid, especially for the extended warranty, with a copy in hand pre read in the fine print, to the point of belligerence in a heated discussion everyone can hear, especially if you spent a lot of $$$$ there! I’m sure by the time you’ve reached 80 dbl? The manager will have the gen managers attention and get you some satisfaction. But DONT SWEAR, of insult, just bereaved and like a victim! Good luck!

 

[Figmo]

I can see both sides of this issue. Yours, obviously. But also the dealer. They don’t want to spend a bunch of money, diagnosing your problem, only to have you say thanks and then go home and fix it yourself. And I do believe they should get paid for their time whether that be repairing or diagnosing.

what I would expect, and what I would ask the manager for, would be that diagnostic are charged only if I do not authorize the service. If I have them perform the repairs, could they please waive the diagnostic charges.

as for if this is covered under extended warranty or not, only the 100,000 words of fine print can answer that.

But the dealership will get paid regardless. So the manager is the man to work on.

 

[DrJ]

To answer a few questions: No, this isn't the dealer I purchased from; it's a dealership in my area that I am trying for the first time. I wasn't happy with the previous dealership that did a warranty repair at around 30k.

I have the max care warranty which covers nearly everything, so I don't plan on having them diagnose only for me to do my own repairs, since the repairs/parts would be covered anyways.

I am told that if a certain diagnostic test uncovers a problem, then that specific diagnostic cost IS covered along with the repair.

My point is that they can do all the diagnostics they want and if they don't find the problem I am on the hook for that diagnostics cost. To me this is a problem because if I get stuck with a crappy tech that goes down rabbit holes only to come up empty handed, I am screwed with a huge diagnostic cost.

I understand that each diagnostic pathway has algorithms to follow, but there are too many reasons to list as a potential cause of the missfire codes.

 

[CyberShanks]

Pretty sure cylinders 1&5 are on passenger side on the 3.6. The passenger side is super easy to get to the plugs, just need plug socket and I think a 6" extension. Diagnosis on it should be child's play for the dealership for those cylinders. I could completely understand 1k diagnostics charge if it was to check plugs on drivers side, those are a PITA cause intake needs to come apart...

Jim

 

[Jteakus]

They ARE going to find something.

 

[Sandman 4x4]

Has anyone thought of this issue being something very simple and overlooked, like water on the gas?

 

[IzzyO]

Sandman, hopefully, it is something as simple as that but there are quite a few different things that could cause the misfires.

DrJ, has your jeep ever had slow coolant loss (over hundreds or thousands of miles) in the coolant overflow/reservoir? My JT was doing this and I took it by the dealership a few times and they couldn't figure it out & told me it was normal and just topped it off. I even replaced the reservoir cap just in case. I knew it wasn't normal because I would get a rough idle after starting up (usually in the afternoon when it was warmer outside) and it always felt like it was underpowered, especially when pulling out in front of traffic. Around 24k miles I took it back in for some other related warranty service but asked for them to check it out again. I got lucky because they had just hired a new tech. I told them I had experienced a continuous but very small loss of coolant from the reservoir with no noticeable leaks. After inspecting everything in the engine bay again the new tech performed an overnight pressure test by hooking up to the coolant reservoir. The next morning there was coolant loss (although minor) and no leaks. They then discovered upon closer inspection there was subtle coolant leak in one of the cylinders.

Apparently, you have to have so many misfires to finally trigger a CEL alert (or so I've been told) because the tech was able to pull up the misfire once he was able to cue in to what was going on but for some reason they weren't able to find it at first glance/the other times I brought it in. I had to wait 2 months for a new engine swap which sucked but I'll tell you what, I never knew that it was so nice to drive a Jeep until I got a new engine and the power was there and shifting was soooo much smoother... and the ticking was gone!

Hopefully, yours is something simple but just letting you know what happened with mine in the off chance that this might be helpful since it was such a PIA to get resolved. A buddy had the same issue and he was able to figure it out after I told him what was going on, same thing for him, new engine.

At least you still have your extended warranty but that's a pretty steep diagnostic fee and pretty silly but chances are they should be able to find something with that many codes being thrown. If you're having coolant loss from the reservoir (even very small) along with it running underpowered (also had 33's) it would definitely be worth it to mention this issue/have them look into this. I'll see if I can find the report the dealership gave me with the details and post it here.

 

[DrJ]

Sorry for the delay, I have an update...

After waiting over a week for the service manager to call me back and discuss my issues (without ever receiving a call back), I decided to pick up the Jeep and take it to a different dealer. I wanted to discuss the fact that the cams/rocker arms for cylinders 2/4/6 had already been replaced about 40k miles ago and I was having the same ticking noise again. Alas, I guess they didn't care about my issues.

Tuesday a.m. I dropped it off at the dealership that had done the previous work. Received a call today (Wednesday) that replacement of all 4 of the cams and rocker arms has already been approved. Service adviser said they could replace the spark plugs at the same time for only the cost of the plugs. I also mentioned TSB 09-012-22 (as my engine has knocking) and I'm hoping they can also have the TSB approved to actually remove the heads, clean the pistons and replace the PCV valve etc; spark plug replacement would also be included under this TSB.

I am beyond happy that I didn't have to fight with them. Still hoping that the TSB will also be covered!

Thanks to all who answered/gave advice, will keep this thread updated as the work progresses.

Cheers,
J

 

[Jteakus]

I'm glad it is working out for you.

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