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Pro tip: Leaving it in ACC mode for 4 days will kill both batteries

ShadowsPapa

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I had my truck at the dealership for some work about 3-weeks ago. It sat there for about 5-days and when I got it back the secondary battery was too low for ESS to work.

Thing is, with ongoing COVID stuff (I just don’t drive much) and the fact I have a parking mode hardwired dashcam always running, that secondary battery has only once had enough charging time to re-enable the ESS system—and even then, just for a short time before sitting and draining again.

Prior to the dealership visit, the truck could sit equally as unused and still always have the ESS battery work just fine.

I just wish I had a better way to charge the batteries than driving around for hours (I have a 1500amp jump pack, but that seems to be insufficient to fully charge the batteries).
"jump packs" don't charge anything - not in a battery-friendly way anyhow.
Get a battery tender (battery minder, whatever the trade name is) you can plug in when close to an outlet and not driving it.
Mine has a connector so I can leave the cord connected to the battery and dangling behind the grill and simply plug the battery tender to it and not even open the hood. I use one for my classics that sit a lot.
My wife's GC sits sometimes for a week or two at a time, now my JT will be sitting as I have no place to go and the way Iowa is going, I'd rather not go out and about with sick people at every turn.
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Shore power is a must. Been running on my LJ for years keeping my dual batteries topped off. My commute is 2miles. That is not enough to charge the batteries. I plug it in every night.
Also make sure you get one designed for your battery. Something like the odyssey, are AGM +. They like a lot more voltage and amperage than normal AGMs or lead acid batteries.
 
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PsyRN

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Mine problem it turned out was another bad TIPM/PDC. Got it replaced under warranty. Though they think it might be related to the winch, so they unconnected it to see if it does it again.
 

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Mine problem it turned out was another bad TIPM/PDC. Got it replaced under warranty. Though they think it might be related to the winch, so they unconnected it to see if it does it again.
Do you know if the aux battery ran down or was it fully charged when the electronics went out this time?
 

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The push button start has gotten me a couple times. Without a key I am all crossed up. I occasionally leave it in gear as well. I need to slow myself down and actually pay attention when I park. Killed my battery once. Thankfully a jump had me on my way with no ill effects.
 

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ShadowsPapa

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The push button start has gotten me a couple times. Without a key I am all crossed up. I occasionally leave it in gear as well. I need to slow myself down and actually pay attention when I park. Killed my battery once. Thankfully a jump had me on my way with no ill effects.
My problem is when I get into my WJ and try to push a button, then have to unbuckle, reach into my pocket for a KEY.
Funny thing, it's automatic to me when I get into my Javelin or Eagle - but then I leave the keys in 'em when they are locked up in the shop or garage. Those two don't twist me up but for some reason the WJ does after dealing with my wife's Grand Cherokees or my JT.
My wife HATES having to use a key - she can't stand it when she drives the WJ -
"oh, I need a stupid key? That's dumb"

The only time we EVER had an issue with the batteries was with her 2018 GC - then both went bad at the same time. I'd jump it to start it for her, and she'd be fine for a day doing her quilt friend get-togethers, but sitting 3 days or more, they'd be dead again. The ESS on it stopped working at the same time. New batteries and all has been fine.
 
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PsyRN

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Do you know if the aux battery ran down or was it fully charged when the electronics went out this time?
They said both batteries had full charges. It started up just fine. Just when I was starting to drive off is when everything went out. They disconnected the winch and things worked again but intermittently. Something about "dropping of the bus creating the power failure". So they replaced the PDC but kept the winch unconnected to see if it does it again.

I have the HF Apex winch, and using the cut-off switch, so it's hard to think the winch is pulling any power, it shouldn't. They noted that too, but somehow things started working again when they disconnected it. Not sure how to test to see if the winch is pulling power when it shouldn't. Electrical stuff is definitely not my strong point.
 

ShadowsPapa

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They said both batteries had full charges. It started up just fine. Just when I was starting to drive off is when everything went out. They disconnected the winch and things worked again but intermittently. Something about "dropping of the bus creating the power failure". So they replaced the PDC but kept the winch unconnected to see if it does it again.

I have the HF Apex winch, and using the cut-off switch, so it's hard to think the winch is pulling any power, it shouldn't. They noted that too, but somehow things started working again when they disconnected it. Not sure how to test to see if the winch is pulling power when it shouldn't. Electrical stuff is definitely not my strong point.
If you have the switch, then it's not using ANY power when the switch is in the out or off position. There's nothing, it's the SAME as disconnecting the cable.

In the pic below, mine is set to ON for testing the winch -

Jeep Gladiator Pro tip: Leaving it in ACC mode for 4 days will kill both batteries 20201017_135923_HDR
 
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PsyRN

PsyRN

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If you have the switch, then it's not using ANY power when the switch is in the out or off position. There's nothing, it's the SAME as disconnecting the cable.

In the pic below, mine is set to ON for testing the winch -

20201017_135923_HDR.jpg
That’s my understanding too. But once they disconnected the winch, accessories were working again. As if the PDC was sensing an overload and switched off, but once removed things were relatively ok again. In the notes they “advise” putting in some sort of inverter to buffer any power draw from the winch. Not sure what that means.
 

ShadowsPapa

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That’s my understanding too. But once they disconnected the winch, accessories were working again. As if the PDC was sensing an overload and switched off, but once removed things were relatively ok again. In the notes they “advise” putting in some sort of inverter to buffer any power draw from the winch. Not sure what that means.
That person shouldn't be working on electrical systems.
These winches have ZERO power draw if the switch is in "wired remote" mode. They have a TEENY draw if in wireless remote mode - like your TV does.
Does he even know what an inverter is?

The PDC doesn't "sense" anything like that! If it did then leaving lights on, or jump starting another vehicle with your engine not running would shut things down.
Power draws don't go through the PCM. All the PCM can do is sense VOLTAGE - PERIOD.
If the voltage goes down and gets low it will trigger a code in some cases, but not a shutdown unless things get below 10 volts.
How can a PCM sense "draw" or "load" if the load is not going through the PCM? It can't.

You can prove if there's a draw or not VERY easily. If you have a 12 volt test light - put it between the winch lead they disconnected and the battery terminal where it WAS connected. If the light doesn't glow, there's no current flow and thus no load!
 

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That person shouldn't be working on electrical systems.
These winches have ZERO power draw if the switch is in "wired remote" mode. They have a TEENY draw if in wireless remote mode - like your TV does.
Does he even know what an inverter is?

The PDC doesn't "sense" anything like that! If it did then leaving lights on, or jump starting another vehicle with your engine not running would shut things down.
Power draws don't go through the PCM. All the PCM can do is sense VOLTAGE - PERIOD.
If the voltage goes down and gets low it will trigger a code in some cases, but not a shutdown unless things get below 10 volts.
How can a PCM sense "draw" or "load" if the load is not going through the PCM? It can't.

You can prove if there's a draw or not VERY easily. If you have a 12 volt test light - put it between the winch lead they disconnected and the battery terminal where it WAS connected. If the light doesn't glow, there's no current flow and thus no load!
I tried the 12v test light, and no light. I didn't think there was any issue with the winch.

here's another observation, and I'm not sure it's relevant. I noticed after getting it back from the dealer the voltage meter in the truck would read at around 14v while driving. Prior to that after I replaced the battery, I noticed it would fluctuate between 12.5v and 13.5v, but never got up to 14v. After plugging in the winch and testing it out, I disconnected the lines (just in case), and I noticed my battery voltage meter in the truck would fluctuate around 13v for the rest of the day. The next day, it would run at 14v+ while driving again. Maybe it's nothing, but just something I observed. Like I said, electrical stuff is like magic to me. I can explain the bodies circulatory system much easier then a simple circuit. Go figure.
 

ShadowsPapa

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I tried the 12v test light, and no light. I didn't think there was any issue with the winch.

here's another observation, and I'm not sure it's relevant. I noticed after getting it back from the dealer the voltage meter in the truck would read at around 14v while driving. Prior to that after I replaced the battery, I noticed it would fluctuate between 12.5v and 13.5v, but never got up to 14v. After plugging in the winch and testing it out, I disconnected the lines (just in case), and I noticed my battery voltage meter in the truck would fluctuate around 13v for the rest of the day. The next day, it would run at 14v+ while driving again. Maybe it's nothing, but just something I observed. Like I said, electrical stuff is like magic to me. I can explain the bodies circulatory system much easier then a simple circuit. Go figure.
Maybe some day I'll trade you some expertise - I have issues with Raynaud's and other fun stuff.
 

jebiruph

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They said both batteries had full charges. It started up just fine. Just when I was starting to drive off is when everything went out. They disconnected the winch and things worked again but intermittently. Something about "dropping of the bus creating the power failure". So they replaced the PDC but kept the winch unconnected to see if it does it again.

I have the HF Apex winch, and using the cut-off switch, so it's hard to think the winch is pulling any power, it shouldn't. They noted that too, but somehow things started working again when they disconnected it. Not sure how to test to see if the winch is pulling power when it shouldn't. Electrical stuff is definitely not my strong point.
A couple things that may not be at work for your issue, but could be and seem to be common issues.

First, when the PDC is replaced it always seems to be (based on observed posts) due to the ESS/PCR high current fuse getting blown because the main battery positive terminal was shorted to ground when the aux battery was connected to it (the N3 fuse in the diagram). Some techs aren't aware that only the high current fuses need to be replaced and they replace the PDC. I wonder if your techs unknowingly blew the fuse, then detected an issue and blamed it on your winch.
Jeep Gladiator Pro tip: Leaving it in ACC mode for 4 days will kill both batteries underhood jumper plain.PNG


The second thing is that the ground cable connected to the main battery terminal loosens easily. If the nut is not real tight, bumping the cable loosens it further, so make sure it is real tight.
 
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PsyRN

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Maybe some day I'll trade you some expertise - I have issues with Raynaud's and other fun stuff.
That sound rougher then my problem. Keep those hands and feet warm, and stress levels down.
 

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That sound rougher then my problem. Keep those hands and feet warm, and stress levels down.
I'm severe ADHD - a normal day is stress!
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