Rear end noise while turning, Does Jeep's response sound right?

[Labman1014]

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Kate
Jeep Cares

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[Stan H]

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Kate
Jeep Cares

In the Jeeps that are not Rubicon they have a LS it requires an oil and a LS paste crap.. of I am recalling correctly . The Rubicon does not have that because of the lockers. Have it changed and make sure they do the additive . And then if it does it again. Order some good stuff from amsoil and additive do it yourself and then if it does it again. Go from there.

 

[Deleted member 52902]

Personal experience with JEEP and RAM, Limited Slip differentials; I feel they may outlast me.

I change my rear differential fluid every 30,000-ish miles. I found this to be similar to servicing fluid in other vehicle brands I have had, equipped with Limited Slip rear differentials. The clutch plates will naturally wear which makes the fluid visibly dirty far sooner than a non LS differential. Have I hear noises from these rear diff's? A few times in lots of years. Rare, and only when differentials were still cool, barely driven state. And the noise wasn't awful nor did it last for more than a second or so. These were tight or semi-tight turns made on pavement. I believe I heard one time on a heavily iced Winter road condition; I had to make a U-turn (switched out of Command Trac 4WD into 2WD), I heard rear diff clutch action.

Using my 2001 RAM pickup as the oldest, currently owned vehicle with LS rear differential with same characteristics and heard a noise a few times in its life, I think these JEEP and RAM vehicle LS diffs will outlast me. That said, I change fluid in the rear diffs about every 30,000 miles. Regardless of street or off-street use. These rear diffs always have visibly dirty fluid, due to expected clutch action. I never drain by the plug only; After plug-drained , I always pull the cover and clean out the diff's with Brake Cleaner spray (use safety glasses for any spray-back). I use sealant to put the cover back in place and depending on the specified wait time for that sealant to set before I refill the diff. I typically use Permatex Red which has a longer set time before I refill the diff with standard 85W-90, usually VALVOLINE but I'm not picky on that. You can use an appropriate weigtht Synthetic fluid. Either way, I always use the MOPAR 0431806(AD), "Limited Slip Additive Friction Modifier" as specified for these particular LS differentials. If I knew the brand of this fluid that MOPAR gets labeled for them, I would probably by that for less $$. Otherwise I am not willing to test other brands chemical makeup for the additive.

My 21 Gladiator, 17k miles, developed a noise when making tight turns. Narrowed it down to the rear end. After searches, I see a good bit of issues with the LS clutches going out. I do have the wide track M210 and M220 axles. Made an appointment with my dealer. I had to take the tech on a ride to tell him what to listen for, it was raining and soft top didn't help. He heard it and said rear end. After a little bit, the come to me and say that the gear oil in the rear end is dark and smells burnt. Jeeps wants to change the gear oil to see if it goes away and will be covered under warranty. All fine and dandy, but that's not going to fix what caused the oil to get burnt in the first place. I'm wanting to regear, have 315/70/17 on it now.

So,I called Jeep Wave and opened a case and their response was that was correct, just replace the oil and don't fix the cause.

Now I'm stuck in a hard place, do I go ahead and regear and let the clutches burn the new gear oil and pray that it doesn't get the new gears?

We do not off road our Gladiator. We built it for our sons very rear genetic disorder and to show off at local events. LS is nice in wet conditions but I do not need a locker or I'd just switch out the LS and be done.

What's your thoughts? @JeepCares

 

[CrazyCooter]

Personal experience with JEEP and RAM, Limited Slip differentials; I feel they may outlast me.

I change my rear differential fluid every 30,000-ish miles. I found this to be similar to servicing fluid in other vehicle brands I have had, equipped with Limited Slip rear differentials. The clutch plates will naturally wear which makes the fluid visibly dirty far sooner than a non LS differential. Have I hear noises from these rear diff's? A few times in lots of years. Rare, and only when differentials were still cool, barely driven state. And the noise wasn't awful nor did it last for more than a second or so. These were tight or semi-tight turns made on pavement. I believe I heard one time on a heavily iced Winter road condition; I had to make a U-turn (switched out of Command Trac 4WD into 2WD), I heard rear diff clutch action.

Using my 2001 RAM pickup as the oldest, currently owned vehicle with LS rear differential with same characteristics and heard a noise a few times in its life, I think these JEEP and RAM vehicle LS diffs will outlast me. That said, I change fluid in the rear diffs about every 30,000 miles. Regardless of street or off-street use. These rear diffs always have visibly dirty fluid, due to expected clutch action. I never drain by the plug only; After plug-drained , I always pull the cover and clean out the diff's with Brake Cleaner spray (use safety glasses for any spray-back). I use sealant to put the cover back in place and depending on the specified wait time for that sealant to set before I refill the diff. I typically use Permatex Red which has a longer set time before I refill the diff with standard 85W-90, usually VALVOLINE but I'm not picky on that. You can use an appropriate weigtht Synthetic fluid. Either way, I always use the MOPAR 0431806(AD), "Limited Slip Additive Friction Modifier" as specified for these particular LS differentials. If I knew the brand of this fluid that MOPAR gets labeled for them, I would probably by that for less $$. Otherwise I am not willing to test other brands chemical makeup for the additive.

1970-2010ish Ram 1500 9.25 LSD is absolute garbage and uses the same clutch pack as the Gen 1/2 D44. The clutch tabs and retainers break and wipe out the bearings, case, and/or housing depending on how they break or how long you keep driving it afterward. Not sure what these Gen 3 D44s use. Overall not a fan for hard use.

1st and 2nd gen 2500/3500 Rams are much better clutch wise with the Pow'rlok and are a much more robust design, but the case bearing journals fail on those. 3rd gen+ 2500/3500 Rams use a Tracrite and are almost indestructible.

I primarily use Amsoil fluids and friction modifier, but I do think the OEM/Spicer cat urine smelling friction modifier is the gold standard. I hate it.......Even double bagged inside of a cardboard box in my office, I can still smell it when walking in after a vacation.

 

[whit]

Wow you have made it farther than I have!
I have this same noise with my 21 Sport S. Almost a kind of "grind" sound anytime I take a sharp turn with acceleration. (Think leaving a parking lot - not fast just accelerating as I turn.)

I've tried twice now and both times have gotten "unreproducible" from techs. May try again now with some added context here.

This is the exact issue my brother is having with his 2020 Gladiator that we're trying to straighten out. Did you ever find a solution?

Already changed the rear diff fluid as a hopeful easy fix, but that did nothing.

Here's a clip of the noise. It sounds quiet here, but it's actually pretty loud in real life. Almost sounds like a squeegee on dry glass.

As Undecided said - only happens when accelerating while turning, like leaving a parking lot at relatively slower speeds. When going faster, going straight, or when not actively pushing the gas pedal, no noise.

 

[JeepCares]

Hello @whit!

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Hannah
Jeep Cares

 

[whit]

Hello @whit!

We would like to assist if you elect to visit your nearest Jeep dealership regarding the above. Please send our team a private message to get started.

Hannah
Jeep Cares

Appreciate you reaching out but my brother already had it at a Jeep dealership multiple times and they fixed nothing. That's the only reason I even got involved to try to fix it.

And since it's no longer under warranty, we have little incentive to bring it back to the dealership again unfortunately. Wish the circumstances were different. I don't have a ton of free time and my brother wants his Jeep back.

He also has a pretty bad shimmy at highway speeds (not death wobble but if left un-repaired might have led to that eventually) that the dealership failed to correct as well. I was able to isolate it to a super obviously worn drag link end (pitman arm side) in about 5 minutes. I have no idea how the dealership could have missed that.

 

[Undecided]

This is the exact issue my brother is having with his 2020 Gladiator that we're trying to straighten out. Did you ever find a solution?

Already changed the rear diff fluid as a hopeful easy fix, but that did nothing.

Here's a clip of the noise. It sounds quiet here, but it's actually pretty loud in real life. Almost sounds like a squeegee on dry glass.

As Undecided said - only happens when accelerating while turning, like leaving a parking lot at relatively slower speeds. When going faster, going straight, or when not actively pushing the gas pedal, no noise.

This is the exact sound I have.

Never did get a fix.
I've even had 4x4 service done and hear it less, but still occasionally.

In my searching back then I did come across from somewhere that is may be an expected/normal sound as part of the LSD. Can't find that source now so unsure how reliable that information is.

I can say that I am approaching 70k miles now and not had any additional issues from it.

 

[whit]

This is the exact sound I have.

Never did get a fix.
I've even had 4x4 service done and hear it less, but still occasionally.

In my searching back then I did come across from somewhere that is may be an expected/normal sound as part of the LSD. Can't find that source now so unsure how reliable that information is.

I can say that I am approaching 70k miles now and not had any additional issues from it.

Thanks - really appreciate you getting back to me!

Yeah my brother's Jeep has about 71k miles on it. It's been making this sound for quite a while now, maybe even a couple years. Until recently, I hadn't driven in his Jeep in quite some time and it's much louder now than I remember it being. That's when I offered to take a look at it since the dealership wasn't helpful.

I guess on one hand it's comforting to know that you have also been driving around like this for over a year and no catastrophic failure yet (that's always my concern with noises like this - it's just a ticking time bomb, so I like to address them early).

Not sure where to go from here though. The LSD does seem to be the likely culprit to me too. It's really the only thing that makes sense. Not sure I feel like ripping the diff apart and going down that rabbit hole when it otherwise seems to be working fine (besides the noise). There's no clunking or jerking or anything like that. Maybe we'll just wait until it explodes and then replace the whole axle with something better.

 

[Undecided]

Thanks - really appreciate you getting back to me!

Yeah my brother's Jeep has about 71k miles on it. It's been making this sound for quite a while now, maybe even a couple years. Until recently, I hadn't driven in his Jeep in quite some time and it's much louder now than I remember it being. That's when I offered to take a look at it since the dealership wasn't helpful.

I guess on one hand it's comforting to know that you have also been driving around like this for over a year and no catastrophic failure yet (that's always my concern with noises like this - it's just a ticking time bomb, so I like to address them early).

Not sure where to go from here though. The LSD does seem to be the likely culprit to me too. It's really the only thing that makes sense. Not sure I feel like ripping the diff apart and going down that rabbit hole when it otherwise seems to be working fine (besides the noise). There's no clunking or jerking or anything like that. Maybe we'll just wait until it explodes and then replace the whole axle with something better.

That’s where I’m at. I do have an extended warranty until 100k backing me.

if it gives more comfort, mine has been doing this since I pulled it off the lot at 7 miles in 2021. Near 4 years no issue from the noise.

that includes lots of mild to moderate off road and towing a 4500 Jayco about once a month. It’s pulled the camper 1000 miles to Co, done black bear, and back with that sound lol

 

[Wheelin98TJ]

Thanks - really appreciate you getting back to me!

Yeah my brother's Jeep has about 71k miles on it. It's been making this sound for quite a while now, maybe even a couple years. Until recently, I hadn't driven in his Jeep in quite some time and it's much louder now than I remember it being. That's when I offered to take a look at it since the dealership wasn't helpful.

I guess on one hand it's comforting to know that you have also been driving around like this for over a year and no catastrophic failure yet (that's always my concern with noises like this - it's just a ticking time bomb, so I like to address them early).

Not sure where to go from here though. The LSD does seem to be the likely culprit to me too. It's really the only thing that makes sense. Not sure I feel like ripping the diff apart and going down that rabbit hole when it otherwise seems to be working fine (besides the noise). There's no clunking or jerking or anything like that. Maybe we'll just wait until it explodes and then replace the whole axle with something better.

If it fails, your brother's limited slip diff becomes an open diff. Not really a big deal.

When you did the fluid change, did you also add friction modifier? I didn't see any mention of that.

 

[whit]

That’s where I’m at. I do have an extended warranty until 100k backing me.

if it gives more comfort, mine has been doing this since I pulled it off the lot at 7 miles in 2021. Near 4 years no issue from the noise.

that includes lots of mild to moderate off road and towing a 4500 Jayco about once a month. It’s pulled the camper 1000 miles to Co, done black bear, and back with that sound lol

Lol good to know!

 

[whit]

If it fails, your brother's limited slip diff becomes an open diff. Not really a big deal.

When you did the fluid change, did you also add friction modifier? I didn't see any mention of that.

Great point!

I bought the premixed stuff with the limited slip additive in it already. Think I should add more of the standalone friction modifier on top? Any suggestions on how much to add given the fluid I already used? Just keep gradually adding more until the sound goes away or the diff fails?

 

[Wheelin98TJ]

Great point!

I bought the premixed stuff with the limited slip additive in it already. Think I should add more of the standalone friction modifier on top? Any suggestions on how much to add given the fluid I already used? Just keep gradually adding more until the sound goes away or the diff fails?

Yes, I'd add more friction modifier. I've had to do this with gear lube that already has the additive in it.

Start with 2.5 ounces. Drive some figure 8s. Drive it a few days. If it's still making noise, add another couple ounces, repeat the figure 8s, and drive for a few days.

I'd go to the dealer and get the Mopar branded additive. Should be around $12.

 

[whit]

Yes, I'd add more friction modifier. I've had to do this with gear lube that already has the additive in it.

Start with 2.5 ounces. Drive some figure 8s. Drive it a few days. If it's still making noise, add another couple ounces, repeat the figure 8s, and drive for a few days.

I'd go to the dealer and get the Mopar branded additive. Should be around $12.

I'll give that a go. Thanks!

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