Violent shudder at 85mph

[brianinca]

Interstate 5 between San Francisco and Los Angeles is wide open. When Sammy Hagar was screaming about "I can't drive 55" he was talking about that stretch of road particularly.

"It took me 16 hours to get to L.A."

Too hot and dry for critters of any kind.

Mine is limited to 110 - likely for tires, doesn't matter, I won't take it THAT fast.
I've pushed 90, maybe more - dunno, was too busy making sure I wasn't making trouble on the interstate LOL

It's obviously capable of doing over 100 or they'd not need to govern the thing. Just a thought.....
Around here you are more likely to have a critter - or a 2-legged critter cause problems for you going at those speeds. But it won't be lack of capability of the truck.

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[ShadowsPapa]

Interstate 5 between San Francisco and Los Angeles is wide open. When Sammy Hagar was screaming about "I can't drive 55" he was talking about that stretch of road particularly.

"It took me 16 hours to get to L.A."

Too hot and dry for critters of any kind.

There are interstates in other places that are flat and wide open - some having little truck traffic.
The problem here is that the truck traffic is so crazy there are times you can't keep the speed limit (70) due to the traffic. I80 east of Des Moines truck traffic is a huge issue much of the time.
They get to running 2 abreast and neither one will speed up or slow down and move back to the right. You are stuck behind trucks barely making the hills (and some staying side-by-side on purpose - just ask people who take that route on a regular basis)

There's no way you can keep speeds of much over the limit for very long here. I35 north of Des Moines is often more open, allowing for faster speeds, but not always. But it's also not flat in some areas. You find if you are going much over the limit you may crest a hill and have to smoke your brakes.
But no one claimed Iowans were smart drivers. You'll find an accident in the west-bound lanes causes traffic to back up for a mile or so in the east-bound lanes.

 

[brianinca]

We have a State highway that parallels I-5 but 50 miles East (other side of the Valley) and the semi-truck traffic there is horrendous, exactly as you describe.

It makes it worth adding 20-50 miles to a trip to avoid the "Bloody 99" by diverting to the I-5.

On the other hand, we took a windy, hilly and thoroughly enjoyable "long way 'round" yesterday coming back from San Francisco - dropped down the PCH to the 101 and then East on the 198 (runs up into Sequoia Nat'l Park eventually). Google Maps cried about it taking 15 minutes longer, but getting home without my wife's shoulders up around her ears was totally worth it!

My wife chided me for saying people slowed to gawk at a 4 car pile-up on the 101 so they could "Instagram it" - she's right, gawking goes back LONG before that was a thing!

There are interstates in other places that are flat and wide open - some having little truck traffic.
The problem here is that the truck traffic is so crazy there are times you can't keep the speed limit (70) due to the traffic. I80 east of Des Moines truck traffic is a huge issue much of the time.
They get to running 2 abreast and neither one will speed up or slow down and move back to the right. You are stuck behind trucks barely making the hills (and some staying side-by-side on purpose - just ask people who take that route on a regular basis)

There's no way you can keep speeds of much over the limit for very long here. I35 north of Des Moines is often more open, allowing for faster speeds, but not always. But it's also not flat in some areas. You find if you are going much over the limit you may crest a hill and have to smoke your brakes.
But no one claimed Iowans were smart drivers. You'll find an accident in the west-bound lanes causes traffic to back up for a mile or so in the east-bound lanes.

 

[black beauty]

In Fl. I stay btwn 75-80. Pass @ 90 for a few seconds. Stock jeeps w/ pentastar kicks in from around 80-90. I prefer that over the 2.0. I think if they made the 3.6 e-torque for the Gladiator it would be good. I have the willys and those firestone m/t are not very blacktop friendly unlike the bfg m/t c loads which I like better.

 

[TheSolarWizard]

Driving slow on Florida Interstates is not an option, unless you want to get run over or run off the road.

put a lift and tires on your truck. Vehicles don’t act aggressively around me at all

 

[mjc999]

I’m on the turnpike heading to work. I regularly hit 90 on my 20 minute commute. I have cruise control set at 80mph. I speed up to 85 to pass a truck and the wheel starts shaking and the whole care shudders as if I had a front tire blow out.
I start to veer right and slow down to come to a safe stop. I get to about 30mph still shaking and I tap the gas a bit to avoid getting hit by traffic behind me and the shuddering stops. Instantly know it’s not a flat.
Seemed fine fine so I got back to 85. Same thing. So I limp to work at 60mph.. checked her out and nothing seems out of the ordinary. But something is definitely f’ed

please help

Ok, so I just had something very similar happen. I have a bone stock High Altitude diesel with 3500 miles.
On Monday, I drove to a train station doing 75-85 the whole way. Left it for two days. On the drive home on the same highway (but in the opposite direction) and speed between 75-80, every time I hit an expansion joint or bump I'd get a violent wobble/shudder in the front that would resolve itself after about 5 seconds. Below highway speed, it did not occur. Sounds like a steering stabilizer issue but I really don't know.

Did you get the issue resolved by the dealer?

 

[ShadowsPapa]

Ok, so I just had something very similar happen. I have a bone stock High Altitude diesel with 3500 miles.
On Monday, I drove to a train station doing 75-85 the whole way. Left it for two days. On the drive home on the same highway (but in the opposite direction) and speed between 75-80, every time I hit an expansion joint or bump I'd get a violent wobble/shudder in the front that would resolve itself after about 5 seconds. Below highway speed, it did not occur. Sounds like a steering stabilizer issue but I really don't know.

Did you get the issue resolved by the dealer?

If it's truly "bone stock" - meaning original wheels, tires, springs, shocks, and you've made no changes to steering, suspension, wheels or tires, then the dealer needs to fix it.
Not that you are saying you plan on that, but please don't try to band-aid it with aftermarket parts.

(For lurkers - Too many Jeep and truck people appear to see the steering stabilizer as the answer - in most cases it's grossly misunderstood what the intent of that "shock" is.)

You may have loose parts (bolts not torqued properly and/or that have come loose), damage to parts, etc. Heck, one guy found a MISSING BOLT!

Since yours appears to clear itself after a few seconds - do have the dealer check it as you may be experiencing bump steer, etc. and in that case, the stabilizer could be an issue - but don't start throwing parts at it, it's up to the dealer and Jeep to make it right and safe. (and keep YOU safe)


------------------------------------------------
Summary of Technical Service Bulletin 19-002-12 Steering System Maintenance

It is important that the steering system be kept in good working condition. Having your vehicle inspected regularly to ensure it meets proper factory specifications, and promptly repairing the steering system when it is out of factory specifications, helps ensure the vehicle maintains its intended ride, handling and steering characteristics.

Vehicles equipped with a solid front axle may exhibit steering system vibration if the steering system is damaged or not properly maintained. This condition is not unique to Chrysler Group vehicles; any manufacturer's vehicle equipped with a solid front axle has the potential to exhibit steering system vibration.

To ensure that Chrysler Group customers have the most relevant information to enhance their vehicle enjoyment -- and that customers receive the best service from repair facilities diagnosing and addressing steering system vibration -- the Company has issued Technical Service Bulletin 19-002-12 to assist dealers and repair facilities in the diagnosis and repair of this condition.

The following is a summary of the steering and suspension system elements that can potentially contribute to steering system vibration. Chrysler recommends having your authorized Chrysler dealer inspect these elements should you experience steering system vibration:

• Is the vehicle equipped with aftermarket components or other modifications (e.g. lift kits, wheels, suspension components or tires) that can affect the performance of or wear upon steering components?*

• Check the air pressure in the tires and ensure they are inflated to the recommended pressure. This value can be found on the tire placard located on the driver's front door enclosure.

• Inspect the tires for signs of unusual or uneven wear, cupping or other damage.

• Ensure that the tires/wheels are balanced within specification

• Inspect the steering damper for excessive wear or damage.**

• Inspect the track bar for excessive wear or damage.**

• Inspect the tie rods for excessive wear or damage.**

• Inspect the drag link for excessive wear or damage.**

• Inspect the ball joints for excessive wear or damage.**

* Installation of aftermarket steering and suspension components or wheel and tire assemblies that are either not compatible with your vehicle or not designed for on-road use is most often the cause of steering system vibration, in which case you may consult your aftermarket equipment manufacturer or vehicle modifier for repair suggestions

** If any of the steering or suspension components are replaced, a front end wheel alignment is required.

If you have questions regarding your vehicle, its ride and handling or steering characteristics as they may relate to steering system vibration, please consult with your authorized Chrysler Group dealer to have your vehicle inspected.

 

[mjc999]

If it's truly "bone stock" - meaning original wheels, tires, springs, shocks, and you've made no changes to steering, suspension, wheels or tires, then the dealer needs to fix it.
Not that you are saying you plan on that, but please don't try to band-aid it with aftermarket parts.

(For lurkers - Too many Jeep and truck people appear to see the steering stabilizer as the answer - in most cases it's grossly misunderstood what the intent of that "shock" is.)

You may have loose parts (bolts not torqued properly and/or that have come loose), damage to parts, etc. Heck, one guy found a MISSING BOLT!

Since yours appears to clear itself after a few seconds - do have the dealer check it as you may be experiencing bump steer, etc. and in that case, the stabilizer could be an issue - but don't start throwing parts at it, it's up to the dealer and Jeep to make it right and safe. (and keep YOU safe)


------------------------------------------------
Summary of Technical Service Bulletin 19-002-12 Steering System Maintenance

It is important that the steering system be kept in good working condition. Having your vehicle inspected regularly to ensure it meets proper factory specifications, and promptly repairing the steering system when it is out of factory specifications, helps ensure the vehicle maintains its intended ride, handling and steering characteristics.

Vehicles equipped with a solid front axle may exhibit steering system vibration if the steering system is damaged or not properly maintained. This condition is not unique to Chrysler Group vehicles; any manufacturer's vehicle equipped with a solid front axle has the potential to exhibit steering system vibration.

To ensure that Chrysler Group customers have the most relevant information to enhance their vehicle enjoyment -- and that customers receive the best service from repair facilities diagnosing and addressing steering system vibration -- the Company has issued Technical Service Bulletin 19-002-12 to assist dealers and repair facilities in the diagnosis and repair of this condition.

The following is a summary of the steering and suspension system elements that can potentially contribute to steering system vibration. Chrysler recommends having your authorized Chrysler dealer inspect these elements should you experience steering system vibration:

• Is the vehicle equipped with aftermarket components or other modifications (e.g. lift kits, wheels, suspension components or tires) that can affect the performance of or wear upon steering components?*

• Check the air pressure in the tires and ensure they are inflated to the recommended pressure. This value can be found on the tire placard located on the driver's front door enclosure.

• Inspect the tires for signs of unusual or uneven wear, cupping or other damage.

• Ensure that the tires/wheels are balanced within specification

• Inspect the steering damper for excessive wear or damage.**

• Inspect the track bar for excessive wear or damage.**

• Inspect the tie rods for excessive wear or damage.**

• Inspect the drag link for excessive wear or damage.**

• Inspect the ball joints for excessive wear or damage.**

* Installation of aftermarket steering and suspension components or wheel and tire assemblies that are either not compatible with your vehicle or not designed for on-road use is most often the cause of steering system vibration, in which case you may consult your aftermarket equipment manufacturer or vehicle modifier for repair suggestions

** If any of the steering or suspension components are replaced, a front end wheel alignment is required.

If you have questions regarding your vehicle, its ride and handling or steering characteristics as they may relate to steering system vibration, please consult with your authorized Chrysler Group dealer to have your vehicle inspected.

Thanks. It is truly bone stock. I wasn't intending on replacing parts but if I was going to check for loose bolts, etc. I was hoping for likely starting point and hopefully avoiding the hassle of a dealer visit.

Last question...are there any electronically controlled components in the suspension package? I did have the battery die (my fault) and had to disconnect the negative connection in order to charge the battery. If suspension is electronically controlled and it lost a memory setting or something, I guess that could be a culprit as well. The argument against that is that I drove it after recharging without incident before the problem surfaced.

best,
Mark

 

[ShadowsPapa]

Thanks. It is truly bone stock. I wasn't intending on replacing parts but if I was going to check for loose bolts, etc. I was hoping for likely starting point and hopefully avoiding the hassle of a dealer visit.

Last question...are there any electronically controlled components in the suspension package? I did have the battery die (my fault) and had to disconnect the negative connection in order to charge the battery. If suspension is electronically controlled and it lost a memory setting or something, I guess that could be a culprit as well. The argument against that is that I drove it after recharging without incident before the problem surfaced.

best,
Mark

No, not on these. They haven't caught up to GM and other vehicles with the computer controlled shock valving and so on.
But do check for any loose bolts. More than one person here has found loose bolts and in at least one case, a missing CRITICAL bolt. Some of these parts are crazy tight - and some folks here have the torque specs I'm sure.
But a visual inspection, checking bolts and so on - GREAT place to start.
Track bar bolts are a big, critical, beyond important, place to look. Stabilizer, drag link and so on - check 'em all.
It's incredible in this day that people are finding loose bolts on these things.

 

[DocMike]

ShadowsPapa is right. Sometimes a torque wrench and crawler are the way....

The Buddha teaches that true enlightenment can be attained after many hours of contemplation beneath one's ride.

No, not on these. They haven't caught up to GM and other vehicles with the computer controlled shock valving and so on.
But do check for any loose bolts. More than one person here has found loose bolts and in at least one case, a missing CRITICAL bolt. Some of these parts are crazy tight - and some folks here have the torque specs I'm sure.
But a visual inspection, checking bolts and so on - GREAT place to start.
Track bar bolts are a big, critical, beyond important, place to look. Stabilizer, drag link and so on - check 'em all.
It's incredible in this day that people are finding loose bolts on these things.

 

[ShadowsPapa]

ShadowsPapa is right. Sometimes a torque wrench and crawler are the way....

The Buddha teaches that true enlightenment can be attained after many hours of contemplation beneath one's ride.

OM (Hindu, I know)

 

[LaterGator]

I have had the death wobble a couple of times now. All with the same resolution. Re-torque the nuts for tie-rods, drag-link, and track bar. Mostly the tie-rod ends. They aluminum knuckles are too soft and the holes loosen up. Leading to the death wobble. I loctited the nuts this last time.

Tire balance also plays a part but not nearly as much as the loose nuts.

The steering stabilizer is rarely the real culprit.

On high mileage vehicles, loose/worn wheel bearings and ball joints can also cause the death wobble. I've only got 15000 miles on mine so they aren't a problem. My CJ3B had a bad case of death wobble caused by the aforementioned front wheel bearings.

When it happens again, the knuckles will be replaced with good old reliable heavy duty cast iron.

 

[mjc999]

Ok, so I just had something very similar happen. I have a bone stock High Altitude diesel with 3500 miles.
On Monday, I drove to a train station doing 75-85 the whole way. Left it for two days. On the drive home on the same highway (but in the opposite direction) and speed between 75-80, every time I hit an expansion joint or bump I'd get a violent wobble/shudder in the front that would resolve itself after about 5 seconds. Below highway speed, it did not occur. Sounds like a steering stabilizer issue but I really don't know.

Did you get the issue resolved by the dealer?

So, a little more data for my situation. I've not done anything just yet but drive it on the same route again. Shudder only noticeable over 65ish. Also, if I hit an expansion joint such that both front tires hit at the same time, no issue. If it' is at an angle or I'm in a turn such that one tire hits before the second. The shudder is all but guaranteed.

I did a visual under the front end and not all nuts/bolts have torque markings. The ones that do are very confusing and nothing like I've seen before . An example is shown in the attached pic. I would normally think that the blue line at the end of the bolt should line up with the blue mark on the nut but it appears to be 90 degrees off. Also there is a mark on the control arm that more or less lines up with the mark on the nut but I don't know if that is relevant. I forget where the second pic is from, but it shows the marks off by 90 degrees as well. How should I interpret these marks?

thanks,
Mark

 

[ShadowsPapa]

The white that's on the edge of the bolt's washer in the lower picture should be lined up with the white line by the "L" and on the other, the blue also looks "off".
Either someone has turned those fasteners at some point, or they have shifted.
I'd put NEW marks, even if just with a sharpie (you can actually get those in other colors besides black - I use a silver one to touch things up on show cars, and have a paint marker that's metallic silver)
To me, those look like they have moved or someone moved them.

 

[mjc999]

Thought I'd post a follow up.

Took three weeks to get a service appt.
When I described the issue, the service writer immediately went to steering stabilizer. I mentioned that the torque markings all look to be off but was brushed off. Took home a loaner. Got a call saying the steering stabilizer is on order and to be replaced today/tomorrow. When I called to inquire, I was told that the service tech stated "this vehicle should not be driven".

In any event, attached is a video of my steering wheel after hitting a bump at highway speed.

I'll follow up again when I get the truck back.

Mark

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