Warranty work while tuned

[willhonkforparts]

I recall the tuner/mods/warranty issue surfacing back in 04', when the 6.0 Stroke was blowing-up left and right. Came a point where it was 4-5 a month, with the first engines being shipped directly from Huntsville (not enough salvageable cores had worked their way thru the Motorcraft rebuilt steam yet). A couple of Rotunda-casts (early video streaming) later, techs and engineers were discussing the whole coach builder mods issue; seems as if a few ambulance builders were adding improper coolant after splicing into the chassis cooling system. At the time, everyone was trying to root-fail the engine, so ANYthing out of sorts was being considered. In the end, Ford usually warranted a catastrophic engine fail if a compelling case could be made in the customer's favor, usually as a satisfaction gesture. Fast-forward, when I add a supercharger, for example, to a new 3.6, it is completely understood by all that "if it explodes, take it to the component vendor, as Jeep will likely not cover it". It really does ride a grey area, on a case-by-case basis. Using the supercharger example: my 20' JLUR has the aluminum steering box, and I'm eligible for the iron box campaign. A Hamburger's was added at 141 miles, thus the alternator and hardware must be moved to get the box out. The dealer we buy $$$$$$ Jeeps from, likely would replace as long as I paid them to remove said components. Even in that case, I just bought the box and did it all myself, knowing well that once I charged the engine, I OWNED it and became the warranty provider.

I wish when you buy a new vehicle, you could opt out of the factory warranty for a decent amount of money back. "No thanks, I plan to modify the hell outta this thing and I trust my own work more than your techs." Lol

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[Deleted member 22728]

I wish when you buy a new vehicle, you could opt out of the factory warranty for a decent amount of money back. "No thanks, I plan to modify the hell outta this thing and I trust my own work more than your techs." Lol

Offered the dealership from which my first new Jeep, 01' Sahara, "give me 5k off and I'll sign a notarized affidavit of warranty release", or something like that. He was like "WHAAAA?" Declined.

 

[WXman]

Also, I assume that milage is stored in a bcm as opposed to the ecm?

I think it must be. I've also heard that the dash display memory AND the BCM store it. Not sure. But when I would swap PCMs it wouldn't affect the odometer at all, so...

As far as the other data stored in the PCM that stuff can get pretty technical. Guys like Keith at GDE know more about that than I do. But unless the dealership technician really goes digging they'd never see anything alarming.

 

[johnh442]

Gets technical real fast. Who here knows what a CAN bus is? Checksums? Flash Counters? Calibration details? Sure just change your injector pulse and send it (sorry bad fast and furious reference)... Modern control systems are pretty complex, and its pretty easy to miss something and then that causes a hard failure... Seen it a few times on other platforms (oops I didn't know something else was going to add timing and lean it out... sorry pistons)

Several other OEMs, namely GM, keep track of the number of flashes (ECM/TCM reprogramming) if their count doesn't match your car = powertain warranty block. They don't even care what tune is in it. Some match mileage in multiple places so not easy to swap computers...etc.
You have to understand that warranty costs are big time bottom line item. They have to put so much money aside (warranty accrual) to cover it. Not to mention the PR around quality/warranty issues.

So they are going to fight to exclude out of spec mods period. As several have mentioned they have FULL TIME departments (lawyers, engineers etc.) to deal with this kind of thing. MMWA only covers in spec parts, not in spec, not covered -- there's even language in the warranties for that.

Can you fight it sure, hire $200-400/hour lawyer, plus your own "automotive experts" to testify against the company that has literally thousands of engineers, testing data etc. Probably only going to be 5-10x more than the damn repair.

If you're going to mod, pay to play.

 

[jeepin48]

Does anyone care to talk(or argue according to this thread) about if a warranty could be denied for a Tazer? It does not really change much and more so activates other factory settings.

 

[JRobes]

Does anyone care to talk(or argue according to this thread) about if a warranty could be denied for a Tazer? It does not really change much and more so activates other factory settings.

If all you are doing is changing factory settings (enable aux buttons, change to led lights, adjust tire size, etc), this is where I'd agree with ArmyMP that it would likely fall under Magnusson Moss Act and aligns to what the John Deere lawsuits were about. I think you'd have strong legal grounds to challenge any warranty denials in that case, but who really knows.

Now, if you're using tazer to lock your axles in a way FCA didn't intend you to, or using the new brake lock turn aid that locks up a rear wheel for tight turns, and something breaks, you would likely be on the hook if they know the tazer aided in the failure.

 

[sharpsicle]

Does anyone care to talk(or argue according to this thread) about if a warranty could be denied for a Tazer? It does not really change much and more so activates other factory settings.

Tazer recommends unmarrying the unit before getting any warranty work done to avoid potential warranty issues. It's not the things you know about that end up causing a problem, but something that wasn't even on your radar gets cited as a reason for denial that you need to be careful of.

As Donald Rumsfeld said:
"...because as we know, there are known knowns; there are things we know we know. We also know there are known unknowns; that is to say we know there are some things we do not know. But there are also unknown unknowns—the ones we don't know we don't know. And if one looks throughout the history of our country and other free countries, it is the latter category that tends to be the difficult ones."

...just replace "countries" with "warranty claims" and the sentiment is oddly accurate...

 

[sharpsicle]

@ArmyMP You aren't helping anyone, and I mean anyone, with these diatribes. Advocating to the OP to not do something simple that can avoid a confrontation, and then encouraging them to provoke said confrontation, is bad judgment.

@ArmyMP you can waste your time by being "that guy" that screams in a dealership just to try and prove he's right despite losing the respect of everyone in there. For anyone else, I recommend just removing the tuner before you get service work done in order to have the smoothest experience possible. Anyone who's spent time in the performance modification game knows these expectations going in. Even the manufacturers of these modifications recommend it.

 

[glassjawkid32]

Laws are broken all the time. The point we seem to be missing here is that "the act" gets thrown around all day long on forums and it simply doesn't stop warranties from going out the door. Could you fight and win? Probably, but will it be worth it? Probably not the vast majority of the time. There's shitty dealerships and good dealerships. The best plan of attack isn't to just sit back and say "I wish a mother fucker would." Just find a good dealership or remove said device until after repairs to avoid headache. Has nothing to do with being a "sheep".

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