What does installing rubicon suspension get you?

[Snowdogyyz]

I have an Overland. I see lots of rubicon suspensions for sale. What would I gain from installing it under the overland? I’m considering a mild lift and was curious if this gives a little added height.

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[Hootbro]

I think it gets you maybe 3/4" of lift. If you have the Max Tow package, it really is somewhat of a capacity downgrade.

 

[ShadowsPapa]

There's a thread where a fellow did this on his and gained an inch on the front and I think 1.25" on the rear. The Rubicons I measured sit 1" higher than a stock Overland (yeah, accounting for the different tires, I measure axle to body rather than to the ground) But this forum member had before and after pics and measurements of his own.
I am strongly considering Rubicon springs and shocks and links for my own Overland - as well as finding some better snow and ice tires, perhaps the Rubicon A/T tires and wheels.
It won't take the "rake" out of the overland. I'd like to take a half inch to inch of rake out.

 

[NaughtyGeek]

The Rubicon suspension won't lift your Gladiator so if you're planning to lift it, skip it. Best thing you can do is go test drive a Rubicon. If you feel the ride is markedly improved and don't really need/want a lift then you can get a screaming deal on an upgraded ride.

 

[ShadowsPapa]

The Rubicon suspension won't lift your Gladiator so if you're planning to lift it, skip it. Best thing you can do is go test drive a Rubicon. If you feel the ride is markedly improved and don't really need/want a lift then you can get a screaming deal on an upgraded ride.

The Rubicon springs are taller and yeah, it will lift. There's at least one, maybe two, here who have installed Rubicon springs and gotten about an inch lift out of it - they have pictures and measured.
The Rubicon sits about an inch higher from the factory and that's due to springs. Dealer even told me as much - he said "they have about an inch higher stand from the factory" or words to that effect.
I may have saved a link to the fellow who posted here that he put Rubicon springs under his and gained an inch.......I thought I saved it as I was planning on the same thing.

 

[NaughtyGeek]

The increase in tire size on the Rubicon is equal to the listed ground clearance improvement in the specs over the other models. If you actually want a lift, my advice would be to purchase a lift. If you want the improved handling of the Rubicon and not necessarily a lift than the Rubicon suspension is a good deal.

As to those that have achieved some measure of lift going to the Rubicon suspension, the base weight of the Rubicon is 400 pounds more than the Sport S and 330 lbs more than the Overland so yes, the springs could cause your rig to achieve some lift but that would quickly be consumed by modifications. Aftermarket lifts generally state lift amounts lower than what is actually achieved because of weight variations between individual vehicles. So if you actually want a lift, the Rubicon suspension is not the way to go.

 

[ShadowsPapa]

Sorry it's not the tires. I have found one of the multiple threads I was talking about.
The Rubicon springs are LONGER by an inch. More than one person has swapped springs and achieved a lift of 1 to 1.25" proving it's not tires. The springs themselves are longer springs.
I measured - not from the ground which would include tire differences but other areas and the Rubicon is higher not only because of tires but what the dealer called a "factory lift".

Here are the curb weights -
the Rubicon is the heaviest but most of the extra weight is DRIVETRAIN - AXLES. So those are unsprung weight and don't sit on and compress the springs. The vehicle itself as far as sprung weight it's that much different. It's the larger axle diameter and the extra 10mm or so tube thickness that gives it the large weight difference.
The Overland has the smaller axles and axle tubes are thinner, contributing to the weight difference.
Overland is heavier than Sport because of the added things like door locks, power windows, larger display and other stuff.

Curb Weight Rubicon 5050 lbs. Sport 4650 lbs. Overland 4720 lbs.
Most of that 300 pound difference sits under the springs, not over. I suspect there's not even 100 pounds difference in sprung weight. What does the Rubicon have that the Overland or Sport do not? It's not in the cab. My Overland has everything a Rubicon has except the drive train heft (and taller springs)

Here are the spring numbers - Base Sport and Overland have the softest coils.
Overland gets 440/441 rear coils even with the towing package.
Max Tow upgrades to 444/445 coils in the rear.
Rubicon gets 450/451 rear coils.
The Max Tow coils are also progressive, so that with higher loads they handle the weight better.

So if you put Rubicon suspension on an Overland it will lift it about an inch. That's because the springs are indeed longer, not because of vehicle weight differences because almost all of the difference is the axles. The vehicles themselves weigh almost the same (the sway bar disconnect is part of the vehicle sprung weight difference - but what's that really weigh?

Read ColoradoGlad's posts here -
https://www.jeepgladiatorforum.com/forum/threads/upgrade-to-sport-s-to-rubicon-suspension.19916/

I know I could find at least a couple other similar examples. He is not the only one who did this as I saw pics earlier this week of another such swap.

 

[ShadowsPapa]

the base weight of the Rubicon is 400 pounds more than the Sport S and 330 lbs more than the Overland

The sprung weight is almost the same Overland to Rubicon.
The weight you mention is AXLES.
The axles are larger diameter, longer and the axle tubes are 10 mm thicker and the Rubicon has lockers.
The Overland axles are a total of about 1.5 inches shorter, the axle tubes are thinner, the axle shafts themselves are smaller diameter and the Rubicon has locking axles.
I just listed almost 400 pounds of weight difference - all under the springs.

 

[NaughtyGeek]

If the weight difference is only under the suspension, how would the Rubicon suspension gain any lift since the clearance of the Rubicon is only greater than the Sport and Overland by the tire size?

 

[ShadowsPapa]

Yeah the weight is the WHOLE vehicle, curb weight is everything as shipped, fluids, tires, axles, all of it.

I guess what I was saying is that the same springs under the Overland vs. under the Rubicon won't be compressed much more at all under the Rubicon frame because most of the difference is under the springs - so they'd sit nearly the same under either.
The Rubicon axles being fatter and longer, axle housings being thicker and longer, the lockers in the differential housing, that sort of thing - would love to know how much heavier those are compared to the narrower and lighter axles under the Overland.

 

[Reasons]

If anything, the Fox shocks are an improvement from your Overland shocks.

 

[ShadowsPapa]

If anything, the Fox shocks are an improvement from your Overland shocks.

Yeah if I can grab a set of take off suspension stuff - springs, shocks, links, whatever's needed.... problem is it's all several states away and no one wants to ship.

 

[WXman]

A guy in another thread recently compared Rubicon coils to Max Tow coils and said there was almost zero difference in height. But the Rubicon coils were spongy and linear. So I think the high rise fenders and slightly larger tires are where the Rubicon height comes from.

 

[ShadowsPapa]

A guy in another thread recently compared Rubicon coils to Max Tow coils and said there was almost zero difference in height. But the Rubicon coils were spongy and linear. So I think the high rise fenders and slightly larger tires are where the Rubicon height comes from.

A couple of guys here did measure about an inch difference with the Rubicon springs (I believe they put them on Overland) - but them why would anyone put Rubicon springs on a max tow JT?
When I measure vehicle height differences I measure center of axle or hub to a point that will be the same on both vehicles - I got about an inch measuring on the dealer lot.
If the Rubicon has a 33 and the Overland has a 32 (the tire guy said mine come in at 32) then you have only a half inch difference in the height of the vehicle. The radius of the tire is what you would use to determine how much a tire would raise a vehicle compared to another.

 

[Buzzlb]

I did the Rubicon swap on my Overland, you gain 1”+ rear and 1.25”+ front and nice aluminum shocks, room for 35’s, no change in the ride.

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