Help me make up my mind

[Pescatoral Pursuit]

We will be adding fox 2.5 race shocks, and a lift to come as close to a diesel Mojave as possible.

Naw. You'll have a diesel with shocks and a lift.
What makes a Mojave a Mojave is the frame mods and suspension components under the 3.6.

Probably the closest you can come to a Mojave is a Max Tow Sport (because of the gears and LSD) then add fancy shocks and a little lift.
The extra weight of the diesel engine will never let it perform close to that of a Mojave.

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[WILDHOBO]

Daily driving and light offroading = Definitely not Rubicon. That's like buying a sledgehammer to hang pictures on drywall. In fact, I've heard some people say that because the Rubicon is so built for hardcore offroading that it makes a worse daily driver than other trims. (Obviously you CAN daily drive one - my wife does - but it's not ideal.)

I'm going to vote for the Mojave in this case. As a previous poster mentioned, it already has a slight lift compared to the Rubicon, and for light offroading, it has absolutely everything you could ask for. The big shocks make for a cushy daily driver, and the high fender flares give you the option to go up to 35s if you want.

Ultimately, I'm highly skeptical that you would really save money going with a lower trim. I ended up buying my Mojave specifically because of all of things I would have ended up wanting to do to a Sport/Overland, it came within a couple grand. Which, over the span of years, is basically nothing.

Well said. I couldn’t agree more. And from personal experience with a friend and forum member, the stock Mohave can do way more than light off roading. Way more.

 

[Dryfly24]

Maybe what OP is looking for is an Overland!

I was thinking the same thing.

 

[Escape.idiocracy]

Naw. You'll have a diesel with shocks and a lift.
What makes a Mojave a Mojave is the frame mods and suspension components under the 3.6.

Probably the closest you can come to a Mojave is a Max Tow Sport (because of the gears and LSD) then add fancy shocks and a little lift.
The extra weight of the diesel engine will never let it perform close to that of a Mojave.

https://www.jeepgladiatorforum.com/...-pics-and-chassis-suspension-breakdown.27544/

i don’t think I missed out on too much. I will add fox hydro bumps (front and rear ) to the list. I’ll take the elockers over lsd gears are a mute point- 440lbs will make up the mechanical advantage of the 0.37 gear difference… and the diesel comes with the same cast iron knuckles as the Mojave.

I’m not concerned about the “additional” welding on the frame seam- based off the go fast camper bend and a few others I have seen, re-enforce the cab down bend with 3/16’s on either side to sandwich the weak link. But at that point we are comparing built rigs full send down big desert roads…. And stock formation Mojave’s are t going to keep up anyway.

 

[Pescatoral Pursuit]

https://www.jeepgladiatorforum.com/...-pics-and-chassis-suspension-breakdown.27544/

i don’t think I missed out on too much. I will add fox hydro bumps (front and rear ) to the list. I’ll take the elockers over lsd gears are a mute point- 440lbs will make up the mechanical advantage of the 0.37 gear difference… and the diesel comes with the same cast iron knuckles as the Mojave.

I’m not concerned about the “additional” welding on the frame seam- based off the go fast camper bend and a few others I have seen, re-enforce the cab down bend with 3/16’s on either side to sandwich the weak link. But at that point we are comparing built rigs full send down big desert roads…. And stock formation Mojave’s are t going to keep up anyway.

What the Mojave frame does to support sending it, the diesel frame does to support the extra weight without any left over to send it. Shocks or no, your diesel or mine (w lift and adjustable piggyback shocks) couldn't keep up with a stock Mojave on a track. What you have in power you lose in balance, weight, and control.
Been down that road. ("I'll just add some shocks and my Rubicon will forget it has 400 more pounds over the front tires." Not!)

 

[Seal]

I was thinking the same thing.

Yeah. Overlands look ok.

Maybe you should buy one!

 

[Escape.idiocracy]

What the Mojave frame does to support sending it, the diesel frame does to support the extra weight without any left over to send it. Shocks or no, your diesel or mine (w lift and adjustable piggyback shocks) couldn't keep up with a stock Mojave on a track. What you have in power you lose in balance, weight, and control.
Been down that road. ("I'll just add some shocks and my Rubicon will forget it has 400 more pounds over the front tires." Not!)

There is a huge misconception to the weight of the diesel. I’ll try and edit this later when I find the thread where another member and I were conversing about the 392 swap and the diesel…. Going off memory it’s a 408lb motor…. The 392 bare block is like 510lbs? I’ll look up the weight of the 3.6 and include it when I edit…. The motor weight differences are not as extreme as you would think…. Is the diesel heavier than the 3.6 for sure. But it’s within a 100lbs or so…
It is a 3.0 diesel…. Not a 5.9, 6.0, 6.7L 1,000# diesel…. It’s tiny!


145 lb difference between motors…..
I don’t see how this is going to make a huge difference for balance, weight, and control.
Don’t get me wrong… the Mojave is badass for what it is…. But a rubicon with the discussed suspension I don’t think is going to be a slouch…. the frame flaw… well that should probably be addressed by anyone who is going to hoonigan their Jeep ???

edit 1- 3.6l weights 340#’s
https://dustrunnersauto.com/chrysler-3-6l-pentastar-v6-everything-you-need-to-know/

edit2-
Gen 2 ecodiesel motor weighed in at 485lbs….. couldn’t find a site listing the Gen 3 ecodiesel weight….(I’ll edit if I find it…)
https://dustrunnersauto.com/chrysler-3-0l-ecodiesel-everything-you-need-to-know/


Post 143
https://www.jeepgladiatorforum.com/forum/threads/no-v8-jt.62696/page-10#post-1033439

 

[Dryfly24]

Yeah. Overlands look ok.

Maybe you should buy one!

Why would I? I‘m not in the market. I’m perfectly happy with my Rubicon.

 

[Seal]

Why would I? I‘m not in the market. I’m perfectly happy with my Rubicon.

They look pretty nicee. I might drive one this weekend to check them out. Word on the street is the ride is so good that Mr. Whipple from the Charmin commercials drives one!

 

[willhonkforparts]

For what it’s worth…

Ive owned Jeeps most of my adult life, long before the Rubicon package was cooked up in some (at the time) Chrysler marketing war room. Yes, the Rubicon is capable but it’s not for everyone. It’s not a security blanket, not a get out of this or that golden ticket nor is it the end all be all off-roader. In the wrong (read inexperienced or over confident) hands it’s a detriment if not a liability.

I had a stock 2002 Wrangler X (only option was A/C) that came out before the first Rubicon in 2003. I wheeled the hell out it for the next 10 years. Breaking things, upgrading things but never did I wish I waited for a Rubicon as those STARTED at $33k…. Over the next 10 years I found the limits of both my skills and the Jeep’s abilities and upgraded both as time and funds permitted. The next 10 years I enjoyed the rig I built knowing everything was purpose built to my liking.

My most recent Jeeps were Gladiators - a gas Texas Trail which I’ve sold (hated leather and the V6) and picked up an Overland Diesel with cloth seats. I thought I’d like leather for the cleanup (dog, mud and muddy dog) but swamp a$$ in the Texas summer heat was a deal breaker. Diesel…mmmm. Back on topic…I looked at a diesel Rubicon as this is likely the last Jeep I’m buying for a long while. Option for option, the Rubicon was $25k more expensive than my comparably equipped Overland minus the paint color. In the end, it wasn’t about the money (well maybe just a little) it was about the enjoyment I had making it my own and not running around with something EVERYONE ELSE HAD at any given shopping mall.

In the shop, I’ve got a 12k winch, rear steel bumper, and other various kit like shackles, lights and sunshades to install. My upgrade plans are a lift(2-4”), upgrade tires (35-37”), add OX cable lockers when up upgrade gears and fix what breaks along the way.

Rubicon USED TO MEAN SOMETHING when it came out, similar to GM’s Z71 and Ford’s FX4 variants of their trucks. They we’re exclusive. You had to know someone, have deep pockets (you still do) and you had a leg up. Now, sadly, they’re just another sticker required for entry to the Dude Jeep Bro club.

The Rubicon was NOT dreamed up in a marketing room. At all. It was was actually a secret underground project by a couple of their engineers who were true offroaders.

 

[Pescatoral Pursuit]

There is a huge misconception to the weight of the diesel. I’ll try and edit this later when I find the thread where another member and I were conversing about the 392 swap and the diesel…. Going off memory it’s a 408lb motor…. The 392 bare block is like 510lbs? I’ll look up the weight of the 3.6 and include it when I edit…. The motor weight differences are not as extreme as you would think…. Is the diesel heavier than the 3.6 for sure. But it’s within a 100lbs or so…
It is a 3.0 diesel…. Not a 5.9, 6.0, 6.7L 1,000# diesel…. It’s tiny!


145 lb difference between motors…..
I don’t see how this is going to make a huge difference for balance, weight, and control.
Don’t get me wrong… the Mojave is badass for what it is…. But a rubicon with the discussed suspension I don’t think is going to be a slouch…. the frame flaw… well that should probably be addressed by anyone who is going to hoonigan their Jeep ???

edit 1- 3.6l weights 340#’s
https://dustrunnersauto.com/chrysler-3-6l-pentastar-v6-everything-you-need-to-know/

edit2-
Gen 2 ecodiesel motor weighed in at 485lbs….. couldn’t find a site listing the Gen 3 ecodiesel weight….(I’ll edit if I find it…)
https://dustrunnersauto.com/chrysler-3-0l-ecodiesel-everything-you-need-to-know/


Post 143
https://www.jeepgladiatorforum.com/forum/threads/no-v8-jt.62696/page-10#post-1033439

Nice stats. Doesn't change the fact that your diesel won't perform like a Mojave just because "shocks."

They look pretty nicee. I might drive one this weekend to check them out. Word on the street is the ride is so good that Mr. Whipple from the Charmin commercials drives one!

Yeah but Bill Murray drives a Rubicon.

 

[Mikemann0]

They look pretty nicee. I might drive one this weekend to check them out. Word on the street is the ride is so good that Mr. Whipple from the Charmin commercials drives one!

I love my Overland - All stock suspension on 295/70's with zero issues

 

[Sandevino]

The Rubicon was NOT dreamed up in a marketing room. At all. It was was actually a secret underground project by a couple of their engineers who were true offroaders.

The Rubicon Story

Outside of Chrysler, this is one of the best version’s of how the Rubicon came to be. There was a tremendous amount of internal marketing that took place. Yes, a few engineers came up with the idea then they long process of R&D and marketing took place.

 

[Dryfly24]

They look pretty nicee. I might drive one this weekend to check them out. Word on the street is the ride is so good that Mr. Whipple from the Charmin commercials drives one!

Go for it. Like I said before. Everybody has different needs. My Rubicon ticks all my boxes.

I live in the desert southwest and wheel off road at least two or three times a week. Some times in very rough country. I hunt and fish and just like exploring in the middle of nowhere.

But my son and his family live In Minnesota. I drive up there often so I need something that also has good on road manners. Once again the Rubi delivers. It‘s as fine on road as it is off. I personally don’t find the rubicon lacking in on road manners in the least.

I think a lot of people are really splitting hairs in many of these conversations when it comes to performance on pavement. But again, that’s just me. I never even considered anything other than a Rubicon - except maybe the Mojave - because I really needed the off road capability. In the end the Rubi won hands down.

The only way you’ll know what suits you best is to test drive the various offerings.

 

[XJADDICTION]

Okay, two ways I might go here.

One is to get a Rubicon or Mojave and leave it largely stock, for daily driving and light offroading.

The other is to save a few thousand, buy a Sport S with some options that I want, have the dealer install the Mopar 2 inch lift on it, put some decent sized tires on it straight away. I figure with that approach, I might save $5-$10,000. But obviously, would have no lockers.

Any thoughts?

IMOP, I’ve owned 20 Jeeps many with lockers including a 2016 Rubicon JKU. Unless you are doing some serious rock crawling you do not need to waste money on lockers.

Also IMOP after many issues with factory Jeep lockers, I would buy aftermarket (ARB lockers) anyway.

this is why I bought my sport s Max Tow. 4:10 gears, limited rear slip. I have 0 issues on moderate to difficult trails without lockers. Most of the time I am in 2 wheel drive and only use 4 LO for steep loose descending. Modern day traction control takes care of any issues with a tire in the air and with my lift (haven’t tried the new Clayton lift yet) and 37” tires I don’t lift wheels anyway.

save the money and go sport s and add what you need as you need it.

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