Any updates on replacement FP?

[jeepstrjohn]

Hello all......I stopped by the local dealership today and was hoping for some progressive news about the CP4 safety recall. What the heck was I thinking? When I asked the recall manager there last month she said "should be able to start ordering parts on 9/13, now she says maybe by 10/01. I am number 13 on the list to get this done. And, she mentioned that they normally can only order parts for 1 recall at a time. When asked what parts they will be replacing the answer was there is no set fix yet so they would be only guessing, maybe a replacement with CP3 she said.

Has anyone heard anything different? Or actually recieved a repair order showing what the fix was/will be?

I feel for any of you that have a dead in the water ecodiesel and are at the mercy of FCA. I am fortunate with only 3500 miles on my jeep, but I am anxious since I have a spare ECU and can't wait to "lose" the extra weight, but dont want to pass up the ??fix??.

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[kb5zcr]

There has been talk over on the Ram 1500 diesel forum (lots more ecodiesel owners in the 1500 pickups). I think some pumps are going out to the Ram dealers for the pickups (same ecodiesel engine).
I ordered a diesel gladiator and wanted to learn more about this engine, there are a lot more 1500 Ram diesel owners than gladiators, so a lot more discussion.

 

[aevgladitorrubi]

There has been talk over on the Ram 1500 diesel forum (lots more ecodiesel owners in the 1500 pickups). I think some pumps are going out to the Ram dealers for the pickups (same ecodiesel engine).
I ordered a diesel gladiator and wanted to learn more about this engine, there are a lot more 1500 Ram diesel owners than gladiators, so a lot more discussion.

same engine, but more torque-- 480 vs 440 in JT

 

[John in the Woods]

@JeepCares has said replacement CP4 and late October rollout. That, of course, is subject to change.

https://www.jeepgladiatorforum.com/...ailure-2021-2023-gladiator.69076/post-1179154

I’m a few miles shy of 70k on my 2021 JTRD. So far, so good, fuel pump wise.

 

[JeepCares]

@JeepCares has said replacement CP4 and late October rollout. That, of course, is subject to change.

https://www.jeepgladiatorforum.com/...ailure-2021-2023-gladiator.69076/post-1179154

I’m a few miles shy of 70k on my 2021 JTRD. So far, so good, fuel pump wise.

Our target date is 9/26/23 for the JL and JT. More information will be provided once we get more insight. Thank you for your patience and cooperation.

William
Jeep Cares

 

[rharr]

@JeepCares has said replacement CP4 and late October rollout. That, of course, is subject to change.

https://www.jeepgladiatorforum.com/...ailure-2021-2023-gladiator.69076/post-1179154

I’m a few miles shy of 70k on my 2021 JTRD. So far, so good, fuel pump wise.

When did you pick it up?
" [Jeep] The suspect period began on November 2, 2021, when 3.0L Diesel engines with suspect HPFPs were introduced into vehicle production, and ended on January 13, 2023, when 3.0L Diesel engine vehicle production ended. The suspect period was determined using field data and engineering change records. "

https://www.jeepgladiatorforum.com/...ailure-2021-2023-gladiator.69076/post-1188059

I am curious since I have a April 2021 build and that is on fringe of the dates.

 

[rharr]

Our target date is 9/26/23 for the JL and JT. More information will be provided once we get more insight. Thank you for your patience and cooperation.

William
Jeep Cares

@JeepCares, take a look at this link with the offical Part 573 Safety Recall Report 23V-263 , it has dates and time tables for the recall.

https://www.jeepgladiatorforum.com/...ailure-2021-2023-gladiator.69076/post-1188059

"Description of Recall Schedule : **08/15/2023: FCA US will notify dealers and begin notifying owners with the Final Owner letter, in phases, starting with the Jeep Wrangler, and Jeep Gladiator, on or about 10/24/2023. FCA US will notify dealers and begin notifying owners with the Final Owner letter, of the Ram 1500, on or about 11/21/2023."

 

[John in the Woods]

When did you pick it up?
" [Jeep] The suspect period began on November 2, 2021, when 3.0L Diesel engines with suspect HPFPs were introduced into vehicle production, and ended on January 13, 2023, when 3.0L Diesel engine vehicle production ended. The suspect period was determined using field data and engineering change records. "

https://www.jeepgladiatorforum.com/...ailure-2021-2023-gladiator.69076/post-1188059

I am curious since I have a April 2021 build and that is on fringe of the dates.

I ordered as soon as they became available, with a July 2020 build and an October 2020 delivery. I’ve been officially notified that I’m part of the recall, and as far as I gather from the Fed safety recall announcement, it’s all of us. From the beginning of this generation of EcoDiesel right up until all the diesels they have sitting on lots under no-sale orders right now. We’re all in it together.

 

[Dyzard]

So I really want one of these… and have been waiting for a few years for the kinks to be worked out… do I just give up, or pull the trigger buy a used one that would still be under warranty and then get the update FP when it’s there?

 

[22EcoDs]

So I really want one of these… and have been waiting for a few years for the kinks to be worked out… do I just give up, or pull the trigger buy a used one that would still be under warranty and then get the update FP when it’s there?

Find a cpo 7y/100k mile powertrain

 

[John in the Woods]

So I really want one of these… and have been waiting for a few years for the kinks to be worked out… do I just give up, or pull the trigger buy a used one that would still be under warranty and then get the update FP when it’s there?

Pull the trigger. It’s a great truck.

 

[Wolf Island Diver]

I spoke to my dealership Friday. Zero updates. No ETA. Nothing. No further correspondence from Jeep. I’ve read here about a list. What list? People are talking about this Sept/October time frame. I’ve heard none of this. So I’m in this place where I don’t know if people are getting bad info or just really good insider info, Jeep isn’t disseminating information to dealerships at the same time or my dealership just sucks. This is getting really old.

 

[Mr._Bill]

Everyone wants to blame Stellantis and sue them for not yet providing a resolution, but this is not a problem they are responsible for creating. They are stuck in the middle because they picked an Italian diesel engine using a German fuel pump with a manufacturer denying that there is a problem. How do you get a timely resolution for that? Stellantis will have to pay, and it will drive up the costs for future vehicles, but there's only so much they can do. The government has made it an issue, and Stellantis is meeting the minimum requirements for compliance, but they cannot provide information they don't yet have.

 

[Wolf Island Diver]

Everyone wants to blame Stellantis and sue them for not yet providing a resolution, but this is not a problem they are responsible for creating. They are stuck in the middle because they picked an Italian diesel engine using a German fuel pump with a manufacturer denying that there is a problem. How do you get a timely resolution for that? Stellantis will have to pay, and it will drive up the costs for future vehicles, but there's only so much they can do. The government has made it an issue, and Stellantis is meeting the minimum requirements for compliance, but they cannot provide information they don't yet have.

There’s a lot wrong here so let me address them individually. Full disclosure, I’m not a lawyer but I did work as a product liability investigator for a law firm for a number of years and I’m pretty familiar with how these lawsuits work.

Stellantis has already been successfully sued because of this engine. It’s not like some randomly installed part. Significant engineering was done on Jeeps part to make it happen but it really doesn’t matter. They’re the packager and seller of this final product. They’re liable. VM Motori is also wholly owned subsidiary of Stellantis. Also, if the fact that the problem part is Bosch somehow absolves Stellantis of liability, no manufacture is liable for any problem with a vehicle concerning a part they didn’t manufacture. Since cars are assemblages of parts from suppliers this would make suing a manufacturer basically impossible. Now there are always exceptions. A supplier who misrepresents a product to vehicle manufacturer for example.

Lets not forget that this engine was in the Ram first and same pump was replaced with the CP3 in those vehicles. So there was a solution in those cases. This means the Stellantis was both aware of the problem and had implemented a solution previously.

I don’t think we can successfully sue Stellantis for bad communication and delays. The problem is that they sent us notifications last year in writing informing us that a solution would be available 1st quarter of this year. That solution never happened. Further, they told dealerships in writing the same thing. I’ve been provided one of those internal documents. The delay isn’t necessarily the issue legally although it actually become one. can become one particularly if it’s revealed through discovery that the delay is part of some tactic rather than based on technical or logistical considerations. There will be an issue if there really isn’t a solution especially if there never was. Again this will come out in discovery. If sometime late this year or next, they come back telling us that they will buy back these trucks then many of us will have incurred a significant monetary loss. We could have sold these trucks a year ago but we were repeatedly lead to believe a solution was a few months away.

The government didn’t make this an issue. It was an issue. A vehicle that can suddenly cut off at speed is dangerous to the driver, passengers and other vehicles. The federal regulator has a compelling interest in any vehicle that has a defect that can result in this. The regulator forced their hand but this begs the question, would Stellantis have even addressed this without government intervention?

As far as the interplay between Bosch and Stellantis, has anyone actually verified this? I’ve heard a lot of innuendo but not a lot of verified information. Do we know for a fact that Bosch denies there’s a problem? For a while it was a defect in a run of pumps and the delay was supply chain issues. For a while it was fuel lubrocity. Then it was design problems and diesel mechanics have made a compelling case for this. Recently there’s been talk about a fuel saving mode at idle resulting in cavitation and a software fix. There’s been talk from people on this forum that Jeep is scheduling actual replacements but has anyone actually had the solution applied? My dealership tells me as late as Friday that they’ve been told nothing from Stellantis on the state of this recall.

At the end of the day, we didn’t pay Bosch for these trucks. We paid Jeep. It’s their responsibility to either keep us informed of the status or institute a buyback. From a customers standpoint the root cause or the deliberations between the manufacturers and their vender are moot. That’s a black box. We’ve been driving a vehicle the government says isn’t safe enough to sell, that’s losing value and may end up unsellable in the final equation. We need to know that an actual solution is being implemented and given a reasonable time frame or told that there is no solution so we can take reasonable next steps to prevent further monetary loss.

 

[Mr._Bill]

There’s a lot wrong here so let me address them individually. Full disclosure, I’m not a lawyer but I did work as a product liability investigator for a law firm for a number of years and I’m pretty familiar with how these lawsuits work.

Stellantis has already been successfully sued because of this engine. It’s not like some randomly installed part. Significant engineering was done on Jeeps part to make it happen but it really doesn’t matter. They’re the packager and seller of this final product. They’re liable. Also, if the fact that the problem part is Bosch somehow absolves Stellantis of liability, no manufacture is liable for any problem with a vehicle concerning a part they didn’t manufacture. Since cars are assemblages of parts from suppliers this would make suing a manufacturer basically impossible. Now there are always exceptions. A supplier who misrepresents a product to vehicle manufacturer for example.

Lets not forget that this engine was in the Ram first and same pump was replaced with the CP3 in those vehicles. So there was a solution in those cases. This means the Stellantis was both aware of the problem and had implemented a solution previously.

I don’t think we can successfully sue Stellantis for bad communication and delays. The problem is that they sent us notifications last year in writing informing us that a solution would be available 1st quarter of this year. That solution never happened. Further, they told dealerships in writing the same thing. I’ve been provided one of those internal documents. The delay isn’t necessarily the issue legally although it actually become one. can become one particularly if it’s revealed through discovery that the delay is part of some tactic rather than based on technical or logistical considerations. There will be an issue if there really isn’t a solution especially if there never was. Again this will come out in discovery. If sometime late this year or next, they come back telling us that they will buy back these trucks then many of us will have incurred a significant monetary loss. We could have sold these trucks a year ago but we were repeatedly lead to believe a solution was a few months away.

The government didn’t make this an issue. It was an issue. A vehicle that can suddenly cut off at speed is dangerous to the driver, passengers and other vehicles. The federal regulator has a compelling interest in any vehicle that has a defect that can result in this. The regulator forced their hand but this begs the question, would Stellantis have even addressed this without government intervention?

As far as the interplay between Bosch and Stellantis, has anyone actually verified this? I’ve heard a lot of innuendo but not a lot of verified information. Do we know for a fact that Bosch denies there’s a problem? For a while it was a defect in a run of pumps and the delay was supply chain issues. For a while it was fuel lubrocity. Then it was design problems and diesel mechanics have made a compelling case for this. Recently there’s been talk about a fuel saving mode at idle resulting in cavitation and a software fix. There’s been talk from people on this forum that Jeep is scheduling actual replacements but has anyone actually had the solution applied? My dealership tells me as late as Friday that they’ve been told nothing from Stellantis on the state of this recall.

At the end of the day, we didn’t pay Bosch for these trucks. We paid Jeep. It’s their responsibility to either keep us informed of the status or institute a buyback. From a customers standpoint the root cause or the deliberations between the manufacturers and their vender are moot. That’s a black box. We’ve been driving a vehicle the government says isn’t safe enough to sell, that’s losing value and may end up unsellable in the final equation. We need to know that an actual solution is being implemented and given a reasonable time frame or told that there is no solution so we can take reasonable next steps to prevent further monetary loss.

There's nothing wrong with what I wrote. I never said Stellantis is not liable. They can't provide information they don't have, or a solution that is not yet available. I'm quite certain the lawyers are keeping them on a short leash to limit further induced liability.

There are a lot of unknowns in this. If the solution they finally provide is not satisfactory, then it will be time to consider legal action.

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