Build sheet questions: "Off road group" on a 23 Sport

[ecidiego]

Yea that word. Watts!

You're right too! P = V*I! Voltage remains constant so naturally to get 850w versus the regular 600w, the amperage is higher!

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[Redleg37]

You're right.

It's only missing the...

- Tires
- Axles
- Gears
- Rear limited slip
- Hitch
- HD engine cooling (higher amp fan)
- Trailer hitch zoom
- Different springs

It's almost like the only thing they have in common is the alternator

It has upgraded tires, limited slip, hitch, hd engine cooling, and different springs and shocks from the regular sport. By my count that’s 5 of the 8 features you listed and I said upfront it didn’t have the gears or axles.

 

[ShadowsPapa]

Hey my Mojave has a lot that!!! lol

Same:

- Axles
- Gears
- Hitch
- HD engine cooling (higher amp wattage fan)
- Trailer hitch zoom

Well, at the same voltage it would draw more amperage in order to get the watts.
That is unless you run your "bigger fan" on 18 volts or whatever to get the wattage.
You can cheaply increase the wattage out of your stereo by simply applying more voltage.

 

[ShadowsPapa]

It has the MT tires, limited slip, hitch, hd engine cooling, and different springs and shocks from the regular sport. By my count that’s 5 of the 8 features you listed and I said upfront it didn’t have the gears or axles.

Max tow has smaller, non-mud tires, lighter tires and wheels. Max tow doesn't have those heavy mud terrain tires with higher rolling resistance and weight.

Different sprigs don't count because those will be for off-road, not towing, so you'd have to take off your springs and put max tow springs and shocks under it and remove your off-road springs and shocks.
So take away your tires and wheels and shocks and springs and that leaves you 2 out of the 5 you are counting. (or 2 out of 8)
Max tow does not have MT tires- minus that - and max tow likely has lighter wheels.
Max tow doesn't have the off-road springs and shocks so minus that one.
I'm curious - look at the door jamb sticker for your payload numbers - wonder what those are on that truck.
The tow rating will still be for a Sport with tow package - I believe that's 6,000 pounds.

Here's an example of what it may look like and where to look for payload ->

 

[ChrisNLA]

It has the MT tires, limited slip, hitch, hd engine cooling, and different springs and shocks from the regular sport. By my count that’s 5 of the 8 features you listed and I said upfront it didn’t have the gears or axles.

Comparing strictly Off Road Group to Max Tow, that does not appear to be the case. No mention is made of a limited slip, a hitch, different springs, or cooling in this package.

I did find a separate listing that shows 'sport' suspension, but 'sport' and 'Max Tow' are not the same function, and I'd bet not the same suspension. The suspension in the Max Tow is set up to have a higher GVW, specifically. Shadows Papa found that the Max Tow springs are actually shorter than at least the Overland but carry the weight better (IIRC).

https://www.jeepgladiatorforum.com/...ses-off-road-group-for-gladiator-sport.66525/

Now, if you buy a Sport and add Off Road Group AND the regular tow package, you'll gain the HD cooling, hitch, and hitch zoom. You will still be missing the most critical components (wide axles, 4.10 gears, limited slip, and a higher GVW) AND you'll be paying the same as just having bought a Max Tow but instead will get some loud ass tires, black wheels, and switches instead of a real benefit - better gears, wider axles, and a limited slip.

So - Max Tow and Off Road Group are not basically alike. The Off Road Group (even with base Tow Pack) is missing literally all of the critical components of a Max Tow.

 

[ChrisNLA]

Max tow has smaller, non-mud tires, lighter tires and wheels. Max tow doesn't have those heavy mud terrain tires with higher rolling resistance and weight.

Different sprigs don't count because those will be for off-road, not towing, so you'd have to take off your springs and put max tow springs and shocks under it and remove your off-road springs and shocks.
So take away your tires and wheels and shocks and springs and that leaves you 2 out of the 5 you are counting. (or 2 out of 8)
Max tow does not have MT tires- minus that - and max tow likely has lighter wheels.
Max tow doesn't have the off-road springs and shocks so minus that one.
I'm curious - look at the door jamb sticker for your payload numbers - wonder what those are on that truck.
The tow rating will still be for a Sport with tow package - I believe that's 6,000 pounds.

Here's an example of what it may look like and where to look for payload ->

Specs from 2020.

4000 manual
4500 auto with no tow pack
6000 auto with tow pack
7650 auto max tow (now 7700)
Slightly higher GVW with Max Tow as well

 

[ShadowsPapa]

People keep missing the point that the max tow has small tires - small diameter. There's a reason - they wanted to keep engine RPM up, keep the load down. the small diameter tires coupled with the 4.10 gearing keeps the engine RPM up for better heat rejection numbers.
Start changing tires - you've just un-max tow'd it.

 

[ShadowsPapa]

Specs from 2020.

4000 manual
4500 auto with no tow pack
6000 auto with tow pack
7650 auto max tow (now 7700)
Slightly higher GVW with Max Tow as well

Yeah, I was wondering what his final payload numbers were for that configuration without max tow.
Trailer weights are pretty easy since those are standards posted in "the book" but payload varies from truck to truck, although max tow's payload is higher from the start than other levels of the JT.
His towing will be the standard 6,000 pounds.
It won't be helped by mud tires, but that's another subject.

 

[ChrisNLA]

Yeah, I was wondering what his final payload numbers were for that configuration without max tow.
Trailer weights are pretty easy since those are standards posted in "the book" but payload varies from truck to truck, although max tow's payload is higher from the start than other levels of the JT.
His towing will be the standard 6,000 pounds.
It won't be helped by mud tires, but that's another subject.

My Max Tow sits at 1,471. I hadn't had a chance to check any other regular Sports. Everyone around here only has Willys and Rubicons And the one Rubi I checked was a full 400 pounds less.

 

[ShadowsPapa]

My Max Tow sits at 1,471. I hadn't had a chance to check any other regular Sports. Everyone around here only has Willys and Rubicons And the one Rubi I checked was a full 400 pounds less.

Yeah, but look where you live (gator country - we really want to visit the area sometime but i suppose I'll have to trade for a Rubicon first?)
Your max tow is almost 500 pounds over my Overland for payload.
My other overland was over 1,000, this one, same equipment, is just under 1,000. They must have made the seats heavier or something between 2020 and 2022 as I ordered the new to match my prior and was shocked at the lower payload.
I don't dare mention it to my wife - she'll tell me - "I'm looking at the solution right now"......

 

[ChrisNLA]

Yeah, but look where you live (gator country - we really want to visit the area sometime but i suppose I'll have to trade for a Rubicon first?)
Your max tow is almost 500 pounds over my Overland for payload.
My other overland was over 1,000, this one, same equipment, is just under 1,000. They must have made the seats heavier or something between 2020 and 2022 as I ordered the new to match my prior and was shocked at the lower payload.
I don't dare mention it to my wife - she'll tell me - "I'm looking at the solution right now"......

Visiting here is risky with a low payload capacity. Everyone always leaves heavier

 

[ShadowsPapa]

Visiting here is risky with a low payload capacity. Everyone always leaves heavier

From what I've seen just on TV - I believe it.
I recall a guy from that area who came to Iowa to work as an engineer at CCC - last name of Broussard (spelling??) - he brought in a huge black cast iron pot of something - can't recall the name, and shared it with all the staff who wanted any and I couldn't stop eating the stuff.

 

[ChrisNLA]

From what I've seen just on TV - I believe it.
I recall a guy from that area who came to Iowa to work as an engineer at CCC - last name of Broussard (spelling??) - he brought in a huge black cast iron pot of something - can't recall the name, and shared it with all the staff who wanted any and I couldn't stop eating the stuff.

Oh yea. If you show up somewhere down here and a big black iron pot is present - you know its gonna be good.

Heck, around here all the local country stores, markets, trailer and equipment places, outdoor stands...all have a section dedicated to cast iron and the pots range from stove top size to bath tub size. Giant cast iron usually dedicated to red beans, gumbo, etouffee, jambalaya, pastalaya, etc.

And then there is the boudin shops on the west side of the state. Once a year we spend an entire day doing a 'boudin cruise'. Get up early and drive to 5-7 different shops stocking up on boudin, sausage, and other stranger things...

 

[ShadowsPapa]

Oh yea. If you show up somewhere down here and a big black iron pot is present - you know its gonna be good.

Heck, around here all the local country stores, markets, trailer and equipment places, outdoor stands...all have a section dedicated to cast iron and the pots range from stove top size to bath tub size. Giant cast iron usually dedicated to red beans, gumbo, etouffee, jambalaya, pastalaya, etc.

And then there is the boudin shops on the west side of the state. Once a year we spend an entire day doing a 'boudin cruise'. Get up early and drive to 5-7 different shops stocking up on boudin, sausage, and other stranger things...

Now we just have to go.
I believe what he brought was likely jambalaya. He carried it in, but it was big and heavy.
Every time we watch the old Swamp People episodes - I comment to my wife - there's gonna be onion and peppers in it, count on it. Personally, I like food with a bit of zing or zest or flavor to it.
Yeah, we are going to have to plan another trip.

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