Dealership Charges For Large Tires and Winch??

[GladGreg]

I'd want to see the bumper and winch before rendering an opinion.
As a person who has leaned over fenders for decades and knows how tough it can be to deal with "tall vehicles", I could see tires over 35" being an issue. 37s you have a lift - so the tires and lift mean it's harder to lean over to do the work.
The thing sits clean up in the air compared to their flat rate allowance for the work being done. It does take more time.
I've been there, done that - and now see a cardiologist every year.
It's not easy leaning over tall fenders and lifting weight out 2 feet in front of you.
Try it for a few years.

The bumper, again - if it interferes with the grill removal - IF the grill even must come off for this work, they are allowed xx hours for each job. Add anything that interferes with their ability to meet that time and it costs them money.

I'm coming at this from having been there, done that, for my living for years.
Today, I don't relish the thought of leaning over a pickup fender to lift heavy parts.

A friend had to quit the work because of the pressure he was putting on his heart - doc told him to quit or die.

All of this is being said not seeing your bumper/winch and not seeing their time allowances and so on.


Takes time - if it takes 45 minutes to remove and their rate is near $200/hour, then you have the explanation for the extra charge right there.
I'd not say it's no big deal - but it's time consuming depending on the bumper and winch - skid plate removal for MOPAR steel bumpers means extra screws, unplugging fog lights, takes a few minutes to get it done.

Here is a link to pictures I posted awhile back.
https://www.jeepgladiatorforum.com/forum/threads/sting-gray-gladiator-jt-club.8495/post-605750


I also reached out to Jeep Customer Care. Their only advice was to take it to a different dealer, which I might ultimately do. Appreciate your insight thus far, though.

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[ShadowsPapa]

Tell them you have to remove a bumper and tires anyways. Ask the advisor what the book calls out for each. Tell them you will come remove whatever they need but you want them to pay you the cost. This is calculated and listed in the warranty work.

Why would they have to remove bumper and tires?
It's likely due to the height difference leaning over, and access to the grill for removal. They have no reason to remove a bumper for that work.

 

[Dickster]

Why would they have to remove bumper and tires?
It's likely due to the height difference leaning over, and access to the grill for removal. They have no reason to remove a bumper for that work.

Probably in the warranty procedure.

 

[ShadowsPapa]

Probably in the warranty procedure.

For cams, followers and lash adjusters?
People here have done it with only an open hood.
I can see inconvenience charge for height/lift/tires, but I'm wondering why the grill has to come off.
I re-checked the original post -

Dealership diagnosed it as both camshafts damaged and also requires replacement of rockers and lifters for intake side.

I see no reason to take the front end apart since the cam isn't in the block sliding out the front. It's all top end work. Leaning over the sides, reaching, lifting, etc.

I think he needs a second opinion (try another dealer, in other words)

 

[Dickster]

For cams, followers and lash adjusters?
People here have done it with only an open hood.
I can see inconvenience charge for height/lift/tires, but I'm wondering why the grill has to come off.
I re-checked the original post -

I see no reason to take the front end apart since the cam isn't in the block sliding out the front. It's all top end work. Leaning over the sides, reaching, lifting, etc.

I think he needs a second opinion (try another dealer, in other words)

Yeah idk know either but the dealer has specific guidelines they have to follow to get paid. They have to provide pictures of each phase in order to get paid. Guidelines and procedures set by manufacturer.

 

[Lost1wing]

I'd want to see the bumper and winch before rendering an opinion.
As a person who has leaned over fenders for decades and knows how tough it can be to deal with "tall vehicles", I could see tires over 35" being an issue. 37s you have a lift - so the tires and lift mean it's harder to lean over to do the work.
The thing sits clean up in the air compared to their flat rate allowance for the work being done. It does take more time.
I've been there, done that - and now see a cardiologist every year.
It's not easy leaning over tall fenders and lifting weight out 2 feet in front of you.
Try it for a few years.

The bumper, again - if it interferes with the grill removal - IF the grill even must come off for this work, they are allowed xx hours for each job. Add anything that interferes with their ability to meet that time and it costs them money.

I'm coming at this from having been there, done that, for my living for years.
Today, I don't relish the thought of leaning over a pickup fender to lift heavy parts.

A friend had to quit the work because of the pressure he was putting on his heart - doc told him to quit or die.

All of this is being said not seeing your bumper/winch and not seeing their time allowances and so on.


Takes time - if it takes 45 minutes to remove and their rate is near $200/hour, then you have the explanation for the extra charge right there.
I'd not say it's no big deal - but it's time consuming depending on the bumper and winch - skid plate removal for MOPAR steel bumpers means extra screws, unplugging fog lights, takes a few minutes to get it done.

I can see your point. These are normal modifications people do to their Jeeps. I still think another dealer wouldn't charge for it, at least my dealership said they wouldn't charge me extra to remove my Smart cap to replace the rear window.

Insurance companies only pay $50- $60 for labor for accident repair and even less for paint labor. Why a Dealer charges so much is beyond me. Like I said before, I really don't think they want the job. Maybe they have done a few and it hasn't worked out well for them, who knows.

 

[Dickster]

For cams, followers and lash adjusters?
People here have done it with only an open hood.
I can see inconvenience charge for height/lift/tires, but I'm wondering why the grill has to come off.
I re-checked the original post -

I see no reason to take the front end apart since the cam isn't in the block sliding out the front. It's all top end work. Leaning over the sides, reaching, lifting, etc.

I think he needs a second opinion (try another dealer, in other words)

If I was a mechanic everyday and had a lift. I would take tires off and lower it to the ground.

 

[Freems]

do they normally charge extra to remove wheels and tires and the front bumper during this procedure? it sounds like they’re that kind of business…run the other way quickly to someone who wants your business.

 

[ShadowsPapa]

Insurance companies only pay $50- $60 for labor for accident repair and even less for paint labor. Why a Dealer charges so much is beyond me. Like I said before, I really don't think they want the job. Maybe they have done a few and it hasn't worked out well for them, who knows.

I can't see any shop around here surviving on those low body shop rates.
You want good work done, it's going to cost money. Rates here are not far below 200/hour.
$600 for a GOOD body shop to take care of one small dent and paint a hood - that's well over 60/hour.
A good tech in a good shop working on some vehicles can pull 6 figures easily - figure that person's hourly salary plus benefits, insurance and so on, it adds up.

If I was a mechanic everyday and had a lift. I would take tires off and lower it to the ground.

Yes, that would be my solution - and maybe that's what they'd be charging for as opposed to working on it as it sits on stock tires without a lift.
But that's a fantastic solution, and safe.

The bumper/winch thing is bugging me after re-reading the original post and seeing that the work was only cam related - if they HAD to remove the grill, fine, I see the winch being a problem, and that bumper could be as well, but I'm not recalling anyone pulling a grill off to swap cams, followers and lash adjusters.
I'll sum that up with "I could be wrong" - of course.

 

[Lost1wing]

I can't see any shop around here surviving on those low body shop rates.
You want good work done, it's going to cost money. Rates here are not far below 200/hour.
$600 for a GOOD body shop to take care of one small dent and paint a hood - that's well over 60/hour.
A good tech in a good shop working on some vehicles can pull 6 figures easily - figure that person's hourly salary plus benefits, insurance and so on, it adds up.

I saw my friend repair estimate myself about a month ago. The body shop he took it to agreed to do the work after the dealers proposal was rejected.

 

[Dickster]

I can't see any shop around here surviving on those low body shop rates.
You want good work done, it's going to cost money. Rates here are not far below 200/hour.
$600 for a GOOD body shop to take care of one small dent and paint a hood - that's well over 60/hour.
A good tech in a good shop working on some vehicles can pull 6 figures easily - figure that person's hourly salary plus benefits, insurance and so on, it adds up.


Yes, that would be my solution - and maybe that's what they'd be charging for as opposed to working on it as it sits on stock tires without a lift.
But that's a fantastic solution, and safe.

The bumper/winch thing is bugging me after re-reading the original post and seeing that the work was only cam related - if they HAD to remove the grill, fine, I see the winch being a problem, and that bumper could be as well, but I'm not recalling anyone pulling a grill off to swap cams, followers and lash adjusters.
I'll sum that up with "I could be wrong" - of course.

Oem bumper is 4 bolts and unclip the harness. I would remove they as well if I was to do substantial work. 30mins of work could save you hours if things are not in your way.

 

[SRO]

I can't see any shop around here surviving on those low body shop rates.
You want good work done, it's going to cost money. Rates here are not far below 200/hour.
$600 for a GOOD body shop to take care of one small dent and paint a hood - that's well over 60/hour.
A good tech in a good shop working on some vehicles can pull 6 figures easily - figure that person's hourly salary plus benefits, insurance and so on, it adds up.

I think you are putting body work rates and mechanical rates in the same bucket. Body work rates are far closer to 60 (varies some by area, but this ballpark). Mechanical repair rates for auto damage are significantly higher, typically around double body rates.

 

[JRobes]

Here is a link to pictures I posted awhile back.
https://www.jeepgladiatorforum.com/forum/threads/sting-gray-gladiator-jt-club.8495/post-605750

After seeing you have a bumper with a large welded on hoop and recovery hooks, I wonder if that's the reason for removal. I'd bet standard warranty work doesn't require the factory bumper and winch to come off, but since yours may block access of techs on the front of the vehicle, they may be wanting to just get it out of the way for the warranty work.

 

[ShadowsPapa]

I think you are putting body work rates and mechanical rates in the same bucket. Body work rates are far closer to 60 (varies some by area, but this ballpark). Mechanical repair rates for auto damage are significantly higher, typically around double body rates.

No, not putting them in the same bucket, just saying that 50-60/hour is what the insurance industry published rates were in 2009 around here.
Hard to believe a quality shop will still be at the 2009 rate level, and shops I have dealt with (pros that do top work) charged more just 5 years ago.
($60/hour body and finish is what was reported as average in 2009)

Mechanical work is different.

So if your shops around you are still working at 2009 rates, WOW.

 

[JTGuy]

If the grill has to be removed and the winch cables prevent that, there is a problem. Normal grill removal is easy without bumper removal.

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