Looking for some Advice...

[kevman65]

Wow, not sure where your dealership is, but that's not the case here. In fact, if I dig back I bet I can find the video one dealership sent me while doing the wave oil change and tire rotation. I could hear and see him and he was no kid in school just learning what a 10mm socket looks like.

That's almost funny. You must live in Mexico or something.
Not sure how a certified tech can supervise oil changes when they are usually over-worked with their own work to do.
Maybe act as a supervisor, but they can't be in two places at once doing two things. They make their money on the jobs they submit tickets for - not running around watching others. Supervising beginners takes time and no certified tech is going to want to be missing out on money running back and forth and checking up and being supervisor.

But like I said - it's sure not that way around here.

A few owners on forums will scream really loud "don't do it! They mess up" while hundreds of thousands of Jeep and Ram owners use dealerships for - gas- oil changes, without issue. Few Jeep vehicles are owned by those who do their own oil changes, but the forum makes it look like everyone does due to a vocal few on the topic.
My wife has always gone to dealerships for such work, all her life - almost 50 years worth - never a problem.

No Bill, I live in Indiana.

And once I was told of how the program is run, and I paid attention, it's damned obvious.
The actual Tech's (mechanic's) are wearing dealership shop uniform shirts.

The students are wearing shop shirts with Institution on them. They also have chevrons showing what year they are.

Furthermore, if you ask for it, they will show the agreement that says all students are to be supervised by a Certified Tech. Only problem is, there isn't any in the lube bay. Students and a Service Writer who may or may not know there is no such thing as a metric adjustable wrench.

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[dayusmc]

I never had good luck with dealership service departments (I live in NJ), those always try and sell me stuff I don't need.

I had the BMW service department try and sell me a wheel alignment when they were replacing a tire that had a nail in it. The service writer said she thought the car definitely needed it. I said go ahead a do it, but I am not paying for it because I bought the car a week earlier from them and I was assured everything was perfect. She quickly changed her tune and it went from definitely needing an alignment to, well we always suggest it when replacing a tire .. I NEVER trust dealership service departments. But that is just me.

 

[ShadowsPapa]

No Bill, I live in Indiana.

And once I was told of how the program is run, and I paid attention, it's damned obvious.
The actual Tech's (mechanic's) are wearing dealership shop uniform shirts.

The students are wearing shop shirts with Institution on them. They also have chevrons showing what year they are.

Furthermore, if you ask for it, they will show the agreement that says all students are to be supervised by a Certified Tech. Only problem is, there isn't any in the lube bay. Students and a Service Writer who may or may not know there is no such thing as a metric adjustable wrench.

The students I was in school with could build some pretty nice performance engines and do basic transmission rebuilds without trouble. Students doesn't mean beginners in "this is oil" or "this is a wrench 101"
Even in high school, the students in automotive were doing most of their own work and doing a really nice job of it. They needed to learn the technical aspects, and the how's and why's of things - but I'd put them up against a lot of Jeep owners who do their own work.
One had a Camaro drag car he'd built himself and was winning races with it.
I got to skip the first 2 levels of the high school classes, but did participate in the VICA program, the competitions, the troubleshooting contest (Plymouth) and I'm not sure where you get your idea of students, but they were extremely capable.
Even my niece used to work doing oil changes - and knew her way around cars in high school.

It's truly not like you think it is. Bad misconceptions of "students".
I'd let a Lincoln Tech student or some of these other HS students around where work on oil changes and more.

I used to participate in a huge "industrial arts" show car show a local guy helped put on - the students walking through SouthEast Polk's doors are no slouches.

 

[ShadowsPapa]

I never had good luck with dealership service departments (I live in NJ), those always try and sell me stuff I don't need.

ALL shops, including tire stores and more, used to do that. They don't seem to any more. I really wish the dealership would have said something about my cabin filter - I almost forgot about it and it's nasty. They missed an opportunity - although I'd have said "thanks, but I'll take care of that myself".
I've had tire shops try to sell me idler arms and other parts that I had just put on hours earlier.
And yet Discount Tire totally never said a thing about my Eagle's steering - and could have (play in that reman steering gear) as well as the alignment being way off due to stiff springs (too tall).
Don't know why they've stopped.

Back in the 60s they used to drain the oil out of oil cans - from the bottom and then tell you that your oil was low and sell you a quart of oil, using the nozzle to puncture the top of the can so you could see it - and pretend to add the oil that wasn't in the can. A lot of belts and hoses got changed that didn't need it.
There's really little new - I know quite a few of those tricks.

 

[HooliganActual]

I never had good luck with dealership service departments (I live in NJ), those always try and sell me stuff I don't need.

It’s really just perspective. I used to get bent out of shape when they would tell me the 10 things that needed attention and in my head I’d be thinking “Yeah, right”.

Then I had a wheeling buddy who was a service writer where I take my Jeeps and he confirmed my suspicion. He said “At this dealership, the techs get a commission on any service they recommend and you have performed”.

At that point I was like “AH HA, they are cheats and rogues and scalawags!”

But then I had an epiphany, for the price of an oil change I just had a qualified Jeep tech tell me what work I should do on my own at home. Without buying a sophisticated diagnostic tool or crawling around checking this and that, they told me, essentially for FREE,
what maintenance is needed next.

 

[kevman65]

The students I was in school with could build some pretty nice performance engines and do basic transmission rebuilds without trouble. Students doesn't mean beginners in "this is oil" or "this is a wrench 101"
Even in high school, the students in automotive were doing most of their own work and doing a really nice job of it. They needed to learn the technical aspects, and the how's and why's of things - but I'd put them up against a lot of Jeep owners who do their own work.
One had a Camaro drag car he'd built himself and was winning races with it.
I got to skip the first 2 levels of the high school classes, but did participate in the VICA program, the competitions, the troubleshooting contest (Plymouth) and I'm not sure where you get your idea of students, but they were extremely capable.
Even my niece used to work doing oil changes - and knew her way around cars in high school.

It's truly not like you think it is. Bad misconceptions of "students".
I'd let a Lincoln Tech student or some of these other HS students around where work on oil changes and more.

I used to participate in a huge "industrial arts" show car show a local guy helped put on - the students walking through SouthEast Polk's doors are no slouches.

No, it's actually much worse than I describe.

What you and I grew up with is not the norm. What we experienced not long after high school is not the norm.

I am involved with an apprenticeship program at a local skilled trades union. MOST of these "kids" don't give a damn Bill. The sooner you open your eyes to that the better.

And, I've told you this before, but things in the rest of the Country are NOT like they are in your State.

We have 3 different ASE accredited schools with multiple locations around central Indiana, in central Indiana we have close to 1000 new car dealerships.

You're welcome to do the math. Quality in Techs and students isn't there.

 

[dayusmc]

With the dealers around here, you never talk to the actual mechanic or technician, you talk to the service person (salesman).

Everyone has their own opinion on this. I personally see no downfall with not going to the dealer. But when things like this happen, I do see the downfall with going to the dealer. Free is never Free, I prefer not to take their chance.

 

[SargeDiesel]

I know they can, I also know at times it seems random. If I pull the carfax on my Gladiator hell it shows all oil changes.... I mean oil changes are on there. So I would have to assume an engine replacement will be. The only thing is if an engine replacement will or will not lower a trade in value. One would think it wouldn't seeing how it is a newer engine but then again it could be considered a non factory part even though it is. Will it even be reported who knows, what I do know is apparently oil changes are I guess that depends on the shop doing it. But I would think that so long as it is documented in the case that an engine replacement happens maybe that will even help the value on the private market. The point being it seems that peoples experiences with this will differ. It is probably something that Honestly I do not have to worry about right now, as of now my main concern is the dealership just doing what is right. Having a brand new car ran with no oil to me is just damming to the motor long term, to not be able to trust it on a long road trip etc etc.

Man, I am just all torn apart about this whole situation I am still in disbelief that it happened.

I understand and so sorry bud... for real. It's one of those "I feel helpless" situations.

I think you are going at it the right way though... cool , even headed... packn the guns, but you aren't running in blazn.

See what the dealership is willing to do and then adjust accordingly.

Best of luck, keep us posted. ?

 

[SargeDiesel]

Hi Sarge - No, I said in another reply basically saying the same thing you just said that I'd, of course, talk to the dealer first. I know stuff happens and people make honest mistakes. From the OP, I was saying that its on option to think about and, if he finds no joy in their response, its a just another approach.

I gotcha... great minds think alike... ?
I'm just kickn the can, messing around...
BUT
Seriously, what a shitty situation, I would hate to be in the OP shoes. I hope he gets it worked out with some satisfaction.

 

[SargeDiesel]

Wow, not sure where your dealership is, but that's not the case here. In fact, if I dig back I bet I can find the video one dealership sent me while doing the wave oil change and tire rotation. I could hear and see him and he was no kid in school just learning what a 10mm socket looks like.

That's almost funny. You must live in Mexico or something.
Not sure how a certified tech can supervise oil changes when they are usually over-worked with their own work to do.
Maybe act as a supervisor, but they can't be in two places at once doing two things. They make their money on the jobs they submit tickets for - not running around watching others. Supervising beginners takes time and no certified tech is going to want to be missing out on money running back and forth and checking up and being supervisor.

But like I said - it's sure not that way around here.

A few owners on forums will scream really loud "don't do it! They mess up" while hundreds of thousands of Jeep and Ram owners use dealerships for - gas- oil changes, without issue. Few Jeep vehicles are owned by those who do their own oil changes, but the forum makes it look like everyone does due to a vocal few on the topic.
My wife has always gone to dealerships for such work, all her life - almost 50 years worth - never a problem.

Because of this forum, I have been a little hesitant to use my waves.

I recently visited my local dealership and was speaking with a master diesel mechanic, I voiced my concerns while we were discussing my HPFP replacement. He specifically stated (revised in my own words), if I requested, I could have my oil and tire rotation done on the "mechanic" side of the shop, rather than the express side, specifically set up for oil changes and tire rotations. He also said, if I requested him, he would do it.

I don't think I could do any better than that. Now I got a year to get in 3 oil changes and tire rotations ?

 

[ShadowsPapa]

Because of this forum, I have been a little hesitant to use my waves.

I recently visited my local dealership and was speaking with a master diesel mechanic, I voiced my concerns while we were discussing my HPFP replacement. He specifically stated (revised in my own words), if I requested, I could have my oil and tire rotation done on the "mechanic" side of the shop, rather than the express side, specifically set up for oil changes and tire rotations. He also said, if I requested him, he would do it.

I don't think I could do any better than that. Now I got a year to get in 3 oil changes and tire rotations ?

Remember, you are on the internet in a Jeep forum - you'll find it looks a ton worse than it really is out there. "DIYers" are extremely vocal and certain everyone else screws up all the time. Just ask 'em.
My experiences have been the opposite. If someone does screw up - talk to them about it. It's actually more rare than some would let you believe.
Last shop I worked in - EVERYONE did the oil changes - there was no "I'm too good for that" allowed. If it was your turn at next item on the list and it was an oil change - you did it. And as it worked out, if you did a great job and made sure the carpets were vacuumed and the glass spotless and no finger prints anywhere and treated them like royalty, sometimes they'd request you for the more complex work. It's one way I ended up being one of the most requested mechanics in the shop. Pissed off the service manager when I got the more high profile jobs for the better customers.

 

[SargeDiesel]

Remember, you are on the internet in a Jeep forum - you'll find it looks a ton worse than it really is out there. "DIYers" are extremely vocal and certain everyone else screws up all the time. Just ask 'em.
My experiences have been the opposite. If someone does screw up - talk to them about it. It's actually more rare than some would let you believe.
Last shop I worked in - EVERYONE did the oil changes - there was no "I'm too good for that" allowed. If it was your turn at next item on the list and it was an oil change - you did it. And as it worked out, if you did a great job and made sure the carpets were vacuumed and the glass spotless and no finger prints anywhere and treated them like royalty, sometimes they'd request you for the more complex work. It's one way I ended up being one of the most requested mechanics in the shop. Pissed off the service manager when I got the more high profile jobs for the better customers.

You summed it up when you said "INTERNET". I've given the same advice. I had a bad experience with my local dealership, but in fairness it was with the sales department. I have inquired about getting my iol changed from them, but decided not to when they told me the express service would take 3-4 hours. I am glad I had the conversation with the diesel mechanic, most likely I will take him up on his offer.

 

[ross neill]

I would look for a new engine from the dealership in this case, especially if it is a 2.0 four cylinder. Swapping out a complete engine is not really a big deal, I have swapped countless engines. What I would NOT want is a "repair" for an engine operated without oil. When I say repair I mean going into the engine and replacing bearings, pistons and rings, etc. This is because while most dealerships have several good or even better techs (I'm referring to line techs, not the Express Lane lube techs), the dealership is not really set up for properly rebuilding an engine. If your Wrangler has a 2.0, the new engine will come complete with turbo, intercooler, sensors, injectors, etc., at least the last four or five 2.0s that I installed did.

What I would recommend is to give the dealership a chance to do the right thing. They serviced your Jeep so they know that it is on them. Once the "L" word is mentioned, it may slow things down instead of speeding them up. As for a new Wrangler, I don't think they will do that, but I don't know your dealer.

Report it directly to Jeep not dealership have Jeep have a different dealer replace engine at frist dealers dime

 

[ShadowsPapa]

Report it directly to Jeep not dealership have Jeep have a different dealer replace engine at frist dealers dime

That ain't gonna fly and there's no way another dealership will touch it plus jeep can't force anything. That's about the worse "advice" in this whole thread.

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