A huge pet peeve: graffiti for Instagram

[WILDHOBO]

This is exactly the problem, we fail to recognize the significance. Not to mention their written word at the time was done pictorially.

Sort of like walking into the library and spray painting the pages of books or the Louvre and drawing angry brows on the Mona Lisa and saying “but humans did it so it’s okay”

It’s almost like some of us get it. Literally one of my earliest memories with grandpa and dad explaining the concept of leaving no trace when outdoors.

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[ShadowsPapa]

While I don't like the fact that they did it...this does present an Interesting paradox...graffiti on a rock that has graffiti on it from neolithic people.

We went to Mammoth Cave last year and in the depths of the cave people used candles to soot their names all over the ceiling. The guide told us that they used to conduct tours and would sell the candles to do it in WWII "Kilroy was here" was scribbled all over everything. This is nothing new. Just not enough time has passed to give it "historical" context.

............. so we are justifying things using the same way my sons used to "but he did it first".

That logic also says I can go to any park, any public place at all for that matter, carve my name on things, paint over murals, redecorate doors to my own tastes and (if I even HAD instacrap) paint my look at me instacrap address or whatever they call it on that medium.. and for that matter, we all could do that "because he did it first".
Let's see how it works when anyone does anything they wish, draws, paints, chalks, whatever, over anything in any public place.
Using the logic seen here, I, or anyone and everyone, can go spray my name over any historic landmark or plaque or sign.

We used to do a lot of things - women never used to have the vote, we settled differences with duels, we hung criminals - even those who weren't murders. Time to go back?

When the original carvings were done, no one owned anything, there was never any thought for the future, it was their only way of communicating or even recording their stories. Rocks and caves were their "social media". They knew little else.

Historical context - Once those are gone and/or defaced, they are gone, forever. Today what you draw or write will exist forever "in the cloud".
Once those drawings are gone, we lose all contact with a people long since gone. No one will ever see or enjoy or learn from them again.
No one gives a rip about seeing your instacrap info posted to get attention.

From Canada - (and frankly, I believe that number should have another '0' in it)

13 No person shall remove, deface, damage or destroy any signboard, sign or notice placed, posted or erected in a Park by the superintendent, or any public building, fence or other structure in a Park.

• SOR/82-949, s. 1(F)
• SOR/93-167, s. 6(E)

• 14 (1) Subject to subsection (2), no person shall wilfully remove, deface, damage or destroy any prehistoric or historic artifacts or structures in a Park.

The U.S. and Canada are actually pretty lax in this - try it in some other countries and you may face jail time.

 

[Shopshirt]

............. so we are justifying things using the same way my sons used to "but he did it first".

That logic also says I can go to any park, any public place at all for that matter, carve my name on things, paint over murals, redecorate doors to my own tastes and (if I even HAD instacrap) paint my look at me instacrap address or whatever they call it on that medium.. and for that matter, we all could do that "because he did it first".
Let's see how it works when anyone does anything they wish, draws, paints, chalks, whatever, over anything in any public place.
Using the logic seen here, I, or anyone and everyone, can go spray my name over any historic landmark or plaque or sign.

We used to do a lot of things - women never used to have the vote, we settled differences with duels, we hung criminals - even those who weren't murders. Time to go back?

When the original carvings were done, no one owned anything, there was never any thought for the future, it was their only way of communicating or even recording their stories. Rocks and caves were their "social media". They knew little else.

Historical context - Once those are gone and/or defaced, they are gone, forever. Today what you draw or write will exist forever "in the cloud".
Once those drawings are gone, we lose all contact with a people long since gone. No one will ever see or enjoy or learn from them again.
No one gives a rip about seeing your instacrap info posted to get attention.

From Canada - (and frankly, I believe that number should have another '0' in it)

13 No person shall remove, deface, damage or destroy any signboard, sign or notice placed, posted or erected in a Park by the superintendent, or any public building, fence or other structure in a Park.

• SOR/82-949, s. 1(F)
• SOR/93-167, s. 6(E)
• 14 (1) Subject to subsection (2), no person shall wilfully remove, deface, damage or destroy any prehistoric or historic artifacts or structures in a Park.

The U.S. and Canada are actually pretty lax in this - try it in some other countries and you may face jail time.

Note the first thing I said was I don't like that they did it. No justification or condoning of their actions intended I just thought it was a funny juxtapostion of ideas. How, candle soot graffiti in Mammoth cave is an interesting historical side note.

Apologies for trying to interject a little tongue in cheek sarcasm and humor into the conversation. That's why I used a smilie face. Just sayin...laugh a little.

 

[Dryfly24]

Note the first thing I said was I don't like that they did it. Apologies for trying to interject a little tongue in cheek sarcasm and humor into the conversation. No justification or condoning of their actions intended I just thought it was a funny juxtapostion of ideas. How, candle soot graffiti in Mammoth cave is an interesting historical side note. Just sayin...laugh a little.

I think I got what you were saying and didn’t take your post to mean you were condoning it. But you bring up a point that some people might actually falsely use as an excuse. How do I know that? Because here where I live, it’s actually happened. There are quite a few spots where people have defaced some petroglyphs potentially thousands of years old.

I got tons of pics of one place nearby where it is particularly egregious but it would take me a while to find them and I just don’t have the energy right now so these will have to do.

 

[Shopshirt]

I think I got what you were saying and didn’t take your post to mean you were condoning it. But you bring up a point that some people might actually falsely use as an excuse. How do I know that? Because here where I live, it’s actually happened. There are quite a few spots where people have defaced some petroglyphs potentially thousands of years old.

I got tons of pics of one place nearby where it is particularly egregious but it would take me a while to find them and I just don’t have the energy right now so these will have to do.

We definitely agree there and I agree you should never damage or deface historical sites like that.

 

[Nigelcorn]

I don't know how often it's actually prosecuted, but defacing historical sites carries up to a $20,000 and one year fine for first time offenders in the USA. So we have the penalties available, I just think they're not used very often.

 

[Bulldog]

What’s instagram?

 

[redrider]

I don't know how often it's actually prosecuted, but defacing historical sites carries up to a $20,000 and one year fine for first time offenders in the USA. So we have the penalties available, I just think they're not used very often.

Bailiff! Whack his PeePee!

 

[Terry]

While I don't like the fact that they did it...this does present an Interesting paradox...graffiti on a rock that has graffiti on it from neolithic people.

We went to Mammoth Cave last year and in the depths of the cave people used candles to soot their names all over the ceiling. The guide told us that they used to conduct tours and would sell the candles to do it in WWII "Kilroy was here" was scribbled all over everything. This is nothing new. Just not enough time has passed to give it "historical" context.

Oh, so painting a mustache on the Mona Lisa or perhaps someone scribbling their name on your Jeep or perhaps your house is then ok? It isn't art, it's graffiti, it's vandalism. To inscribe anything on something that belongs to another or as in this case to all of us left for centuries for our appreciation and wonderment is wrong, and I am left to ponder just where some of us turned off the right path and began to believe graffiti is something of value for those who come in the future. And before you are tempted to say it.... Petroglyphs, and all other forms of for lack of a better word, hieroglyphics are NOT ancient graffiti. They were and remain a form of communication, art, and yes, science. They are believed by many to have evolved from the most ancient of mankind, who formed prehistoric hunting communities leaving messages for those who followed. Read the RA Expeditions and you too will understand how Egyptian hieroglyphics ended up in Central America and in Mexico......

 

[Terry]

It’s almost like some of us get it. Literally one of my earliest memories with grandpa and dad explaining the concept of leaving no trace when outdoors.

I am glad you and others get it. Unfortunately many still don't. And it makes me afraid for all the children to come after us.

 

[Terry]

What’s instagram?

Well one thing it surely isn't... a centuries old mural of man's past.

 

[Terry]

I don't know how often it's actually prosecuted, but defacing historical sites carries up to a $20,000 and one year fine for first time offenders in the USA. So we have the penalties available, I just think they're not used very often.

Perhaps I had too much coffee this morning... but if I see someone defacing ancient history, they will have a Petroglyph of my boot on their ass.

 

[MonkeySkunks]

In defense of moron IG guy and his family, people generally just don't get the concept of not doing whatever the F they want. Out backpacking with boy scouts, all of ours at least get the concept of leave no trace and try to adhere to it as much as they can, one started building a little rock tower thing thinking nothing of it. I mentioned that's some primitive vandalism there and goes against leave no trace. He put the rocks back roughly were he found them.

The I need to be famous and I need to leave my mark crowd builds those damn things everywhere and many of them are econuts. I can't count the number of armpit hair save the planet yoga pose next to my little rock tower in the middle of nowhere photos I've seen.

People are morons and selfish. The best you can do is politely inform them of their assumedly innocent mistake and move on.

Luckily the planet will be here long after the last human is completely forgotten so it's not really that big of a deal either way.

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