Anyone have experience with Dobinsons rear coils on Mojave?

[Zachanadandy]

Which rate is 170? 1st, 2nd, or combined? The set of Mojave coils I have are double rate.

Stock? Mine are long gone, but the pictures from mopar show a single rate.

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[CrazyCooter]

Lots if numbers being tossed in here, but none is useful without the other supporting data.

Wire diameter is meaningless without coil count and free length. A large wire spring with more coil wraps can be softer than one with less wraps and smaller wire. More wraps with large wire will reach block height sooner than smaller wire/less wraps.

Tossing out a single finish rate is useless without the other 1 or 2 rates because they all combine until the rate above hits block height?

 

[CrazyCooter]

Stock? Mine are long gone, but the pictures from mopar show a single rate.

The ones I have are silver, have the plastic isolators, and are dual rate. I'm going to guess from memory thst they came from a 2020 truck?

 

[Artidemic13]

Stock? Mine are long gone, but the pictures from mopar show a single rate.

I think those are the front coils. Rears are dual rated and you can see it pretty clearly in the pics. Mojave X rear coil part number: 68607529AA

 

[Artidemic13]

I wouldn't say your front axle has been unloaded just based on sag in the rear. The angle of the frame/body transfers minimal weight.....like probably only a few lb! Now if you put 750lb behind the rear axle like on the trailer hitch, that will unload the front.

I think you probably know the answer to this problem, just don't want to confirm it because it's painful to the wallet.

Your springs and shocks need to hit the dumpster, be replaced with springs to match your loads, and then shocks to match the ride frequency.

If your answer was that you liked the overall ride, but the rear was just a little soft and low with your loads.....I'd slam a 3/4" spacer and a set of in coil airbags for a Ram 1500 in the rear.

If you step up to a heavier rear spring to support the loads, I would predict that you will have a rebound damping issue and things will be wobbly and then unsettled on the small chop. Overseer might become a thing as well.

I know you're right on all counts... but man, I just am not prepared to throw down for the full suspension overhaul right now. It's just a lot of coin!

 

[Jclayc]

For short term you can add TF spacers to the back to gain back what you lost with the first bit of weight, won't help with extra added weight on top of that. I just added front and back along with the X springs in the front and drives like it did off the lot. No weight in the back for me though...

 

[JustAGuyCalledChris]

You had commented recently on my thread about stock heightish with heavy weights using Clayton 1.5” springs and falcon 3.3 shocks. Mines a rubicon, not a Mojave but if I understand right the rears are the same height, the Mojave just sits 1” higher in the front…I do have a 1” spacer in the front of mine and similar weight to you so things should be close to being comparable. The 1.5” Clayton springs have gotten me back up to stock height in the rear and I actually have a tad bit of rake but not much. That is just with the rear springs and the 1” spacer in the front. I have not installed the front 1.5” springs or the falcon shocks yet. I can tell you it rides much better than it was. I felt like I was pulling a heavy trailer everywhere with me before with all the bounce and roll I had. Now it just feels close to stock…I can’t wait to see how much the shocks help on top of the Clayton springs. I might have to add a small spacer in the rear when I do the front 1.5” coils, we will see.

the picture here is with a loadout pretty much ready to go camping. 160 pound rack, 250 pound tent, fridge full of drinks without food at the moment, fridge slide, full 5# propane tank, 2 100 ah lifepo4 batteries, 2 rotopax full of water, a box full of recovery gear on the side, 35” spare underneath, 1 box with kitchen setup, 1 box with misc camp stuff, 1 box with chainsaw and tools, 1 box with hammocks and zero breeze attachments, zero breeze in the back seat, a pop up firepit, portable toilet setup, Starlink, camp lighting, and a full tank of gas.

 

[Stan H]

The problem here is the MOST manufacturers aren't forthcoming with what they are actually selling you. The spring rate remains mostly a mystery, so no calculations or educated guessing can be done with these brands. The argument is usually made that its proprietary and they don't want anyone to copy it? That's actually pretty easy? Once the spring is in hand, one could measure # of coils, wire diameter, and free length and estimate the rate. I could use my scale and press to do the same and they have spring rating tools for anyone who is really serious about figuring this out.

The reason Synergy is recommending a 3-4+ lift spring is that they are some of the lightest spring rates in the industry. By design, they have a longer free length and will compress under a load more than a higher rate spring like say a Clayton or Metal Cloak.

Say you have a 250lbin spring that measures 20" free. That spring will compress 1" for each 250lbs that is applied to it. In theory the "loaded spring rate" at ride height will be the same regardless of the initial rate, but the loaded spring length will change depending on how much it is compressed. This is what determines your ride height.

Multi rate springs help with ride comfort.....In the case of Clayton triple rate springs, the first rate is mostly just a tender spring rate to keep the spring from falling out at full droop so you get decent travel numbers, while the 2nd and 3rd rates are combined at ride weight unloaded allowing for a comfortable ride while still offering some serious cargo capacity as the vehicle drops compressing the 2nd rate until its fully collapsed leaving the 3rd (firmest)rate. This is why you could run a REALLY long shock with a Synergy (Light) spring, med length shock for Clayton (heavier, but triple rate w/ tender), and a shorter shock for a Metal Cloak (Med rate but only only double rate).

A lower rate spring will not "ramp up" as quickly when adding a load by either adding cargo or just turning a corner that will transfer weight therefore inducing body roll. This is why a light sprung (low ride frequency) vehicle generally has more body roll and a heavier sprung (higher ride frequency)vehicle.

Sometimes watching these threads just cracks me up with all the guessing and mismatching of components. People sooo proud of "Frankenlifts" with components that many times don't work well together.

Nothing is wring with a Frankenlift . Just because spings are from one manufacturer and control arms from another and draglink from another if they are are properly fit and installed correctly then its fine.
The Key to Frankenlifts . Is Knowledge it must be installed and adjusted correctly.

 

[Artidemic13]

You had commented recently on my thread about stock heightish with heavy weights using Clayton 1.5” springs and falcon 3.3 shocks. Mines a rubicon, not a Mojave but if I understand right the rears are the same height, the Mojave just sits 1” higher in the front…I do have a 1” spacer in the front of mine and similar weight to you so things should be close to being comparable. The 1.5” Clayton springs have gotten me back up to stock height in the rear and I actually have a tad bit of rake but not much. That is just with the rear springs and the 1” spacer in the front. I have not installed the front 1.5” springs or the falcon shocks yet. I can tell you it rides much better than it was. I felt like I was pulling a heavy trailer everywhere with me before with all the bounce and roll I had. Now it just feels close to stock…I can’t wait to see how much the shocks help on top of the Clayton springs. I might have to add a small spacer in the rear when I do the front 1.5” coils, we will see.

the picture here is with a loadout pretty much ready to go camping. 160 pound rack, 250 pound tent, fridge full of drinks without food at the moment, fridge slide, full 5# propane tank, 2 100 ah lifepo4 batteries, 2 rotopax full of water, a box full of recovery gear on the side, 35” spare underneath, 1 box with kitchen setup, 1 box with misc camp stuff, 1 box with chainsaw and tools, 1 box with hammocks and zero breeze attachments, zero breeze in the back seat, a pop up firepit, portable toilet setup, Starlink, camp lighting, and a full tank of gas.

Hey Chris, thanks for chiming in here. As you can see, I'm looking for the holy grail (which doesn't exist). After chatting with you on your thread, I was on the verge of going with the Clayton 1.5"s, but I wanted to send one last appeal out to the forum at large, if for nothing else than to cross-check your insights and also ask about the Dobinsons and Metalcloak options.

Now seeing the picture of your rig fully loaded (looks leve or just slightly lower in the back), I reckon I'll be somewhere in that ballpark when I'm completely kitted out.

And, as Tony/CrazyCooter pointed out--and as I think I recall you also having experienced even with the new springs--I'll probably still be feeling some issues with rebound damping (especially with the Mojave/Fox shocks) and some instability on small chop/washboard, and maybe even some oversteering issues.

But I think at this stage, I'm willing to give the Clayton 1.5" springs a try. If they suck, then I'll bite the bullet and just do a full suspension swap with new shocks.

 

[Artidemic13]

Just ordered the Clayton 1.5" coils, everyone. Wish me luck...

 

[Bandit’s Lair]

Nothing is wring with a Frankenlift . Just because spings are from one manufacturer and control arms from another and draglink from another if they are are properly fit and installed correctly then its fine.
The Key to Frankenlifts . Is Knowledge it must be installed and adjusted correctly.

While this is true for arms and bars and those parts, those shocks and springs absolutely have to compliment each other. If not you’ll have more of a Lurch than a Frankenstein.

 

[JustAGuyCalledChris]

Even if they aren’t perfect, I guarantee they will be tons better than what you have and the price on them isn’t rediculous. You will still want a shock of some sort afterwards to finish killing the sway and bounce I believe…my rubicon rides close to stock with the factory shocks, it will be interesting to hear how the Mojave shocks do with a decent spring holding the weight.

My front springs and shocks should be here Monday and I hope to get them on Tuesday. I’ll be sure to update my thoughts on those afterwards.

 

[Artidemic13]

Even if they aren’t perfect, I guarantee they will be tons better than what you have and the price on them isn’t rediculous. You will still want a shock of some sort afterwards to finish killing the sway and bounce I believe…my rubicon rides close to stock with the factory shocks, it will be interesting to hear how the Mojave shocks do with a decent spring holding the weight.

My front springs and shocks should be here Monday and I hope to get them on Tuesday. I’ll be sure to update my thoughts on those afterwards.

Look forward to your report! I’ll report back as well once I get the coils on.

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