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Bronco is fullsize - no comparison

NoDoorsNoProblem

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The 3 vs 4 piece roof is a novelty, same as the mirrors on the door or the body. It's something a car dealer will use to sell an average Joe looking to look cool.
Highly, highly disagree with you on both of these.

For those that don’t care to take their top off ever and wish their wrangler/bronco had a permanent top, this won’t make a difference. The 3 piece vs. 4 piece hardtop, for someone like me who was cross shopping Jeep vs. Bronco primarily for the open top experience, this is the difference between having to buy a complicated hanging system in my garage, and being able to take it off and throw it in the corner. Not to mention, if I’m careful, taking it off by myself vs. NEEDING a sending person, period. The 3 piece top with the huge overhang adds weight and size and makes it so unwieldy to the point where unless you have one of those fancy hangars in your garage, it really discourages taking the top off in general.

The mirrors are definitely not a gimmick too. That’s the other reason myself and many others are shopping the 2 models…the ability to take the doors off. Yes, not everywhere legally requires mirrors. But why the hell wouldn’t you want them to be able to see around you and drive more safely? I sure do. Especially with the doors off….I’d rather take extra precautions and be even more cautious about lane changes when I’m doorless. It’s an easy design feature that Jeep could have thought about with the JL/JT design, but chose to maintain the status quo and either let the consumer pay them more through Mopar accessories, or through the aftermarket.

Thats why people that are die hard Jeepers are excited about the Bronco. It will force innovation on Jeep’s end that will make a better overall product. They’ve been the only vehicle of its type in the market for so long that they’ve really gotten lazy and just relied on the deep-rooted fan base and the fact that there is no competitor to maintain sales growth and avoid innovation.
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TwelveGaugeSage

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Really? Cuz every video I've seen with the Broncos has them going along just fine with Wranglers on the trail. The only place I can see it being a problem is extreme terrain that counts for a very tiny fraction of Jeep owners. And those Jeeps are usually highly modified at that point.
I dunno, I could be wrong. I wouldn't be wholly against having the OPTION to have IFS or solid axle. But until I see proof that solid axle swaps are no longer desired on IFS rock crawlers, I'll keep buying vehicles with solid axles. IFS has its uses, but I wouldn't want a rock crawler with IFS. I realize that the vast majority of Wrangler/Gladiator/Bronco owners will NEVER see a situation where solid axle provides an advantage. Maybe the Bronco will be the IFS that finally changes my view.

Jeep owners(myself included) are often like, gotta get the Rubicon... But I think the advantages a Rubicon trim offers are less of an advantage than the differences between a base sport with solid axle and a base Bronco with IFS.
 

bleda2002

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Highly, highly disagree with you on both of these.

For those that don’t care to take their top off ever and wish their wrangler/bronco had a permanent top, this won’t make a difference. The 3 piece vs. 4 piece hardtop, for someone like me who was cross shopping Jeep vs. Bronco primarily for the open top experience, this is the difference between having to buy a complicated hanging system in my garage, and being able to take it off and throw it in the corner. Not to mention, if I’m careful, taking it off by myself vs. NEEDING a sending person, period. The 3 piece top with the huge overhang adds weight and size and makes it so unwieldy to the point where unless you have one of those fancy hangars in your garage, it really discourages taking the top off in general.

The mirrors are definitely not a gimmick too. That’s the other reason myself and many others are shopping the 2 models…the ability to take the doors off. Yes, not everywhere legally requires mirrors. But why the hell wouldn’t you want them to be able to see around you and drive more safely? I sure do. Especially with the doors off….I’d rather take extra precautions and be even more cautious about lane changes when I’m doorless. It’s an easy design feature that Jeep could have thought about with the JL/JT design, but chose to maintain the status quo and either let the consumer pay them more through Mopar accessories, or through the aftermarket.

Thats why people that are die hard Jeepers are excited about the Bronco. It will force innovation on Jeep’s end that will make a better overall product. They’ve been the only vehicle of its type in the market for so long that they’ve really gotten lazy and just relied on the deep-rooted fan base and the fact that there is no competitor to maintain sales growth and avoid innovation.
You are probably in the sub 5% of folks that plans on running naked all the time but buys a hard top over soft top.

The reason I say they are a gimmick is because compared to the rest of the car neither is a deal breaker or even a real sway imo. If both were sfa or ifs and similar styling and performance then I could see small things like that matter.

For people constantly taking the roof off they make soft tops which works way better and way quicker. The back panel on the Ford will be a novelty 2 weeks in for ~95% because taking off the 2 fronts gives the driver and passenger the same experience and it's still easier and quicker.

The mirrors on the body, I honestly can't stand, they look like goofy ears because they mount so far forward they have to stick way out. For 50 bucks gets me a set of mounted mirrors when I take my doors off and they install in seconds.

I maintain that at the end of the day for 90% of people its going to be like full size trucks which comes down to which one looks cooler
 

TennesseePA

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You are probably in the sub 5% of folks that plans on running naked all the time but buys a hard top over soft top.

The reason I say they are a gimmick is because compared to the rest of the car neither is a deal breaker or even a real sway imo. If both were sfa or ifs and similar styling and performance then I could see small things like that matter.

For people constantly taking the roof off they make soft tops which works way better and way quicker. The back panel on the Ford will be a novelty 2 weeks in for ~95% because taking off the 2 fronts gives the driver and passenger the same experience and it's still easier and quicker.

The mirrors on the body, I honestly can't stand, they look like goofy ears because they mount so far forward they have to stick way out. For 50 bucks gets me a set of mounted mirrors when I take my doors off and they install in seconds.

I maintain that at the end of the day for 90% of people its going to be like full size trucks which comes down to which one looks cooler
You are entitled to your preference but I personally HATE the mirrors mounted on the door. I take my hard top off in March and usually don’t put it back on until October. We take the Gladiator on every vacation to the beach so I have a soft top and doors for wet days and travel. The passenger side mirror is worthless with the soft doors on. Like I said earlier my Gladiator isn’t going anywhere but it will have a roommate as soon as my Bronco is delivered. I added a few photos of the Gladiator doing what the Gladiator does so I cannot be accused of being a Ford fanboy.

D0E4BF59-6E9D-4317-B392-041BD8313D43.jpeg


72B00CB9-A972-45B4-BE95-485C206581EB.jpeg


CD06A4CF-352D-4864-A104-82D3A2056073.jpeg
 

LostWoods

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I dunno, I could be wrong. I wouldn't be wholly against having the OPTION to have IFS or solid axle. But until I see proof that solid axle swaps are no longer desired on IFS rock crawlers, I'll keep buying vehicles with solid axles. IFS has its uses, but I wouldn't want a rock crawler with IFS. I realize that the vast majority of Wrangler/Gladiator/Bronco owners will NEVER see a situation where solid axle provides an advantage. Maybe the Bronco will be the IFS that finally changes my view.

Jeep owners(myself included) are often like, gotta get the Rubicon... But I think the advantages a Rubicon trim offers are less of an advantage than the differences between a base sport with solid axle and a base Bronco with IFS.
Yeah but it's hard not to see the irony of people idolizing the hardcore Jeep while pissing on the Bronco. That same Jeeps that frequently have full-width Dana 60 axles that make them wider than the "too wide" Bronco. Or that have so much work done to them they resemble no Jeep that has existed at any point in history.

The Bronco is enough for 95% of the market and for that top 5%, there's welders and there's a massive aftermarket. At the point you're doing full axle swaps on a Jeep, I can guarantee there will be full SAS kits for the Bronco as well within a year.
 

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bleda2002

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You are entitled to your preference but I personally HATE the mirrors mounted on the door. I take my hard top off in March and usually don’t put it back on until October. We take the Gladiator on every vacation to the beach so I have a soft top and doors for wet days and travel. The passenger side mirror is worthless with the soft doors on. Like I said earlier my Gladiator isn’t going anywhere but it will have a roommate as soon as my Bronco is delivered. I added a few photos of the Gladiator doing what the Gladiator does so I cannot be accused of being a Ford fanboy.

Jeep Gladiator Bronco is fullsize - no comparison CD06A4CF-352D-4864-A104-82D3A2056073


Jeep Gladiator Bronco is fullsize - no comparison CD06A4CF-352D-4864-A104-82D3A2056073


Jeep Gladiator Bronco is fullsize - no comparison CD06A4CF-352D-4864-A104-82D3A2056073
Have you tried different side mirror? Good chance the soft doors on the Ford will block it as well.

Also just because you have a jeep doesn't mean you aren't a Ford fan boy lol. Clearly your preference is for the bronco over a Wrangler and that's cool. I highly doubt it was the mirrors and roof that made the actual decision though and more the way it looked and what engine it had and how you felt about the interior.

The mirror and roof make it justifiable to you
 

PDiddy

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The Bronco is the love child of the Wrangler and 4Runner.

The 4Runner is the bronco’s mom. She was an exchange student form Japan. Sweet and nice, always a hard worker. Everyone liked her. Then she met a bad boy, named Wrangler, for America.

He was adventurous and went anywhere. She couldn’t always keep up, but she never gave up. If she ever got in trouble, he could get her out of it. She loved his solid axles and he loved her big trunk.

It was a match made in heaven. And one articulating night on the Rubicon, the bronco was created. And nine months, I mean ten months, wait twelve months… the bronco was finally born.

Sorry, you will never look at the bronco the same. Or me?

But now you know the whole story, you understand why the bronco is the way it is.
 
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TennesseePA

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Have you tried different side mirror? Good chance the soft doors on the Ford will block it as well.

Also just because you have a jeep doesn't mean you aren't a Ford fan boy lol. Clearly your preference is for the bronco over a Wrangler and that's cool. I highly doubt it was the mirrors and roof that made the actual decision though and more the way it looked and what engine it had and how you felt about the interior.

The mirror and roof make it justifiable to you
It was much more than the mirrors and the roof but that was the discussion that we are having.

I have purchased 3 or 4 different sets of mirrors and they all suck with the soft doors on.
My opinion is that there is nothing like the Gladiator and Ford has built a better Wrangler. I will repeat that if a person thinks a solid axle is required for off road then they are just plain wrong. Do some research and see how many independently suspended rigs are running King of the Hammers and get back to me.
 

TwelveGaugeSage

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I will repeat that if a person thinks a solid axle is required for off road then they are just plain wrong. Do some research and see how many independently suspended rigs are running King of the Hammers and get back to me.
Solid axles are definitely not required for off-road. I still believe it is far superior for rock crawling though. King of Hammers is its own beast. If I want something that will go FAST off-road, I'm almost certainly opting for fully independent suspension. Even the guys on the Bronco forum say if you want a rock-crawling rig with 40" tires, get a Jeep or do a SAS. Who wants 40s? THE OFFICIAL 40 INCH TIRE THREAD!!! | Bronco6G - 2021+ Ford Bronco & Bronco Raptor Forum, News, Blog & Owners Community

As is mentioned in that thread, let's first see how the Bronco holds up with 37s in the rocks.
 

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NoDoorsNoProblem

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I feel like this thread would have gone differently on a Wrangler forum.

Which tells me that Gladiator folks are more level headed with purchases which is why they have or want a Gladiator in the first place .
I think that for a lot of Wrangler owners, it’s Wrangler or bust, and it’s about the culture, history, lifestyle, whatever you want to call it. I have a good friend who owns a 6 speed Sahara JKU, all stock, barely ever off roaded, and he loves it and loves just owning a Jeep. An absolute Jeep fanboy. In his words “the gladiator is so ugly, it’s an insult to Jeeps, and it’s an insult to pickup trucks”.

I think a lot of Wrangler owners share that sentiment to some degree. And I think a lot of Gladiator owners said hey, gladiators look a little wonky stock, but I can turn this adult Lego into whatever I want to look like. Plus, they are more pragmatic about utility and features, which is why they chose a Jeep with a bed that can tow, instead of a Jeep with a tiny trunk that can’t really tow. Buyers with that mindset are probably more open to change the status quo, improve utility, and respect some of the awesome innovations the Bronco has come out with, like body mounted mirrors, for one.
 

bleda2002

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It was much more than the mirrors and the roof but that was the discussion that we are having.

I have purchased 3 or 4 different sets of mirrors and they all suck with the soft doors on.
My opinion is that there is nothing like the Gladiator and Ford has built a better Wrangler. I will repeat that if a person thinks a solid axle is required for off road then they are just plain wrong. Do some research and see how many independently suspended rigs are running King of the Hammers and get back to me.
See? Novelty lol. You'd have still bought the Ford if it was jeep top style and door mirrors because you like the ifs and looks of it. That's what sells cars the noveltys are how fans justify which is ”better". Like mustang vs Camaro (mustang is better), Ferrari vs Lambo (Ferrari), Mercedes vs bmw (Mercedes) etc. None of us are driving jeeps because we think they're ugly but they off road the best.

Which one is actually better? Depends on what you use it for and which one makes you feel cooler. We can argue about details all day but I'd bet the bronco is 90% the off roader the Wrangler is and the JL is 90% the daily driver the bronco is so it comes down to emotion not some paper spec sheet.
 

TennesseePA

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See? Novelty lol. You'd have still bought the Ford if it was jeep top style and door mirrors because you like the ifs and looks of it. That's what sells cars the noveltys are how fans justify which is ”better". Like mustang vs Camaro (mustang is better), Ferrari vs Lambo (Ferrari), Mercedes vs bmw (Mercedes) etc. None of us are driving jeeps because we think they're ugly but they off road the best.

Which one is actually better? Depends on what you use it for and which one makes you feel cooler. We can argue about details all day but I'd bet the bronco is 90% the off roader the Wrangler is and the JL is 90% the daily driver the bronco is so it comes down to emotion not some paper spec sheet.
You are projecting your thoughts as my own. I am 51 years old and since 1982 when my dad bought his first CJ we have owned a Jeep. (If you remember the CJ had body mounted mirrors). Jeep has missed many opportunities to correct some design deficiencies like the mirrors and seat comfort. My kids hat the back seat of the Gladiator and absolutely refused to take a trip in the JK.
To me, it seems like a no brainer to have vented seats in a vehicle where you are often riding with the top off in the sun but, even though the technology exists) both Jeep and Ford missed the mark. The drivability issues with Jeep are NOT a product of the solid axle. Go test drive a Super Duty Ford or a Heavy Duty Dodge and see for yourself how they drive and you’ll agree.
 

bleda2002

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You are projecting your thoughts as my own. I am 51 years old and since 1982 when my dad bought his first CJ we have owned a Jeep. (If you remember the CJ had body mounted mirrors). Jeep has missed many opportunities to correct some design deficiencies like the mirrors and seat comfort. My kids hat the back seat of the Gladiator and absolutely refused to take a trip in the JK.
To me, it seems like a no brainer to have vented seats in a vehicle where you are often riding with the top off in the sun but, even though the technology exists) both Jeep and Ford missed the mark. The drivability issues with Jeep are NOT a product of the solid axle. Go test drive a Super Duty Ford or a Heavy Duty Dodge and see for yourself how they drive and you’ll agree.
And you are projecting your opinions as facts. The mirrors are a design choice, I don't have an issue with them, you do. This is the equivalent of me saying Ford misses the mark because the wind shield doesn't fold down so they could have body mounted mirrors. The seats for me are way more comfortable than any of the 4 ford's I've had and my kids love them. Different body shapes different heights different kids.

Stock the jeep drivability sucks I agree they should come from the factory with an 8 or 10 degree off set front axle and 6 -7 degrees of caster. Luckily I fixed it by going to 6 degrees of caster and now it tracks and steers straight with no dead spot cost was a whopping 60 bucks for control arms.

You clearly love the bronco and not so much the Wrangler, that's really cool it's why we don't all drive the same thing.

Edit: oh and I 100% agree, they should mandate vented seats as standard on every vehicle.
 

Sazabi19

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You're right. But maybe they'll have to make the base one a little cheaper, since it currently costs the same as a bronco that has more stuff. If manual everything is cheaper, them I'm down for it. For the same price as the better equipped competition, that's a stretch.
I'm all for it. Hopefully good competition means competitive pricing, but I bet it just goes the other way.
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