Let's talk about winter issues

[Steppenwolf]

This week has been busy for us getting some real winter experience in. So far I haven't gotten my truck stuck yet and it's providing to be very good in snow. Still running the stock Dueler ATs was able to blast my self through some serious snow. This morning one section of road wasn't plowed about 200 yards with about 18"-20" of heavy packy stuff. Bombed through it in 4hi and no TC. Really impressed.

So back to the topic what issues I've experienced. In driving in the actual blizzard I had to stop and clean my wipers off 4 times not sure if this is just low quality wipers or the trait of a vertical windshield. There was one incident where the wiper actually lifted and a chunk of ice got stuck between the wiper and the windshield.

Next issues occurred today with the snow melting during the day and freezing at sundown I'm getting a lot of ice build up. When I went to leave work today the door took 4 tries to latch. The final was more of a same before it actually latched. I also struggled to get the tailgate open as it iced to the tonneau cover. I had to pound my hand in several locations before it would release.

Speaking of the tonneau cover I have the roll up what is the best way to treat the cover? I am brushing it of with a broom and what doesn't get brushed off becomes ice and sticks to the fabric.

Still waiting on my Rubi, but I'm glad to see this post. Thanks for the pics too!

The U.P. makes a perfect location for testing how the JL will hold up under harsh winter conditions. All the little things that low temps, snow, wind, ice, and the freeze-thaw-freeze cycle can do to vehicle performance.

I just got back from hunting at a deer camp in one of the upper counties of the lower peninsula and a week earlier the whole area got hit with a snow storm that dumped a similar amount of the white stuff. Temps during the time I was there were between 9 and 22-degrees. You definitely needed 4WD capability to get around on the trails there.

Can't wait to get my Rubi and go back up there.

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[SwampFox]

Open window. Wait for wiper. Smartly grab wiper with left hand. Lift quickly. Let it bounce back onto windshield as it relates back. The shockwave will clear the ice from the blade.

I tried that back in 1970. I still have the 1 1/2 inch scar on the inside of my middle finger.!

 

[Koja]

This week has been busy for us getting some real winter experience in. So far I haven't gotten my truck stuck yet and it's providing to be very good in snow. Still running the stock Dueler ATs was able to blast my self through some serious snow. This morning one section of road wasn't plowed about 200 yards with about 18"-20" of heavy packy stuff. Bombed through it in 4hi and no TC. Really impressed.

So back to the topic what issues I've experienced. In driving in the actual blizzard I had to stop and clean my wipers off 4 times not sure if this is just low quality wipers or the trait of a vertical windshield. There was one incident where the wiper actually lifted and a chunk of ice got stuck between the wiper and the windshield.

Next issues occurred today with the snow melting during the day and freezing at sundown I'm getting a lot of ice build up. When I went to leave work today the door took 4 tries to latch. The final was more of a same before it actually latched. I also struggled to get the tailgate open as it iced to the tonneau cover. I had to pound my hand in several locations before it would release.

Speaking of the tonneau cover I have the roll up what is the best way to treat the cover? I am brushing it of with a broom and what doesn't get brushed off becomes ice and sticks to the fabric.

Move south were its warmer then you doint have to worry about all that cold stuff

 

[ShadowsPapa]

I can sort of see the defrost comments now after our freaky nasty snow and ice and WIND storm that snuck up on some of us. The defrost kicks out crazy great amounts of warm air - the ends of the duct - nuttin' - so.......... will look into the resolution others have posted here - blocks or squares to put in a couple of the middle spots of the defrost. After a while on high and hot it got better but I was driving into 20-30 mph winds where temps fell from 40 to 20 in only an hour. (it's lower than that, now)
Also less that please with having to keep going into and out of 4H all the time because the traction control does zip, nothing at all Never once felt like anti-lock brakes worked and the back end kept wanting to whip around sideways every couple miles or so, on the highway or in town, it was wild keeping it straight even at only 40 mph on the interstate. (and less than 20 in town)
I begin to think the limited slip differential was a big boo-boo on my part - and wonder- is the traction control even working on this thing at all? My Silverado was tons better, and my WJ will be my preferred winter vehicle for now.
At least I made it - not like the many dozens I saw going and coming back that did not - or the pile of trucks and cars that blocked and closed I80 for a while today, or the trucks that couldn't make it up hills of only 3 degrees.

 

[Up venture]

I can sort of see the defrost comments now after our freaky nasty snow and ice and WIND storm that snuck up on some of us. The defrost kicks out crazy great amounts of warm air - the ends of the duct - nuttin' - so.......... will look into the resolution others have posted here - blocks or squares to put in a couple of the middle spots of the defrost. After a while on high and hot it got better but I was driving into 20-30 mph winds where temps fell from 40 to 20 in only an hour. (it's lower than that, now)
Also less that please with having to keep going into and out of 4H all the time because the traction control does zip, nothing at all Never once felt like anti-lock brakes worked and the back end kept wanting to whip around sideways every couple miles or so, on the highway or in town, it was wild keeping it straight even at only 40 mph on the interstate. (and less than 20 in town)
I begin to think the limited slip differential was a big boo-boo on my part - and wonder- is the traction control even working on this thing at all? My Silverado was tons better, and my WJ will be my preferred winter vehicle for now.
At least I made it - not like the many dozens I saw going and coming back that did not - or the pile of trucks and cars that blocked and closed I80 for a while today, or the trucks that couldn't make it up hills of only 3 degrees.

Definitely agree about the defrost which could have been related to my issue of wipers icing up. It was cooking me so I turned it down a few times.

We're getting ice today been raining since early this morning and currently only 27°. My ABS, TC, and SC were all working today. Still ran 2wd but had a few spots that trouble. My driveway is a hill that comes out into the middle of a hill so staring out with some slip going up hill slightly annoying driving with the power getting cut and trying make the shift to second. Then started out at a stop sign I could feel the BLD working to get traction to get me going. Then the ABS kicked in as I was trying make my corner for work. It's definitely slick out there today. Had to do the penguin shuffle getting into the office .
From my stand point the systems operated appropriately.

 

[ShadowsPapa]

Definitely agree about the defrost which could have been related to my issue of wipers icing up. It was cooking me so I turned it down a few times.

We're getting ice today been raining since early this morning and currently only 27°. My ABS, TC, and SC were all working today. Still ran 2wd but had a few spots that trouble. My driveway is a hill that comes out into the middle of a hill so staring out with some slip going up hill slightly annoying driving with the power getting cut and trying make the shift to second. Then started out at a stop sign I could feel the BLD working to get traction to get me going. Then the ABS kicked in as I was trying make my corner for work. It's definitely slick out there today. Had to do the penguin shuffle getting into the office .
From my stand point the systems operated appropriately.

Well I get back to mine having the limited slip - likely should have skipped that since the electronics handle that via BLD and the tires on the Overland. You have tires more made for sport, I suspect. Mine - great quiet and smooth highway tires, ice and snow, meh, nope.
Michigan - likely the system related to the crap we got today that will cost insurance companies DEARLY as the damage reports come in on all the busted up, smacked and crushed vehicles get reported. One just ahead of me when mine started to slip sideways in the rear -the front of that car was nearly ripped clear off.
I called my wife and said I was going to the dealer to have them look at the bed cover - when she answered the phone first words out of her mouth - oh, no, you've been in a wreck.......
No, damned close, but no. At least we have full REPLACEMENT COST insurance as part of our standard policy for the first 4 or 5 years!

 

[Up venture]

Well I get back to mine having the limited slip - likely should have skipped that since the electronics handle that via BLD and the tires on the Overland. You have tires more made for sport, I suspect. Mine - great quiet and smooth highway tires, ice and snow, meh, nope.
Michigan - likely the system related to the crap we got today that will cost insurance companies DEARLY as the damage reports come in on all the busted up, smacked and crushed vehicles get reported. One just ahead of me when mine started to slip sideways in the rear -the front of that car was nearly ripped clear off.
I called my wife and said I was going to the dealer to have them look at the bed cover - when she answered the phone first words out of her mouth - oh, no, you've been in a wreck.......
No, damned close, but no. At least we have full REPLACEMENT COST insurance as part of our standard policy for the first 4 or 5 years!

I wasn't able to get the limited slip with my manual at the time I ordered. I know with my Silverado the systems would fight each other and seemed to bang hard. Though once going over 20mph or so the limited slip shouldn't be a factor as they're supposed to disengage as I understand.

There was a roll over this morning just down the road here.

I'm still running the factory Dueler ATs on my Sport S. They seem to be adequate I know they're not the greatest but I'm still impressed with how they are performing.

 

[ShadowsPapa]

Limited slip isn't speed aware. They have, depending on the type, typically cones or clutch packs. They hold the axles together inside and only let one move independent if the torque exceeds the break-away spec.For example, one axle I rebuilt recently the limited slip break-away was 100 ft-pounds of torque (that's the spec) but it really only took about 40. When I got into it the disks were blue (and the prior "mechanic" assembled the pack wrong anyway, likely why it blew)
So that means on a slick surface you aren't going to have enough torque on one wheel to let that thing slip - on a slick road for all practical purposes the axles are locked together.
On a dry road the grip is good on the road and the wheel that needs to turn can easily overcome the break-away torque needed of 100 ft-pounds or so. That's why sometimes on a hot asphalt surface or with a bit of sand you hear the squeal or one wheel spins a bit on the sand as there's not enough tire to road grip to break the clutches loose inside.
Anyway, on a slick road the wheels may as well be locked together. And that's how mine acted today.
My Silverado walked out of just about anything I threw at it. The transfer case control knob never got fingerprints on it, only locked it in maybe 3 or 4 times tops over 9 years in really DEEP snow.
Not impressed with the Overland with limited slip - everything else I have does better.
And the smarky nay-sayers can save the comments about learning to drive in winter. I've had to commute miles to every job I've ever had, through blizzard, ice storms with 2" of ice flying off cars and trucks, power out for a week it was so bad..... this plain and simple stock, as ordered, isn't nearly up to what my Chevy was - my WJ is far more sure-footed. I'm not so sure the traction control ever worked, I never felt or heard a thing and my Chevy you could tell what it was doing. You could hear brakes, etc. working.
My Eagles were far more sure-footed but then they have a full-time 4wd transfer case with the silicone limited slip coupling in the t-case. an NP 129 with viscous coupling. You had to lose traction on one front and one rear wheel to get stopped.
I allow it may be my ordering the limited slip that I'll live to regret - but otherwise, it was a beast to try to keep it under control and it had to be put in 4H every time I came to a bit of packed snow or ice. Did not like the constant shifting of the transfer case to keep it moving.

 

[Tim]

Limited slip isn't speed aware. They have, depending on the type, typically cones or clutch packs. They hold the axles together inside and only let one move independent if the torque exceeds the break-away spec.For example, one axle I rebuilt recently the limited slip break-away was 100 ft-pounds of torque (that's the spec) but it really only took about 40. When I got into it the disks were blue (and the prior "mechanic" assembled the pack wrong anyway, likely why it blew)
So that means on a slick surface you aren't going to have enough torque on one wheel to let that thing slip - on a slick road for all practical purposes the axles are locked together.
On a dry road the grip is good on the road and the wheel that needs to turn can easily overcome the break-away torque needed of 100 ft-pounds or so. That's why sometimes on a hot asphalt surface or with a bit of sand you hear the squeal or one wheel spins a bit on the sand as there's not enough tire to road grip to break the clutches loose inside.
Anyway, on a slick road the wheels may as well be locked together. And that's how mine acted today.
My Silverado walked out of just about anything I threw at it. The transfer case control knob never got fingerprints on it, only locked it in maybe 3 or 4 times tops over 9 years in really DEEP snow.
Not impressed with the Overland with limited slip - everything else I have does better.
And the smarky nay-sayers can save the comments about learning to drive in winter. I've had to commute miles to every job I've ever had, through blizzard, ice storms with 2" of ice flying off cars and trucks, power out for a week it was so bad..... this plain and simple stock, as ordered, isn't nearly up to what my Chevy was - my WJ is far more sure-footed. I'm not so sure the traction control ever worked, I never felt or heard a thing and my Chevy you could tell what it was doing. You could hear brakes, etc. working.
My Eagles were far more sure-footed but then they have a full-time 4wd transfer case with the silicone limited slip coupling in the t-case. an NP 129 with viscous coupling. You had to lose traction on one front and one rear wheel to get stopped.
I allow it may be my ordering the limited slip that I'll live to regret - but otherwise, it was a beast to try to keep it under control and it had to be put in 4H every time I came to a bit of packed snow or ice. Did not like the constant shifting of the transfer case to keep it moving.

I'll agree with your statement that GM full size trucks have decent limited slip/lockers. My Sierra actually had what GM calls a locker (Eaton G80 automatic locking rear differential). I almost never NEEDED 4 wheel drive with that truck. It was great in snow.

I haven't had the JT in real snow yet. So far the precipitation here has been all rain this year. That will change soon enough.

 

[ShadowsPapa]

I'll agree with your statement that GM full size trucks have decent limited slip/lockers. My Sierra actually had what GM calls a locker (Eaton G80 automatic locking rear differential). I almost never NEEDED 4 wheel drive with that truck. It was great in snow.

I haven't had the JT in real snow yet. So far the precipitation here has been all rain this year. That will change soon enough.

I LOVE the JT overall, but the Chevy was much better in the snow and on slick roads.
The Gladiator simply didn't engage traction or stability control in the slides and on the ice. It actually let me spin a wheel taking a tight corner fast under heavy acceleration. (I tried it out a day or so ago - it let me slide a wheel around the corner)

Maybe you caught CBS news tonight showing the massive pile-up on I80 here today............. trucks all over, cars sliding and slamming into them..........

 

[Harley505]

Snow and go... my first winter white ride! It sure was fun! I love the way the snow piled up on the tires beyond the fender flairs!

 

[ShadowsPapa]

Snow and go... my first winter white ride! It sure was fun! I love the way the snow piled up on the tires beyond the fender flairs!

My wife would be envious - she wants SNOW now.
And I'd rather drive in that deep stuff than what we had.
She kept saying how disappointed she was, she didn't want it to stop.

 

[88mmm]

My Overland with a LSD and snow tires was great in the snow. It did fishtail a little more then my Ram with the same setup but was easier to control. I think the wide gearing of the manual may also be a benefit here as it's never really in the meat of the torque band.

 

[ShadowsPapa]

My Overland with a LSD and snow tires was great in the snow. It did fishtail a little more then my Ram with the same setup but was easier to control. I think the wide gearing of the manual may also be a benefit here as it's never really in the meat of the torque band.

Some folks may recall how I talked about my Silverado not letting me horse around and squeal tires, mess around sliding around corners for kicks and such - well, the JT will allow that. So much for traction control, etc.
This AM my wife wanted some Christmas stamps - of course I obliged - an excuse to go drive the Jeep again. I figured on the way back I'd just see how stable that truck was. I knew the intersection where I needed to turn to head back home had some sand and a tiny bit of stuff left from yesterday so I slowed for my left turn and as I entered the turn, I mashed it - SQUEEEEEEAAAALLLLL as the right tire made a nice mark and the left tire I could hear was throwing sand, then the transmission kicked down (FINALLY) to low and WHAM - off I went, like a rocket.
(LOL - made me feel like a teen again)
We've mentioned how these transmissions tend to stay in a higher gear unlike past transmissions that may shift down to almost low - these often stick in 3 or 4 when cornering, I have to slow WAY down for mine to hit D2.
So - while my Chevy would have cut the gas and controlled the wheel spin, this thing did nothing of the sort and let the wheels spin freely until it downshifted then I lost the torque and momentum to keep the wheels broke loose and they grabbed. In short, it acted like I had mashed my Javelin's throttle.
I was shocked it let me squeal the tires and spin them like it did - even for a short time! The chevy would have slapped me down and cut the gas.
It makes me think perhaps Jeep only senses road speed by the rear wheels and figured, hey, they are both turning, no problem, where the Chevy sensed the front wheels were hardly turning at all - so choked back the rear wheels as well??
The Jeep would let the front and rear turn at different speeds, in short. It didn't calculate the truck was hardly moving based on the front wheels and it allowed the rears to easily break loose.

I need to buy the TSM for these things (the technical service manual - that's what we used to call them)

 

[PyrPatriot]

I need to buy the TSM for these things (the technical service manual - that's what we used to call them)

Good luck. I have asked repeatedly and it is not available. Jeep technicians now use an online program. They may come out with one on a CD/thumb-drive later, as the latest available TSM is for a 2019 Jeep Wrangler. Neither FCA customer service, MOPAR, nor 2 Jeep dealerships service departments had even heard of one being available. I'll buy one as soon as it's available

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