Manuals might be dead

[jimbom]

Head over to the JL forum. Nobody is raving about the manual over there. Mostly the same complaints as the JT. The transmission and shifter are fine. The gearing sucks and was clearly designed to up the MPGs. No need for two overdrives. The auto does a much better job of masking the V6s lack of torque down low.

I'm not following. What do you want the 6 gears to do differently? Do you want 1st to lug more off the line AND give up the crawl capability? If the complaint is "lack of torque down low", how does the 8 speed auto allow the engine to rev higher between shifts? It doesn't. If torque is lacking at low revs and you would want to rev higher between shifts, that means you need fewer gears across the spread, i.e. 4 gears rev'ed to provide ample torque is all you need to get to cruise. Yet, at the same time you are complaining that our gear box IS essentially a 4 speed. So which is it that you want, the ability to make 5 short shifts (or 7 even shorter shifts made for you) or an engine that doesn't lug?

BTW, the beauty of your 6-speed is YOU can manage the shifts to do a better job of everything, particularly "masking the V6's lack of torque down low." Redlne is 6500 RPM. If you want the torque you expect at high RPMs, then shift at a higher RPM. You can also choose to lug it when needed which simply is NOT an option with the 8-speed. With the auto, if the computer decides to downshift, you have no say in the matter.

I had essentially the same 8-speed in my Ram 1200 with the V-8 hemi. Low end torque was never an issue with that engine and the automatic worked magnificently. Except for the fact that the computer often decided to shift my truck when I didn't want it to. Before I bought the Ram, I didn't know how badly I would miss a manual transmission. Thankfully the Gladiator came along available with the 6-speed. After just a few weeks with my 6-speed Gladiator, the world is right again. The control I have with an 84:1 crawl ratio and the clutch fully engaged cannot be equaled with an auto. Having gas-saving gears for a ~2400 RPM cruise at either ~65 mph or ~80 mph is a bonus in my book.

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[Mark Doiron]

Head over to the JL forum. Nobody is raving about the manual over there. Mostly the same complaints as the JT. The transmission and shifter are fine. The gearing sucks and was clearly designed to up the MPGs. No need for two overdrives. The auto does a much better job of masking the V6s lack of torque down low.

That was my first impression of the gearing. Then I took it off-road and in 4WD low and decided that, in fact, in a Rubi this gearing is way better than the gearing in Rubi JKs for overlanding. That is, I routinely get complaints from Wrangler Rubi drivers (I also own a JK X, which is a Sport by a prior name). Their complaint is that they can't travel very fast in low gear range and need to stop to shift in and out. Which is a minor annoyance. The rest of us are perfectly happy at faster speeds in low speed gearing. The Gladiator does a much better job in low gear. Yeah, I find myself cruising along the Interstate in 4th gear at 70 MPH sometimes because that RPM is essentially what my 4.88 geared JK does in sixth gear. But, the JT has no problems getting up long hills, like that 3.8L motor does. Honestly, while at first I was puzzled by the strange gearing, now it makes some sense. It's a compromise. A better answer would be a proper three-speed transfer case, but then we'd have to listen to the bellyachers who think upgrades should be free.

 

[flyinj]

Sad about this and also hope It's a temporary thing. We were ready to put in an order for a manual JT Rubicon and the dealer we were working with confirmed they were not taking orders for manuals.

As other people mentioned it sounds the same for people ordering manual wranglers:

https://www.jlwranglerforums.com/forum/threads/unable-to-order-a-manual-transmission.46900/

I guess for now I will be keeping a firm hold on our 2013 manual JKU. It will be interesting if Jeep pulls manual transmissions and Ford does actually offer one when they release the Bronco. My gut is telling me this is temporary. Some of the posts on the Wrangler forum in the link above support that too. Keep any news coming.

 

[Bbannongmu]

@JeepCares ....any official word on Manual transmission ordering? Or the future of manual transmissions?

 

[Rex3rd]

If Manuel transmission which is standard isn't available they need to adjust there prices on there build tool. That means any trim you get just went up 2k

 

[ciarraikerry]

Sad about this and also hope It's a temporary thing. We were ready to put in an order for a manual JT Rubicon and the dealer we were working with confirmed they were not taking orders for manuals.

As other people mentioned it sounds the same for people ordering manual wranglers:

https://www.jlwranglerforums.com/forum/threads/unable-to-order-a-manual-transmission.46900/

I guess for now I will be keeping a firm hold on our 2013 manual JKU. It will be interesting if Jeep pulls manual transmissions and Ford does actually offer one when they release the Bronco. My gut is telling me this is temporary. Some of the posts on the Wrangler forum in the link above support that too. Keep any news coming.

Same. I tried to order my MT JTR this week and was told he would put me on a waiting list to call if restriction is lifted. I was hit by a drunk driver in my JKU manual a month ago today. I’m supposed to get it back from the body shop tomorrow...sick of this Mitsubishi rental. Maybe that is fueling my unwillingness to give in and order the automatic.
I really hope this is temporary and I don’t miss out on the truck I want.

 

[mojocho]

Yah, I've yet to hear anyone sing the praises of the stick beyond the fanbois that will deem it superior no matter what. Bummer that it isn't stronger, I'd love to go w/ a Mojave stick but not if it runs like crap.

A fanboi here with MT on Rubi. I know you meant "fanboi" as a derogatory descriptor, but I guess it is indeed descriptive of me.

But you can use that on many broader levels, like the JT in general when compared to other vehicles...I guess you're a fanboi as well. Or Jeeps in general. I guess several hundred thousand of buyers over multiple generations are fanbois as well.

As others have, stated it's geared well for off-road use. But this great truck and it's vast fanboi network pulls in many demographics whom not all will go off-road. So unfortunately it won't check the box for everyone. Thank God we all have choices and can find a perfect vehicle so everyone can be a "fanboi"of their choice.

 

[JeepTruckin]

The MT i test drove reminded me of my SM465 in my 71 Jimmy. Start in 2nd and only use 3rd and 4th in town with the benefit of OD. I think that too many people have gotten used to the "car style" MTs with nice short steps between gears. i think that Jeep did a good job building a "truck" MT with offroad capability in mind.....btw i bought an AT (max tow)

 

[Quick]

@JeepCares ....any official word on Manual transmission ordering? Or the future of manual transmissions?

I sent a message to them yesterday and they just said it will not be offered for order in march 2020, and told me to contact my dealer for more information when I asked when they were going to be available again ... I hope it’s April 1

 

[jurfie]

For those wringing their hands: Jeep isn’t getting rid of the MT; this is temporary. When people ordered in the past, there were certain options that created a longer wait than expected (ie GCM, steel bumper, bed liner, and yes, even the MT). Maybe Jeep has decided to let buyers know before ordering to avoid disappointment? And rather than encourage a potential buyer on the hook to wait, dealers are trying to get them into an automatic to make the sale today?

 

[Bbannongmu]

Same. I tried to order my MT JTR this week and was told he would put me on a waiting list to call if restriction is lifted. I was hit by a drunk driver in my JKU manual a month ago today. I’m supposed to get it back from the body shop tomorrow...sick of this Mitsubishi rental. Maybe that is fueling my unwillingness to give in and order the automatic.
I really hope this is temporary and I don’t miss out on the truck I want.

Stay the course and call, email and post about MT!!

 

[WhatExit?]

If Manuel transmission which is standard isn't available they need to adjust there prices on there build tool. That means any trim you get just went up 2k

 

[DreamedofaJeepSomeday]

After reading all the “it’s a 4 speed with 2 overdrives “ (which it actually is) and “the sweet spot is is 3500-4000 RPM”, I start feeling like I am in bizarro world. This transmission gearing is very comparable to other manuals if you look at the ratios. If you like to stomp on the pedal to here the RPMs to drive like a race car that’s your thing (And more a statement on how quiet the engine is).This transmission shifts just fine at 2000, 2500, or whatever rpm you like, in city driving as long as the next light isn’t 20 feet away, you can even ride in sixth at 40mph and 1000 rpm and keep right up with traffic, below that speed the engine hesitates and you need to shift down like any other manual transmission. ...Not a fan bois, just enjoy manual transmissions.

There's nothing wrong with this combination. A 285 hp v6 paired to a transmission that will crawl, and still get 22mpg? Stock?? This is the stuff we dreamed of being able to buy in the eighties.

Right on, both of you! Now, if I could just find one ...

 

[Bobzdar]

I'm not following. What do you want the 6 gears to do differently? Do you want 1st to lug more off the line AND give up the crawl capability? If the complaint is "lack of torque down low", how does the 8 speed auto allow the engine to rev higher between shifts? It doesn't. If torque is lacking at low revs and you would want to rev higher between shifts, that means you need fewer gears across the spread, i.e. 4 gears rev'ed to provide ample torque is all you need to get to cruise. Yet, at the same time you are complaining that our gear box IS essentially a 4 speed. So which is it that you want, the ability to make 5 short shifts (or 7 even shorter shifts made for you) or an engine that doesn't lug?

BTW, the beauty of your 6-speed is YOU can manage the shifts to do a better job of everything, particularly "masking the V6's lack of torque down low." Redlne is 6500 RPM. If you want the torque you expect at high RPMs, then shift at a higher RPM. You can also choose to lug it when needed which simply is NOT an option with the 8-speed. With the auto, if the computer decides to downshift, you have no say in the matter.

I had essentially the same 8-speed in my Ram 1200 with the V-8 hemi. Low end torque was never an issue with that engine and the automatic worked magnificently. Except for the fact that the computer often decided to shift my truck when I didn't want it to. Before I bought the Ram, I didn't know how badly I would miss a manual transmission. Thankfully the Gladiator came along available with the 6-speed. After just a few weeks with my 6-speed Gladiator, the world is right again. The control I have with an 84:1 crawl ratio and the clutch fully engaged cannot be equaled with an auto. Having gas-saving gears for a ~2400 RPM cruise at either ~65 mph or ~80 mph is a bonus in my book.

Well, 1st lugging the engine is horrible for it, so not sure why you'd want to do it. 2nd, you can lug the 8 speed auto if you want, it has a manual mode that holds the gear for the most part unless you do something stupid. So you can control the rpms if you want to, get the extra 2 gears, extra towing capability, better crawl ratio, better acceleration etc. etc.

I used to be a manual die hard...Until autos surpassed them in virtually every way. I have 'antique' (mid 90's) sports cars and an old land rover to row the gears on, but I'd no longer buy a modern vehicle with one. Too many compromises, unfortunately. This thread, which is ostensibly a pro MT thread, does a good job of outlining a lot of those compromises...

 

[DreamedofaJeepSomeday]

.. you can lug the 8 speed auto if you want, it has a manual mode that holds the gear for the most part unless you do something stupid...

In my admittedly limited experience, the 8-speed severely limits the shifts it will let you make in "manual" mode.

I'd no longer buy a modern vehicle with [manual]. Too many compromises, unfortunately.

The auto trans has too many compromises for some. That is why Jeep gives us a choice.

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