No DRL / Blinkers options

[NJ_Mojave]

Has anyone completely removed their drl / blinkers?

I just installed some Oracle headlights with switchback halos and want to clean up the front end. Can’t find a chop kit/brace that suits my eye. And fenders without lights are apparently hard to find, although, I do like the Nemesis crawlers.

How floppy would the fender be if I just removed all but top section ?

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[cdyoung9799]

Has anyone completely removed their drl / blinkers?

I just installed some Oracle headlights with switchback halos and want to clean up the front end. Can’t find a chop kit/brace that suits my eye. And fenders without lights are apparently hard to find, although, I do like the Nemesis crawlers.

How floppy would the fender be if I just removed all but top section ?

I swapped out my standard DRL's on my old JLUR with the MOPAR LED's. Based on the way the fender is constructed, you would lose most (maybe all) of the support, which would not fare well over time.

Besides that, you've got to be DOT compliant with your lighting. Have you considered thinner steel fenders with smaller, possibly smoked turn signals and marker lights. I haven't looked into these myself, but surely someone makes something that would get you the look you're going for. Good luck.

 

[j.o.y.ride]

JCR fenders have really minimal lights. You don't wanna go with zero side markers.

 

[ShadowsPapa]

Sort of ironic - I got pulled over for no front side markers years ago, and a few years later, my youngest son got pulled over for no turn signals and side markers (we were each working on our cars and had certain parts removed but drove them during the process)
Lights exist for reasons......... and the laws state they should exist for reasons.
A trim clean minimalist look is fine, even cool - but don't get caught - or worse, get someone hurt because a vehicle isn't marked as per law via lights.

JCR fenders have really minimal lights. You don't wanna go with zero side markers.

Interesting fender and clever light placement, etc.

 

[j.o.y.ride]

JCR. Minimal lighting


 

[NJ_Mojave]

Well…in NJ…I only need 2 headlights and 2 blinkers. Hence the purchase of headlights with switchback halos.

I do still have some small round DOT reflectors from Klearz…. might mount one on chop bracket , facing the side..???

 

[Agyoung35]

Just to point out even if that makes you compliant in New Jersey, cops might not know that and still hassle you from time to time. Also other drivers are going to be looking at the edge of your vehicle for a turn signal not at where our headlights are since they so far in.

 

[NJ_Mojave]

Just to point out even if that makes you compliant in New Jersey, cops might not know that and still hassle you from time to time. Also other drivers are going to be looking at the edge of your vehicle for a turn signal not at where our headlights are since they so far in.

That’s a good point about LEOs but I can simply pull out my phone and show them the statue. Or just allow them to act like they know the law and make them look foolish in court…like I have before with many of my diesels I use for truck pulling…long story !!!

And the other drivers looking at the edge for a blinker….I just went outside and looked…I can’t see it from the side now. The amber maker does not illuminate in any way. Plus JKs blinkers are located on the grille below their headlights..???!!!

 

[Agyoung35]

That’s a good point about LEOs but I can simply pull out my phone and show them the statue. Or just allow them to act like they know the law and make them look foolish in court…like I have before with many of my diesels I use for truck pulling…long story !!!

And the other drivers looking at the edge for a blinker….I just went outside and looked…I can’t see it from the side now. The amber maker does not illuminate in any way. Plus JKs blinkers are located on the grille below their headlights..???!!!

Look this isn't the hill i'm going to die on. I'm just saying most people try to avoid getting pulled over and technically being right doesn't help you when you're running late to an appointment and you now get to spend 30 minutes on the side of the road showing the officer how he's mistaken. You're right about the Jk having them under the lights and they're frequently covered up no doubt from other mods. But Those minimal fenders look great and are discreet while saving you alot of hassle down the road.

 

[ShadowsPapa]

That’s a good point about LEOs but I can simply pull out my phone and show them the statue. Or just allow them to act like they know the law and make them look foolish in court…like I have before with many of my diesels I use for truck pulling…long story !!!

And the other drivers looking at the edge for a blinker….I just went outside and looked…I can’t see it from the side now. The amber maker does not illuminate in any way. Plus JKs blinkers are located on the grille below their headlights..???!!!

IF yo don't have side position marker lights, you are in violation of FEDERAL law. Your local laws don't trump federal laws, they only supplement them or add to them. So since the FEDS require side markers, you can be ticketed.
You'd best look at FEDERAL laws not your state laws. A trooper can still get you for violations when they show up in court and show the judge the federal statutes on lighting.

Here's the federal law in a nutshell -
All 1970 and newer vehicles first sold in the USA or Canada are to be equipped with amber front and red rear side marker lights.

Here's how the position marker lights (also called parking lights for the front and rear) are to be marked in North America. This is federal -

P Front position (parking) lamp (you must have an amber light showing up front when stopped at night with the headlights off)
P2 Clearance, Side marker, and/or Identification lamp
P3 Clearance, Side marker and/or Identification lamp for vehicles at least 2,032 mm wide
PC Combination clearance and/or side marker lamp (trucks)
PC2 Combination clearance and/or side marker lamp for vehicles at least 2,032 mm wide
R Reversing (back-up) lamp
S Stop (brake) lamp
S2 Stop (brake) lamp for vehicles at least 2,032 mm wide
T Rear position (tail) lamp
T2 Rear position (tail) lamp for vehicles at least 2,032 mm wide

Bottom line -
You must have amber lights on the side of the front of the vehicle visible after dark. They must be reflective when not "on".
You must have red side position marker lights on the side of the rear of the vehicle visible after dark. They must be reflective when not "on".
You must have amber lights visible after dark on the front end of the vehicle.

Your desire to make your jeep manly and/or "pretty" to look at doesn't trump federal law or the safety of others.
When I worked in a shop that did 24/7 towing, more than once vehicles were pulled in because there wasn't proper lighting or reflectors visible after dark and they got hit - usually injuring the other party.
Cool doesn't trump law or safety.

 

[NJ_Mojave]

IF yo don't have side position marker lights, you are in violation of FEDERAL law. Your local laws don't trump federal laws, they only supplement them or add to them. So since the FEDS require side markers, you can be ticketed.
You'd best look at FEDERAL laws not your state laws. A trooper can still get you for violations when they show up in court and show the judge the federal statutes on lighting.

Here's the federal law in a nutshell -
All 1970 and newer vehicles first sold in the USA or Canada are to be equipped with amber front and red rear side marker lights.

Here's how the position marker lights (also called parking lights for the front and rear) are to be marked in North America. This is federal -

P Front position (parking) lamp (you must have an amber light showing up front when stopped at night with the headlights off)
P2 Clearance, Side marker, and/or Identification lamp
P3 Clearance, Side marker and/or Identification lamp for vehicles at least 2,032 mm wide
PC Combination clearance and/or side marker lamp (trucks)
PC2 Combination clearance and/or side marker lamp for vehicles at least 2,032 mm wide
R Reversing (back-up) lamp
S Stop (brake) lamp
S2 Stop (brake) lamp for vehicles at least 2,032 mm wide
T Rear position (tail) lamp
T2 Rear position (tail) lamp for vehicles at least 2,032 mm wide

Bottom line -
You must have amber lights on the side of the front of the vehicle visible after dark. They must be reflective when not "on".
You must have red side position marker lights on the side of the rear of the vehicle visible after dark. They must be reflective when not "on".
You must have amber lights visible after dark on the front end of the vehicle.

Your desire to make your jeep manly and/or "pretty" to look at doesn't trump federal law or the safety of others.
When I worked in a shop that did 24/7 towing, more than once vehicles were pulled in because there wasn't proper lighting or reflectors visible after dark and they got hit - usually injuring the other party.
Cool doesn't trump law or safety.

So all JKs produced were illegal then….

That’s Commercial by the way…..

 

[ShadowsPapa]

So all JKs produced were illegal then….

That’s Commercial by the way…..

What's commercial? What I quoted?
LOL Nope, it's not, Check Daniel Stern lighting. (well, the same does apply for commercial vehicles but the laws specify PASSENGER vehicles.
Likely you did a google search and ended up on this legal site that does say "commercial lighting laws" - but it applies directly to PASSANGER CARS sold in North America. That's a fact.
I've been involved in auto restoration and repair and electric systems for decades. I've followed these laws and am OCD when it comes to restorations. They must be perfect and compliant with the correct lens markings.

As a classic car collector/restorer, I got to watch the federal regs change and saw how the car companies complied - the rear side markers were rather clever on some models - they simply wrapped the tail lights around the side a bit so red could be seen from the side and made the lenses reflective when the lights were not on.
The side position markers don't have to be independent lights - they can be wrap-around from the end lights. Like the tail light example on a 68/69 Javelin or AMX. 1970 saw the move to distinct rear side marker lights.

Here is from a major automotive site -
Effective January 1, 1968, all passenger cars built for sale in the United States were required to display amber lights or reflectors on the sides of front fenders, and red lights or reflectors on the sides of rear quarter panels.

Here is how one company complied - wrapped the tail light around the side - for the 1970 model year they shrunk the tail lights and put independent side marker lights in the quarter panel.
The pic below is how many companies handled the requirement over the years. They simply made the red or amber lights visible from the side - they didn't always have distinct lights in the quarter panel or the fender.

And in the late 70s they got clever and put their logo on the lights. Do you really think that if it wasn't law that auto makers would spend money coming up with new wiring harnesses, expensive light housings, revamp their quarter panel and fender stampings to put lights in them?

Also - side marker lights like this have a LEFT and a RIGHT so that the light is not visible from the front or an angle. Most side markers are marked for which side they belong on because of the requirements for reflecting light certain ways.

 

[MHulsey91]

So all JKs produced were illegal then….

That’s Commercial by the way…..

ALL JKs were sold with side markers? That big round one on the front fender flares that was a pain in the a.. to remove. About the same spot that the JT and JL side markers are located.

As long as you put a DOT amber side marker light on the side that is also reflective then you will be okay. He isn't arguing the turn signal location. JW Speaker makes a DOT headlight and Turn Signal all in one. That is perfectly fine. Just what he is trying to say is that you will need to add an amber side marker visible from the side to be compliant. Yes there are several people that do not have these lights on their Jeeps anymore. However they were sold with them.
If you remove them and get hit in an intersection at night you could loose in court because your side markers were missing and the person that hit you just has to say "I couldn't see him"

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