Pentastar or 3.0l?

[CerOf]

I'd totally have considered the diesel if it was available with a manual. The fuel economy would have been a wash for me, because diesel fuel costs a lot more than gasoline here in Pa, and the added 6k (4k engine + 2k transmission) was a bit steep . Plus, I just like driving a manual. It's fun. I've had plenty of fast cars, so even the diesel wouldn't satisfy my need for speed, and it would still handle like a jeep. But the torque would be VERY nice.

Diesel is $4k. Auto transmission is $2k. Granted, to get the diesel, you must go automatic. If one were getting automatic with the gas, they also pay $2k.

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[NachoRuby]

Diesel is $4k. Auto transmission is $2k. Granted, to get the diesel, you must go automatic. If one were getting automatic with the gas, they also pay $2k.

Precisely, but since my JT is manual, the difference was $6k between it and the diesel one on the lot.

 

[CerOf]

.

Precisely, but since my JT is manual, the difference was $6k.

ya got me there!!

so….ummm…..my rush hour driving experience in bumper to bumper traffic is better cause I can drive and easily eat that left over cheeseburger from the McDonald’s two cheeseburger meal I found in the back seat! :D

 

[Sazabi19]

I'm surprised no one has mentioned that the diesel doesn't like short trips without guzzling DEF. I bring this up in pretty much every diesel thread but because of my short commute it automatically put the diesel out of running. Not to mention that where I live diesel is almost always AT LEAST $1 more per gallon. Hell even a few years ago when gas was in the high $1 range diesel was still $3+/gal. Any savings I could possibly get are immediately diminished by the pumps in my area. And someone else asked earlier, I believe the tank is smaller in the diesel to make room for the 4gal DEF tank. In summer I can get ~22.5mi/gal so I'm not complaining with my V6

 

[Oil_Burner]

The decision should not revolve around a financial one especially if you are thinking you will save money with the diesel in the long run. The extra cost, in my case it was $3,500 (I purchased from Gupton Motors at 8% below invoice and highly recommend them for anyone in the country purchasing a Gladiator) more for the diesel, will not be recovered by the fuel savings before the first 100,000 miles. As you know, diesel cost more per gallon that gas. Yes, I'm averaging over 27MPG at 65 MPH. I've gone as far as 550 miles on a tank, but I pushed it to nearly empty, which was the risk I took. The oil changes cost more and I use ~1 gallon of DEF / 1000 miles. Jeep advertises that the diesel has a smaller tank near the 19.5 gallons in size. I've found that after the filling nozzle clicks off, I can put between 2 and 3 more gallons in the tank if I fill it very slow. Those that have filled a portable diesel tank can understand that a lot of "diesel foam" can be seen when filling it, and it trips off the filling nozzle. It takes a while for it to dissipate. Adding the last 3 gallons to my Gladiator can take as much time as the first 15 gallons.

Your decision should be based on what your personal preference. Do you want more performance, then get the 3.0L? Do you want an engine that is easier/cheeper to work on, then get the 3.6L? Do you want a factory warrantied engine that gets 70% more torque, but has a bit less HP than the gas engine, get the 3.0L? Carol Shelby's quote comes to mind: "Horsepower sells cars, torque wins races". There are those that spend $8K+ to get a supercharger because they don't like the performance of the 3.6L.

My 3.0L has spent a fair amount of time in Colorado and New Mexico. The built in advantage it has is the turbo gives it full power at any altitude. The performance of a stock 3.6L will drop off considerably at altitude. If you spend most of your time in New York, you won't noice the performance drop due to altitude.

I have 23K miles on my JTRD. It's now 1 year old. No issues at all. No problem getting the oil changed in Ohio and in west Texas (last change was at Sunland Jeep in El Paso 1 month ago.

 

[CerOf]

I agree @Oil_Burner , we’ll said; sums it up nicely.

 

[KWin]

If you get the diesel you'll love it. You'll love it enough to pay the extra. If you don't get the diesel you won't regret it. There is a reason the forum is split with everyone ardently in one camp or the other.
My dad got the diesel cherokee and loves it. He is on his second engine and has had it stuck in the shop for over a month twice, knowing what he knows now he still wouldn't change his mind and buy a gasser.
I bought the gasser because $ the numbers work out better with the gasser, and that's important to me. If I want a fast vehicle I'll get a sports car.

 

[TwelveGaugeSage]

Wouldn't the gasser get better acceleration? The diesel produces more low end hp, but the gasser produces more at the top end. But in the end, the diesel weighs significantly more.

 

[NachoRuby]

Wouldn't the gasser get better acceleration? The diesel produces more low end hp, but the gasser produces more at the top end. But in the end, the diesel weighs significantly more.

7.9s to 60 in the gasser, 7.6s in the diesel. Diesel has better acceleration, at least from a dig to 60.
https://www.motortrend.com/reviews/2021-jeep-gladiator-ecodiesel-first-test-review/

Some publications recorded faster times for both, depending on if 4wd was used or not. But the diesel always comes out on top.

 

[staying_tuned]

Wouldn't the gasser get better acceleration? The diesel produces more low end hp, but the gasser produces more at the top end. But in the end, the diesel weighs significantly more.

Not at all. On perfectly flat ground to 60, someone could mistake them for somewhat close but were talking a handful of truck lengths difference and thats with the official times to 60. Add any weight to the gasser, or introduce an incline and the difference is magnified quite a bit. Top end doesn't matter in this comparison because you'd be manually babysitting select shift just to stay in the band to get the power it has on tap. The diesel puts down its power at 1800 RPM and holds it. You're halfway there at idle so as you can imagine, the difference is quite dramatic verses the 3.6 needing to wind up into the 5-6k range.

Here is a gasser dyno. In stock form it eeeks out 225 HP at the wheels and thats once you get to 6k RPM and boy does that feel like a long time when you find yourself needing to be faster than very sluggish.

Here is the EcoD. She's ready to send it the moment you stomp on the gas. It's night and day.

 

[TwelveGaugeSage]

Not at all. On perfectly flat ground to 60, someone could mistake them for somewhat close but were talking a handful of truck lengths difference and thats with the official times to 60. Add any weight to the gasser, or introduce an incline and the difference is magnified quite a bit. Top end doesn't matter in this comparison because you'd be manually babysitting select shift just to stay in the band to get the power it has on tap. The diesel puts down its power at 1800 RPM and holds it. You're halfway there at idle so as you can imagine, the difference is quite dramatic verses the 3.6 needing to wind up into the 5-6k range.

Here is a gasser dyno. In stock form it eeeks out 225 HP at the wheels and thats once you get to 6k RPM and boy does that feel like a long time when you find yourself needing to be faster than very sluggish.

Here is the EcoD. She's ready to send it the moment you stomp on the gas. It's night and day.

Hard to compare an engine dyno to one measuring at the wheel, but I digress. Like Nacho, if the diesel was available in manual, I would probably have strongly considered it, but I detest driving automatics. Anyone have a link to 1/4 mile times comparing the two in similar builds?

 

[dcmdon]

Wouldn't the gasser get better acceleration? The diesel produces more low end hp, but the gasser produces more at the top end. But in the end, the diesel weighs significantly more.

The gas engine makes great hp at higher RPMs. The diesel makes great hp everywhere.

So if you are racing them by putting your foot to the floor, the gas will be nearly equivalent.

But if you are driving around normally at modest RPM, then the diesel makes much more power.

 

[Mac]

Interesting conversation about rpms, when I had my Dodge 3500 with the Cummins 5.9 for 6 years and 80k miles it never got the crazy mileage and pulled at low rpms as everyone told me it would, real world mpg was much lower and towing my 5th wheel it needed to spin up over 2500 rpms to maintain speed or the egts would get too high. Had a mild tuner, intake, exhaust and all the gauges.

 

[Oil_Burner]

Wouldn't the gasser get better acceleration? The diesel produces more low end hp, but the gasser produces more at the top end. But in the end, the diesel weighs significantly more.

"Power" is determined two ways. Torque and Horse Power. Torque is what accelerates a vehicle. Torque is what you want in a 0-60MPH race. HP gives you top speed, which we really can't see with our Gladiators because Jeep limits top speed in the ECM because of the non-high performance tires used on it.

The diesel should out accelerate a gas Gladiator. The torque curve on the diesel jumps up quickly , and doesn't fall off much at higher RPM. The gas engine doesn't reach max torque until the RPM's are up there. The ECM is designed to provide the best performance for that specific engine/transmission combination. Hence, at full throttle, the gas engine will spend most of it's time at high RPM to keep the performance respectable. The diesel will perform well, but at a lower RPM.

The extra 200 or so pounds from the 3.0L accounts for a 4% increase in the vehicle's weight over the 3.6L; however, the 3.0L (260 HP, 442 lb-ft torque) puts out 70% more torque over the 3.6L (285 HP, 260 lb-ft). The 3.6L does have a 25 HP advantage over the 3.0L.

Horse Power = Torque x RPM / 5252 (5252 is a constant).
Torque = Horse Power x 5252 / RPM

Accelerating, power to get over an obstacle, pulling a heavy load, the Diesel diesel engine has the advantage. Top speed and keeping you going fast, the gas engine has the advantage.

I can say from experience, with the cruise set at 85 MPH in my JTRD, the engine feels like it's barely working and there definitely was room to quickly hit the max speed of 96 MPH if I wanted to get there.

 

[Mac]

Then why are all dragsters not running diesel engines?

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