Regular Suspension on Mojave

[howeitsdone]

Not having luck with search, but I'm sure it's been discussed before so please share links if you have them.

I bought a used Mojave a couple of years ago for a great deal and am not one who bought because of the suspension. At 60k miles I have DW after many offroading trips which is leading me to go ahead and just upgrade everything with a proper lift kit. (Have the AEV 2" now)

Anyway, I thought the buckets or something were the issue, but what would keep me from buying a regular kit and installing on a Mojave (physical barriers)? So many more options, plus I don't care to keep the stock shocks or anything since I want more travel.

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[Stan H]

Not having luck with search, but I'm sure it's been discussed before so please share links if you have them.

I bought a used Mojave a couple of years ago for a great deal and am not one who bought because of the suspension. At 60k miles I have DW after many offroading trips which is leading me to go ahead and just upgrade everything with a proper lift kit. (Have the AEV 2" now)

Anyway, I thought the buckets or something were the issue, but what would keep me from buying a regular kit and installing on a Mojave (physical barriers)? So many more options, plus I don't care to keep the stock shocks or anything since I want more travel.

Check your rims and wheel hub bearings and ball joints.

 

[howeitsdone]

Thanks! Already checked those and replacing BJs. Not a DW diagnosis thread, just looking into regular suspension systems on the Mojave.

 

[Teh_Stormtrooper]

Only lift kit difference between Mojave and any other Gladiator model is the upper shock bolt size on the front shocks. They're 14mm vs 12mm on all other Gladiators. Your new shocks need to have the correct bushing size. Springs, control arms, and everything else are interchangeable.

 

[howeitsdone]

Oh wow, even more simple than I thought. Appreciate the info!

 

[chr15m]

Oh wow, even more simple than I thought. Appreciate the info!

Yeah, as long as you're comfortable drilling out the i.d. on the top bushing of whatever you order to install a large diameter machine bushing to fit the larger diameter bolts, its no problem.

12mm seems to be a standard making it very difficult to source bushings with the alternate 14mm i.d. that the Mojave has from the manufacturer of your choice. Youve got a few easier options but if Fox, Falken or King arent your preference, you'll have to get handy and make your own.

Fox used to have a kit to adapt their aftermarket options but its often out of stock and has doubled in price in the last 2 years.

Ive seen some posts suggesting that Kings come with 2 metal bushings in the top mount position allowing to remove the smaller inner one to allow for the 14mm bolt.

Finally, Falken offers a bushing kit to swap the smaller ones out so it can be installed on the Mojave.

 

[drew0622]

Following....I'm soon to be swapping my 2" AEV for either a 2.5 or 3.5 Clayton. Not decided on shocks just yet.

 

[howeitsdone]

Yeah, as long as you're comfortable drilling out the i.d. on the top bushing of whatever you order to install a large diameter machine bushing to fit the larger diameter bolts, its no problem.

I'll either press them out and replace with M14 size bushings or drill and sleeve the frame threads to reduce down to M12. Bushings probably make more sense, but we'll see!

 

[whysoserious]

As stated above, the front shocks are the only issue. However, it is the lower shock mount bolt that is 14mm. The upper mount on the Mojave has a wider bushing but still a 12mm bolt diameter.

 

[Gregj]

As stated above, the front shocks are the only issue. However, it is the lower shock mount bolt that is 14mm. The upper mount on the Mojave has a wider bushing but still a 12mm bolt diameter.

I don’t know about that, I removed the red shocks from my Rubicon and installed Mojave shocks with zero modifications to the shocks. I did have to add nutserts for the reservoir brackets but that’s it.
Gregj

eta the upper bushing in the Mojave shocks are off set to make room for the larger diameter shock but the width is the same.

 

[whysoserious]

I don’t know about that, I removed the red shocks from my Rubicon and installed Mojave shocks with zero modifications to the shocks. I did have to add nutserts for the reservoir brackets but that’s it.
Gregj

eta the upper bushing in the Mojave shocks are off set to make room for the larger diameter shock but the width is the same.

I see you are in West Texas. I'm in Central Texas. You're welcome to come by and measure my upper and lower shock bolts on my Mojave.

I could be mistaken about the top bushing being wider, but the upper and lower bolts are different diameters.

 

[outdoor.adventures]

I don’t know about that, I removed the red shocks from my Rubicon and installed Mojave shocks with zero modifications to the shocks. I did have to add nutserts for the reservoir brackets but that’s it.
Gregj

eta the upper bushing in the Mojave shocks are off set to make room for the larger diameter shock but the width is the same.

It might not be a big deal, but it might suddenly become one. The load is no longer being carried correctly because even though the shock eye is clamped tightly between the mounts, the bolt doesn't carry the load like it normally would. Bolt fatigue, shock eye and bolt hammer each other, double sheer - The bolt starts seeing bending and cyclic impact, which bolts (and me), are terrible at.

But... I've done far worse things on purpose

 

[Wheelin98TJ]

It might not be a big deal, but it might suddenly become one. The load is no longer being carried correctly because even though the shock eye is clamped tightly between the mounts, the bolt doesn't carry the load like it normally would. Bolt fatigue, shock eye and bolt hammer each other, double sheer - The bolt starts seeing bending and cyclic impact, which bolts (and me), are terrible at.

But... I've done far worse things on purpose

Bolted connections like this rely on clamping force.

 

[Gregj]

It might not be a big deal, but it might suddenly become one. The load is no longer being carried correctly because even though the shock eye is clamped tightly between the mounts, the bolt doesn't carry the load like it normally would. Bolt fatigue, shock eye and bolt hammer each other, double sheer - The bolt starts seeing bending and cyclic impact, which bolts (and me), are terrible at.

But... I've done far worse things on purpose

If the bolt was allowed to get loose this could be a problem but it would have to clunk around a lot before it broke.
Gregj

 

[chr15m]

If the bolt was allowed to get loose this could be a problem but it would have to clunk around a lot before it broke.
Gregj

If I understand what is being said, if a smaller diameter bolt is used to fasten thru an larger diameter mounting point there will be a couple possible issues.

First, while the fastening static force is applied to the outer fastening surfaces, any slack between them will still allow for movement. They may not "become loose", as in the bolt can remain at initial torque settings, but the tolerance between the bolt and bushing in this case will still allow vibration and movement between the two. Eventually this will wallow or ovalize the two and eventually increase the movement between them. It'll be fine initially, but wear will occur and will accelerate the wear rate the longer it is left. Eventually fracturing the bushing most likely and resulting in some of what we've seen on here with Billstien bushings cracking.

I've had bolts loosen and wallow, within a hundred miles the bushings and frame flanges were damaged. It can happen quickly. Bad experience with a bad tech when I was careless enough to not do the work myself.

Second, it may be possible that the increased tolerance between the bolt and bushing could reduce the fastening surface and allow more of the force to be located on the frame flanges, possible resulting in deformation. While the first will happen eventually. The second is an assumption, but may also occur, and has under different circumstances for me.

Bolted connections like this rely on clamping force.

Static fastening force does this at the bolt head and the flange of the nut or in our case the surface surrounding the welded/threaded frame nut. Most likely those would stay the same, even with the improper diameter bushing. If the length was wrong, then this changes the clamping force as well.

The bolt and bushing are also subject to shear forces, this is where you would want as much reinforcement or shear strength as possible, coupled with low tolerance between parts. Tolerance or gaps allow potentially uneven dispersal of force and possibly allow greater torque to exist than designed to allow when those gaps allow parts to become fulcrums that weren't intended to be. If the gap between the bolt and bushing were increased the bushing could be allowed to achieve greater angles and place greater torque values on both parts as a result. The gaps also allow increase occurrences of these torque values, accelerating wear. Both the bolt and bushing would incur more stress and vibration.

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