Travel Trailer advice

[Timoleon]

What I have . Works great and very simple install. Plus you can take it to other vehicles.

I got one of those as well. Works great.

On the towing capability; I just know from towing a Coleman Rubicon 16 footer (with the slide out) that the motor is being loaded quite a bit. The trailer tag says that max loading gets the weight up to 5100 lbs. I have noticed that towing on flat and level roads that the motor is struggling to pull the load (and my rating is 7K on my OEM configured JTR). Way back in school we were told to design to 63% of working limits and stay below that number. With that in mind, I try to tow with no water, grey water or black water in the tanks. That helps a lot, but the wife keeps coming to the trailer with more stuff (because there is so much room). I just live with it. I do try to minimize the tow distances so I am not (over time) burning up the motor or tranny (can I say that here). I just keep an eye on the gages. So, a good rule of thumb is that you may want to stay below that 63%. For me, that is 4,410 lbs. Dry weight is around that number (actually about 4850) but the motor still feels like it is being taxed too much. I want to own the JTR till I am too old to drive, and with the loads I present to the vehicle, that number is shortened.

P.S. I did convince the wife it is a good idea to get rid of her Wrangler and trade if for a 24 Tundra (so I can keep my Jeep and put 35's on it). This saves my JTR for it's true purpose; leaving Bronco's on the paved roads where they belong.

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[Redfour5]

I'm not here to debate all the above, just pointing out one note that has been left off.

The Mojave has a tow rating of 6000lbs. It doesn't reach the 7650lbs of the Max Tow because of the rear springs are rated differently. The Mojave has everything tow related that the Rubicon and Max Tow has except the rear springs. Just throwing that out there.

I'm not getting a Mojave so I don't care about it or the Rubicon is basically my point of view... But you make a very important point. I did notice what you are pointing out though as part of my research when for a day or two I was considering a Mojave...

 

[Redfour5]

Sorry I think your data is incorrect and conclusions also, the two highest rated tow Gladys are Rubicon (7000 lbs.) and Max Tow equipped Sport (7650 lbs.) most everything else with an autotranny and upgraded tow package are at 6,000 lbs. including the Mojave due to it’s suspension. The wide axles are a good idea but doesn’t raise tow rating at all on other then Max Tow package. The 4.10 gears are a great idea for towing and is what moved me to a Mojave from an Overland in my purchase. Also the article you quoted states that the best Gladiator is the base Sport model
Everyone , even Bronco owners, know the Rubicon is the ultimate off road factory equipped Glady. The Mojave is a hell of a Glady also, able to jump tall buildings , ride great, 1” higher then the supposed legendary Rubicon, but still only performs on sand! ?
Go to Mopar factory documents for tow info…..Jack

And so, why do documents show that the ONLY Gladiators with a six K tow rating (other than the Mojave/as a unique version) is the Overland/High Altitude (derived from the base Overland originally) What is the ONLY difference between it and all other sports/sports X's and their special edition versions? There is only ONE difference. And as for documents from the manufacturer who is clear as mud on this, ONE, is the order book. It clearly shows the Overland as the ONLY one with the wide axles as part of the package without the 4.10 gears.

That is the only distinction? And thus, reductio ad absurdum leaves it as the reason for the 6K tow rating on Overland/High Altitudes... You and others assert that the 6,000 lbs tow rating applies to all of them. I disagree and show evidence. All I get from everyone else is assertions, unsupported. I will have zero problem admitting I'm wrong if ONLY someone will quit asserting and give me some proof. I only responded originally when someone demeaningly said I was wrong in no uncertain way. PROVE IT. I give evidence. In return I get assertions. Give me evidence. I look forward to being wrong since I WANT 6,000 lbs of towing capacity. PLEASE prove me wrong.

 

[Jaxmax]

What Jeep says for 2023 although I even question the tow rating of the one sport with auto at low number. High altitude was still a package on overland with many upgrades and the HA wide axles at 3.73 ratio might be more to fit the twenty inch low profile tires and rims so no rubbing on front. There has always been misinformation on ratings and even Mopar seems to have a big question mark on the one Sport model. Although diesels have much more power their tow rating is a little bit lower due to engine weight and cooling has been stated here…..Jack

 

[Labswine]

I for one will admit that I was incorrect. I assumed that all Gladiators had the regular axles except for the Rubi and the MaxTow.

Well, now I know different. So, if I were to change my gears in my Overland from 3.73 to 4.1 and added the MaxTow springs to the rear, then I could conceivably increase my towing capacity to 7,600 lbs?

Highly doubt it...it's a nice thought...but, not necessary as mine handles my travel trailer quite nicely as is.

 

[Redfour5]

I for one will admit that I was incorrect. I assumed that all Gladiators had the regular axles except for the Rubi and the MaxTow.

Well, now I know different. So, if I were to change my gears in my Overland from 3.73 to 4.1 and added the MaxTow springs to the rear, then I could conceivably increase my towing capacity to 7,600 lbs?

Highly doubt it...it's a nice thought...but, not necessary as mine handles my travel trailer quite nicely as is.

I wish you were correct. I could then tow a dual axle Minne Winne comfortably. Instead I'm stuck with a Lance 1575, but JaxMax another poster has a “Vista Cruiser 19ERD” AND, this is a very interesting and towable unit with a dry bath and private bedroom under Gladiator weight of 4500 lbs gvwr, 24 feet long... NICE choice for those thinking about a travel trailer.

AND, I didn't go into the variations on Diesels as I did NOT want one of those either... One thing, I see I didn't know is a third transmission type?

 

[DylanM]

The factory trailer tow package (not the Max Tow package) does not include wide track axles, yet the addition of the factory trailer tow package to a Sport or Sport S with automatic transmission bumps the tow rating from 4500lbs to 6000lbs. Having or not having wide track axles therefore is not the de facto determining feature as to whether your towing weight limit is the lower or higher of the two.

 

[DylanM]

Straight from the owner's manual:

Note that the factor that determines whether a 3.6 equipped automatic transmission Sport/Sport S/Overland has a 4500lb or 6000lb tow rating is the absence or presence of the factory trailer tow package.

Also of interest is the maximum frontal area of the trailer for the various trims and equipment, something that is not often mentioned or discussed.

 

[Jaxmax]

Frontal area is important, I see the effect of my camper 7.5’ W X 7’H, which is in spec on the Mojave compared to my landscape trailer or even the twenty foot whaler. There are many options on how to calculate frontal area, but I went with measuring from bottom of frame to top of trailer and add a little for A/C unit and tires, and not add the Mojave frontage as it is in front of it. I also have a aero camper front and even rear, and assume that that sloped front helps a lot .
I am of the school of thought that if you have all the other specs in line , frontal area is important but can be compensated for with lower speed perhaps. Camping is supposed to be fun, do a bit of homework up front before buying a camper , don’t push the limits sure it can do it but is it fun, get a smaller camper or bigger truck….Jack

 

[Labswine]

I'm of the same opinion about frontal area. A square front or even a 'v' shaped front like some utility trailers are not as aerodynamic as a sloped/curved front like on the trailer above or my trailer pictured below. I believe that really helps negate some of the 'frontal area' that can hinder towing.

 

[KevinC]

Frontal area is important. Also we who tow with a Gladiator need to consider a few others things besides tow rating.
1. Width of the trailer. If you can stay at or under 7ft, you will have a better experience.
2. Dual axle on a trailer. The JT is a light duty truck and wind can/will push your truck and trailer all over the road. WDH and sway control helps, but a dual axle on your trailer helps even more.

Winnebago Micro Mini 2106DS. I tried to keep the weight around 4K lbs. The Gladiator still struggled with it. Not trying to sugar coat it, the JT is not a great tow vehicle. But neither is all the SUV's you see on the road towing.

 

[Redfour5]

Straight from the owner's manual:

Note that the factor that determines whether a 3.6 equipped automatic transmission Sport/Sport S/Overland has a 4500lb or 6000lb tow rating is the absence or presence of the factory trailer tow package.

Also of interest is the maximum frontal area of the trailer for the various trims and equipment, something that is not often mentioned or discussed.

Interesting. Your information "proof" says flat out 6,000 as "max tow" with a "tow package" but not the 4.10 gearing. AND a 600 lb tongue weight. I'm going with your "proof" that contradicts mine... So, the other guy is also right, but as noted, Until you presented this, Jeep is clear as mud and has conflicting information themselves out there. YAY, I can get that micro minnie winne with the dual axles. And now I have my own Freedom built off the Sport S, so I can go look at the manual... This is great news.

 

[ShadowsPapa]

I got one of those as well. Works great.

On the towing capability; I just know from towing a Coleman Rubicon 16 footer (with the slide out) that the motor is being loaded quite a bit. The trailer tag says that max loading gets the weight up to 5100 lbs. I have noticed that towing on flat and level roads that the motor is struggling to pull the load (and my rating is 7K on my OEM configured JTR). Way back in school we were told to design to 63% of working limits and stay below that number. With that in mind, I try to tow with no water, grey water or black water in the tanks. That helps a lot, but the wife keeps coming to the trailer with more stuff (because there is so much room). I just live with it. I do try to minimize the tow distances so I am not (over time) burning up the motor or tranny (can I say that here). I just keep an eye on the gages. So, a good rule of thumb is that you may want to stay below that 63%. For me, that is 4,410 lbs. Dry weight is around that number (actually about 4850) but the motor still feels like it is being taxed too much. I want to own the JTR till I am too old to drive, and with the loads I present to the vehicle, that number is shortened.

P.S. I did convince the wife it is a good idea to get rid of her Wrangler and trade if for a 24 Tundra (so I can keep my Jeep and put 35's on it). This saves my JTR for it's true purpose; leaving Bronco's on the paved roads where they belong.

On such rigs, you can't figure weight alone. You must consider the frontage being presented to the wind/air. If it was a flat trailer, say an empty car hauler, you could consider weight alone, but get something that tall up there and now you must add that as a factor - as per the owners manual (if anyone even bothers looking at the towing charts in the book)

Frontal area is important. Also we who tow with a Gladiator need to consider a few others things besides tow rating.
1. Width of the trailer. If you can stay at or under 7ft, you will have a better experience.
2. Dual axle on a trailer. The JT is a light duty truck and wind can/will push your truck and trailer all over the road. WDH and sway control helps, but a dual axle on your trailer helps even more.

Winnebago Micro Mini 2106DS. I tried to keep the weight around 4K lbs. The Gladiator still struggled with it. Not trying to sugar coat it, the JT is not a great tow vehicle. But neither is all the SUV's you see on the road towing.

Exactly - had I read down a post or two, I'd have seen you thinking the exact same way.
Even I have to consider wind resistance, drag, at least a bit because the wind coming in behind my truck is then presented with a tall car strapped to the trailer, standing about as high as my tow vehicle!

Your information "proof" says flat out 6,000 as "max tow" with a "tow package" but not the 4.10 gearing.

6,000 is for the 3.73 ratio and Sport, Overland and so on with tow package.
Rubicon is higher due to the ratio and axle width.
Max tow is higher because of many factors, including SMALLer tires, 4.10 ratio, wide axles and more.

If it has a tow package, gas engine, automatic and 3.73 ratio, look for a 6000 limit.

You have to pick your specific model as equipped and use that number, then figure mods will reduce it from there.

Toss bigger, heavier tires on a max tow, you drop that rating.
I went with the tires I did in part to keep the 6,000 rating of my Overland, but also have to account for the weight I've put on the truck - power steps and winch - taking away my payload.

Think about the drag here in this picture - I have the frontage of the truck, the drag on the straight long sides, then the wind "reassembles" behind the truck only to smack into the car behind standing tall o a trailer. I can't figure a frontage per se, but I must keep in mind the car I am hauling on that trailer is dragging me back not because of weight alone, but it's presenting wind resistance by itself. The air coming off the roof of my truck is going back and running into the windshield of that car (I have to clean bugs off when I get to my destination)

That rig by weight is 1600 for trailer with spare tire and tool box, then 3200-3300 for the car. So I'm towing 4800-4900. I call it close to 5,000 to be safe. Tow rating is 6,000 and it does fine. I run 500 pound tongue weight.

Even this will present some wind resistance........

 

[Redfour5]

On such rigs, you can't figure weight alone. You must consider the frontage being presented to the wind/air. If it was a flat trailer, say an empty car hauler, you could consider weight alone, but get something that tall up there and now you must add that as a factor - as per the owners manual (if anyone even bothers looking at the towing charts in the book)



Exactly - had I read down a post or two, I'd have seen you thinking the exact same way.
Even I have to consider wind resistance, drag, at least a bit because the wind coming in behind my truck is then presented with a tall car strapped to the trailer, standing about as high as my tow vehicle!



6,000 is for the 3.73 ratio and Sport, Overland and so on with tow package.
Rubicon is higher due to the ratio and axle width.
Max tow is higher because of many factors, including SMALLer tires, 4.10 ratio, wide axles and more.

If it has a tow package, gas engine, automatic and 3.73 ratio, look for a 6000 limit.

You have to pick your specific model as equipped and use that number, then figure mods will reduce it from there.

Toss bigger, heavier tires on a max tow, you drop that rating.
I went with the tires I did in part to keep the 6,000 rating of my Overland, but also have to account for the weight I've put on the truck - power steps and winch - taking away my payload.

Think about the drag here in this picture - I have the frontage of the truck, the drag on the straight long sides, then the wind "reassembles" behind the truck only to smack into the car behind standing tall o a trailer. I can't figure a frontage per se, but I must keep in mind the car I am hauling on that trailer is dragging me back not because of weight alone, but it's presenting wind resistance by itself. The air coming off the roof of my truck is going back and running into the windshield of that car (I have to clean bugs off when I get to my destination)

That rig by weight is 1600 for trailer with spare tire and tool box, then 3200-3300 for the car. So I'm towing 4800-4900. I call it close to 5,000 to be safe. Tow rating is 6,000 and it does fine. I run 500 pound tongue weight.

Even this will present some wind resistance........g

The best mileage I ever got in my Ram 1500 was pulling a Flagstaff 176 ltd, 8' box pop up camper. The bed height with tonneau was exactly the same height as the camper and the width was almost identical. I would get 19 to 20 mpg regularly pulling that set up... The rest of the time it was in the 15 mpg range. An engineer said it likely created a sort of synergy between the two reducing wind resistance.

 

[Redfour5]

I for one will admit that I was incorrect. I assumed that all Gladiators had the regular axles except for the Rubi and the MaxTow.

Well, now I know different. So, if I were to change my gears in my Overland from 3.73 to 4.1 and added the MaxTow springs to the rear, then I could conceivably increase my towing capacity to 7,600 lbs?

Highly doubt it...it's a nice thought...but, not necessary as mine handles my travel trailer quite nicely as is.

Now that I have 6,000 lbs, as a result of our discussion instead of 4500 lbs, I have been looking for trailers at a different level... And I stumbled across a Viking 182DBU. This is an unusual layout with a surprising amount of room particularly for a no slide unit...and real "double" bunks, not the 28 to 30 inch wide ones. And storage out the wazoo for its size (less than 23 feet) and an outdoor kitchen of sorts...and dry bath. It's only about 3700 lbs dry and 4600 loaded weight. It has a 425 dry tongue weight.

I have done the no slideout versions (Aspen Trail 1700BH/old version) before and they suck unless you enjoy the dance of life (you sitting or lying down or going into the bathroom or outside and your dogs get to back up down the center line. I've actually envisioned a layout that had a Murphy bed approach so you had some room in the darn thing without needing a slide. And here it is. https://forestriverinc.com/rvs/viking-travel-trailers/182DBU/9289 And here is a two minute video so you can visualize it better.

OH, and its a reasonable price new like 17 to 18K (Best new deals on RVTrader) being a stick and tin. It is single axle and I would have the dealership flip the axle before picking it up (I've done this before) to get another six inches of lift, and put Good Year Endurance tires on it, but hey, this is a very decent unit as a first time trailer even with a couple of teenagers vs the 28 inch wide bunk houses... AND, it still has a two way fridge that works off of propane and electric...

AND drum roll please, the wife liked the layout... I may have just found my next weekender camper.

Edit: It is an 8 foot wide unit which is why is has some of the room it has and so, rear view mirror extenders would be pretty much a must in my book. Something along these lines. https://www.extremeterrain.com/jeep-wrangler-towing-mirror-extensions-black-8605.html?utm_campaign=XTW+Wrangler+Vehicle+Medium+LTVMiddle&dialogtech=ppc&utm_source=bing&utm_medium=shopping&T5_Var2=shopping&msclkid=5fdd1011622d1bd9d9b9758d5c68fded&utm_term=4577885386227878&utm_content=XT Exterior - Mirrors and Brackets&gclid=5fdd1011622d1bd9d9b9758d5c68fded&gclsrc=3p.ds

Realistically, even with our Ram 2500 towing mirrors, for the BIG trailer basically 30 feet and 7,000 lbs, you can't see behind you unless you got a camera and I do and would also get with this. But anything that lets you see further back is helpful. The JT/JL mirrors are NOT made for towing. So, get something to help. The linked ones above appear easy on and off and pretty inexpensive (55 bucks).

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