Dealership refusing to really fix start/stop issue

[Erievon]

Oddly enough that's not why hers does it. It's because she works a mile from home and never gets enough charge on it, so it should always say "battery charging". But it never does. As soon as I put it on a trickle charger for the day, or we take it on a road trip more then a half hour, it works just fine. It has never once given me a reason, yet my 20 always gives me a reason, every time It is a JL though, but I'd think the programming would be the same.

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[Erievon]

Come to think of it, it's a 2.0T. Doh. Maybe that plays into it too. I should quit while I'm behind lol.

 

[RJinPV]

Dealers don't like informed consumers telling them how to do their job.

That may be, but dealers don't write the on board diagnostics SW. Jeep engineers do.

 

[dcmdon]

But why would Jeep make the diagnostics information less useful in later model years?

Manufacturers don't want people to get information that will make them nervous. We've all seen it on these boards. Nervous people who are afraid of the slightest thing. "I drove on dry pavement for 100 ft in 4H, did I destroy anything".

Sometimes reducing customer information makes sense.
Back in the late 90s Mazda had problems with people bringing their Miatas looking for help with low oil pressure when their cars idled. Even by then a generation had grown up with no oil pressure gauge and they didn't understand that 20 psi of oil pressure was fine at idle if that's the design.

So they did a service campaign. They replaced the oil pressure sender unit with a pressure switch that triggered at something like 10 psi and a resistor that put the gauge at 50 psi.

When you started the car the switch closed and the gauge popped to 50 psi and never moved. Problem solved.

One other manufacturer did a similar thing to deal with the "problem" of overheating. Consumers don't like to see temp gauges move beyond half way on an analog gauge that doesn't have numbers. So the dealer "fix" was a resistor in line to the gauge to lower the reading.

 

[Hootbro]

Manufacturers don't want people to get information that will make them nervous. We've all seen it on these boards. Nervous people who are afraid of the slightest thing. "I drove on dry pavement for 100 ft in 4H, did I destroy anything".

Sometimes reducing customer information makes sense.
Back in the late 90s Mazda had problems with people bringing their Miatas looking for help with low oil pressure when their cars idled. Even by then a generation had grown up with no oil pressure gauge and they didn't understand that 20 psi of oil pressure was fine at idle if that's the design.

So they did a service campaign. They replaced the oil pressure sender unit with a pressure switch that triggered at something like 10 psi and a resistor that put the gauge at 50 psi.

When you started the car the switch closed and the gauge popped to 50 psi and never moved. Problem solved.

One other manufacturer did a similar thing to deal with the "problem" of overheating. Consumers don't like to see temp gauges move beyond half way on an analog gauge that doesn't have numbers. So the dealer "fix" was a resistor in line to the gauge to lower the reading.

Ford did the same thing with their analog oil pressure gauges on most models. Made it a switch so the gauge either showed mid range all the time unless it was absolute 0 PSI and then it was low with no in-between. They got tire of fielding complaints about normal oil pressure fluctuation.

 

[PlayfulBird]

The start/stop hasn't worked in almost a year. Last time we brought it in, they said the aux battery was bad and they replaced it. It only worked randomly once since then in the 3 months since we've had the new aux battery. The message always says "start/stop not ready". It's driven almost daily min about 40 miles a day for a commute and then lots of truck time with after school sports and such. The rental we got while it's at the dealership is a new gladiator and start/stop has worked the entire time since we've had it so I don't think it's the temp outside, distance, etc. We also take it on long trips (3+ hours) and it still doesn't work then. We are at a loss as to why it's not working

I have heard that some Gladiators have an issue with the actual charging system (what exactly was done to fix it I am not sure) so the batteries are not the only cause for the issue. I also 100% agree that it is not normal. We had issues with ours, charged and conditioned the batteries, then it worked and never stopped. I did buy a tazer to shut it off completely, as I do not like that the engine has no oil pressure at each stop.
I would insist on them fixintg it, it is their problem and not yours. You did buy a vehicle that is supposed to work, not some old beater were one could say okay its old.

 

[dcmdon]

I have heard that some Gladiators have an issue with the actual charging system (what exactly was done to fix it I am not sure) so the batteries are not the only cause for the issue. I also 100% agree that it is not normal. We had issues with ours, charged and conditioned the batteries, then it worked and never stopped. I did buy a tazer to shut it off completely as I do not like that the engine has no oil pressure at each stop.
I would insist on them fixintg it, it is their problem and not yours. You did buy a vehicle that is supposed to work, not some old beater were one could say okay its old.

The problem is endemic in the industry, caused by manufacturers doing everything they can to eke out another tenth of a mpg to satisfy Government regulations.

These idiotic designs include our dual battery system.

One other incredibly stupid system is our "intelligent" battery management system. Or whatever FCA calls it.

The idea is this. When the alternator is turning mechanical energy into electrical energy it creates a drag on the engine. The more energy it is making, the more power it takes to turn the alternator.

So when you are cruising or accelerating, the system reduces how much power it makes, which reduces if or at what rate its charging the batteries.

But when you lift off the gas, your intent is to decelerate. So the alternator ramps up the power it provides to take advantage of this "free" energy. Its a great idea in theory, and properly implemented with the right charging strategies and batteries would probably work perfectly. But it places more stress on teh batteries because they are constantly charging and discharging.

This is not how a normal "dumb" charging system works. You start the car which draws the battery down a bit, then the alternator charges it and from that point forward until you restart the car, the alternator just keeps the battery topped off. No charging and discharging.

When you look something like a LiFEP battery that is good for THOUSANDS of full discharges and charges, Its reasonable to believe that our system wouldn't hurt it. But it seems that the Aux battery doesn't tolerate this treatment very well.

I don't know how the logic in our Jeeps works but it would seem that a change in software could solve this problem without eliminating the IBS. I'm speculating wildly. But if the system disconnected the aux battery from the bus when cruising and when the IBS let the voltage trend down, you would spare teh Aux batt wear and tear.

The hardware to do this already exists because the Aux batt disconnects from the main bus when you are starting the car. Or maybe not,

Either way, I hope that this helps. I'm sure follow on comments correcting my errors will help even more. ha.

 

[KAT]

Update-received a text from our service advisor saying that the radio update also took out both batteries (along with the radio/infotainment system). They had to replace the 3 month old aux battery and our original battery. it’s crazy a radio software update would do all that damage.

I honestly don’t think that was the issue as the stop/start hasn’t worked for over a year but at least we have 2 new batteries. If it still doesn’t work after that, at least we know it’s not the batteries. Hopefully we are close to getting our Gladiator back-I sure do miss driving it!

Thank you all for your advice and suggestions! You all are way more supportive and much nicer than the gladiator Facebook group! Much appreciated!!!

 

[Deleted member 28696]

Hi- like most people, we are having the start/stop issue as well. We have a 2020 Gladiator. We brought it to our dealership in June and they replaced the aux battery. Since June it has only worked once and it was 2 weeks ago for no reason (short trip and no different driving habits during the drive). I brought it in this past Friday and they said that they charged both batteries and that fixes the issue. We don't believe it as it's a new battery so why was it needing to be charged anyway? We suspect it's the ESS system not charging and our dealership refuses to look any further. When I asked them to explain how a 3 month old battery needs charging again, they don't give me an answer. They just want to get you in and out real fast without actually figuring out what is causing the issue.

I reached to Jeep Cares and opened a case on Friday. When I called today to check on the status the representative called the dealership and spoke with the GM (who supposedly is out of the office today and the rep didn't get the name of who he spoke with). The Jeep Cares rep told me there is nothing he can do and closed my case without telling me. I found out later when I called back again asking to speak with someone else and the new rep told me the prior rep closed our case.

I can't keep bringing it back in when it doesn't work. Our dealership is scheduling 2 months out so it's hard to get in. To top it off, our radio got fried when the tech did an update on Friday and a part for another issue that was ordered the last time is the wrong part and has to be ordered all over again. I love our Jeep but I feel like it is at the dealership more than we have had it.

Anyone have any help or suggestions? I am trying to get the dealership to check out the charging system as well as replace BOTH batteries and they told me they wouldn't. The next closest dealership is 1.5 hours away which is too far for us. Any help or suggestions is welcomed. Thank you!

Here's what I did since I had to replace both batteries twice. I don't drive it enough during the pandemic with work from home, so it drains the batteries down and won't take a charge and the batteries need replacing. I purchased a genesis dual battery system which does away with the start stop battery under the fuse box and makes both batteries accessible. These are full sized group 25 AGM batteries I purchased the full throttle batteries from Genesis. This unit has an ISOLATOR which Isolates the accessory battery from the crank battery once the voltage drops to a certain point. That way you should have enough battery power to crank it over since it won't allow it to fully drain. It can also act as it's own battery jumper in case one of the batteries goes dead. Thus far it's solved my issue but only time will tell. I installed it myself it takes some time but can be done in a day or less good instructional YouTube Videos. It won't affect your warranty since you're not messing with anything with how the systems work other than replacing the battery. One of the best Mods I've done.

 

[agpthng]

Hi- like most people, we are having the start/stop issue as well. We have a 2020 Gladiator. We brought it to our dealership in June and they replaced the aux battery. Since June it has only worked once and it was 2 weeks ago for no reason (short trip and no different driving habits during the drive). I brought it in this past Friday and they said that they charged both batteries and that fixes the issue. We don't believe it as it's a new battery so why was it needing to be charged anyway? We suspect it's the ESS system not charging and our dealership refuses to look any further. When I asked them to explain how a 3 month old battery needs charging again, they don't give me an answer. They just want to get you in and out real fast without actually figuring out what is causing the issue.

I reached to Jeep Cares and opened a case on Friday. When I called today to check on the status the representative called the dealership and spoke with the GM (who supposedly is out of the office today and the rep didn't get the name of who he spoke with). The Jeep Cares rep told me there is nothing he can do and closed my case without telling me. I found out later when I called back again asking to speak with someone else and the new rep told me the prior rep closed our case.

I can't keep bringing it back in when it doesn't work. Our dealership is scheduling 2 months out so it's hard to get in. To top it off, our radio got fried when the tech did an update on Friday and a part for another issue that was ordered the last time is the wrong part and has to be ordered all over again. I love our Jeep but I feel like it is at the dealership more than we have had it.

Anyone have any help or suggestions? I am trying to get the dealership to check out the charging system as well as replace BOTH batteries and they told me they wouldn't. The next closest dealership is 1.5 hours away which is too far for us. Any help or suggestions is welcomed. Thank you!

First let me say, I don't have a Gladiator but I have stop/start issue with our 2019 JLU Sport S that started about a month ago. And it's been to the dealer now 3x. We replaced the main battery, they replaced the aux battery and it's still doing it. The second time back they told me it was a lose wire. Still doing it all the bells and whistles, locks me in park when I start it up. Or the drive light flashes and I have to shift to neutral then back to drive if it lets me and the power steering goes away briefly. I've open a case with Jeep Cares but haven't heard anything from t hem.

 

[alyn]

Hi- like most people, we are having the start/stop issue as well. We have a 2020 Gladiator. We brought it to our dealership in June and they replaced the aux battery. Since June it has only worked once and it was 2 weeks ago for no reason (short trip and no different driving habits during the drive). I brought it in this past Friday and they said that they charged both batteries and that fixes the issue. We don't believe it as it's a new battery so why was it needing to be charged anyway? We suspect it's the ESS system not charging and our dealership refuses to look any further. When I asked them to explain how a 3 month old battery needs charging again, they don't give me an answer. They just want to get you in and out real fast without actually figuring out what is causing the issue.

I reached to Jeep Cares and opened a case on Friday. When I called today to check on the status the representative called the dealership and spoke with the GM (who supposedly is out of the office today and the rep didn't get the name of who he spoke with). The Jeep Cares rep told me there is nothing he can do and closed my case without telling me. I found out later when I called back again asking to speak with someone else and the new rep told me the prior rep closed our case.

I can't keep bringing it back in when it doesn't work. Our dealership is scheduling 2 months out so it's hard to get in. To top it off, our radio got fried when the tech did an update on Friday and a part for another issue that was ordered the last time is the wrong part and has to be ordered all over again. I love our Jeep but I feel like it is at the dealership more than we have had it.

Anyone have any help or suggestions? I am trying to get the dealership to check out the charging system as well as replace BOTH batteries and they told me they wouldn't. The next closest dealership is 1.5 hours away which is too far for us. Any help or suggestions is welcomed. Thank you!

There is a saying in the car business "If it's in stock it was ordered wrong the first time".

 

[djthumper]

I had a similar issue with my 2021 Eco Diesel. I had my Tazer in and found a crap load of codes. I tried to just unmarry my Tazer and it did not make a difference. I took my OBDC reader and made sure it was up to date and cleared the codes, it took me 3 tries to clear all of the codes. Everything was working properly at that point. I ensured my Tazer was up to date I added it back to my rig and have not had any more issues.

 

[Deb W]

Hi- like most people, we are having the start/stop issue as well. We have a 2020 Gladiator. We brought it to our dealership in June and they replaced the aux battery. Since June it has only worked once and it was 2 weeks ago for no reason (short trip and no different driving habits during the drive). I brought it in this past Friday and they said that they charged both batteries and that fixes the issue. We don't believe it as it's a new battery so why was it needing to be charged anyway? We suspect it's the ESS system not charging and our dealership refuses to look any further. When I asked them to explain how a 3 month old battery needs charging again, they don't give me an answer. They just want to get you in and out real fast without actually figuring out what is causing the issue.

I reached to Jeep Cares and opened a case on Friday. When I called today to check on the status the representative called the dealership and spoke with the GM (who supposedly is out of the office today and the rep didn't get the name of who he spoke with). The Jeep Cares rep told me there is nothing he can do and closed my case without telling me. I found out later when I called back again asking to speak with someone else and the new rep told me the prior rep closed our case.

I can't keep bringing it back in when it doesn't work. Our dealership is scheduling 2 months out so it's hard to get in. To top it off, our radio got fried when the tech did an update on Friday and a part for another issue that was ordered the last time is the wrong part and has to be ordered all over again. I love our Jeep but I feel like it is at the dealership more than we have had it.

Anyone have any help or suggestions? I am trying to get the dealership to check out the charging system as well as replace BOTH batteries and they told me they wouldn't. The next closest dealership is 1.5 hours away which is too far for us. Any help or suggestions is welcomed. Thank you!

Ask them to look at the star connectors. A corroded one will act like the start stop issue. We went through them replacing the start stop - the shifter - part of the power steering control module before they found a bad connector. Best of luck.

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