Drive Shaft Phasing

[JTenn]

I know the front and rear driveshafts are weighted for balance and must be correctly oriented. Does anyone know if they are phased to the differentials or trans/t-case? Or is it to eachother? If it is to the diff's I'm not sure how to know the orientation when I install the f/r axles. Just gathering info before the axle swap.

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[Charles 236]

Typically, driveshafts are matched to the differential yoke or flange. A small paint mark is usually used on the end of the driveshaft and on the yoke or flange. I can't remember if the marks on the flange or yoke and driveshaft on the highest point of runout or the lowest, but the idea is to match the lowest point to the highest so that they cancel each other out. Also, driveshafts are not phased to the transfer case. Hope this helps.

 

[JTDay]

Do our driveshafts even have a slip yoke?

 

[ShadowsPapa]

I know the front and rear driveshafts are weighted for balance and must be correctly oriented. Does anyone know if they are phased to the differentials or trans/t-case? Or is it to eachother? If it is to the diff's I'm not sure how to know the orientation when I install the f/r axles. Just gathering info before the axle swap.

You only "phase" drive shafts with 2 cross type joints - one at each end.

Otherwise shafts are balanced out of the vehicle, without the differential yoke, etc.

CV joints don't need to be phased.

 

[JTenn]

Typically, driveshafts are matched to the differential yoke or flange. A small paint mark is usually used on the end of the driveshaft and on the yoke or flange. I can't remember if the marks on the flange or yoke and driveshaft on the highest point of runout or the lowest, but the idea is to match the lowest point to the highest so that they cancel each other out. Also, driveshafts are not phased to the transfer case. Hope this helps.

Thanks. The back story is I'm about to swap Rubicon axles into my Willys. Therefore my current drive shaft is not and never has been mated to either f/r diff that will be going in. However, in the purchase the guy threw in both f/r drive shafts that were originally mounted to those diff's. Not sure if it matters which DS's I use. To @ShadowsPapa point, they are all balanced outside of and independent of the vehicle. Now how to figure out if the bolt circles on the yoke hub and diff hubs are lined up in any particular way. Thanks everyone.

 

[Rusty PW]

You only "phase" drive shafts with 2 cross type joints - one at each end.

Otherwise shafts are balanced out of the vehicle, without the differential yoke, etc.

CV joints don't need to be phased.

Beat me to it. ?

 

[ShadowsPapa]

Beat me to it. ?

And that's not easy! LOL.

I'm sure you've done this in your sleep.
For me - it was shortening driveshafts, that sort of thing, when doing transmission swaps. (and diagnosing vibrations, etc.)

 

[Hootbro]

Attached is the Tech Authority procedure on driveshaft removal and install. It mentions only marking the flanges and reinstalling back in the same spot.

 

[JTenn]

Attached is the Tech Authority procedure on driveshaft removal and install. It only mentions only marking the flanges and reinstalling back in the same spot.

Perfect!! Thanks

 

[ShadowsPapa]

Attached is the Tech Authority procedure on driveshaft removal and install. It only mentions only marking the flanges and reinstalling back in the same spot.

I've always done that if removal was for something like seal replacement, u-joint replacement, etc. because I figured what the heck - it had no problem before in that position, put it back. I do that for my wheels, too, if putting them back on the same axle - no vibration when I started, then put it back in the same position.

I seem to recall that the bolts on some of these flanges were spaced just a bit differently meaning if you didn't put it back in the same place, one of them won't go back in. But that was a long time back so I could be recalling that incorrectly.

I guess over the years, experience and paranoia have taught me - mark, put it back the same way. Not that it will break or perform poorly, it's just so easy to do.
I keep silver, black and yellow markers and paint pens and an engraving tool on the shelf next to my work bench.

Just a word to those making bigger, or "radical" changes - on a shaft with a single cross type u-joint on one end, and maybe a CV on the other end - there is no phasing, HOWEVER, that cross type u-joint needs to run pretty straight. If you perform a lift or change control arms on the rear or whatever, and you have a shaft with a single cross joint - make sure to line things up so that cross joint is running straight.
Conventional u-joints like that change rotational speed of the shaft or device they drive as they rotate if they are not perfectly straight, and the larger the angle, the more you note the change.
If there is a cross type joint at each end of the same shaft, phase is critical as is watching the angles of each and try to match them up to keep the rotational differences to a minimum.
The one image I posted sort of shows that. It may mean a pinion angle change is in order.
CV joints have a larger operating angle, and no speed changes.

 

[JTenn]

I've always done that if removal was for something like seal replacement, u-joint replacement, etc. because I figured what the heck - it had no problem before in that position, put it back. I do that for my wheels, too, if putting them back on the same axle - no vibration when I started, then put it back in the same position.

I seem to recall that the bolts on some of these flanges were spaced just a bit differently meaning if you didn't put it back in the same place, one of them won't go back in. But that was a long time back so I could be recalling that incorrectly.

I guess over the years, experience and paranoia have taught me - mark, put it back the same way. Not that it will break or perform poorly, it's just so easy to do.
I keep silver, black and yellow markers and paint pens and an engraving tool on the shelf next to my work bench.

Just a word to those making bigger, or "radical" changes - on a shaft with a single cross type u-joint on one end, and maybe a CV on the other end - there is no phasing, HOWEVER, that cross type u-joint needs to run pretty straight. If you perform a lift or change control arms on the rear or whatever, and you have a shaft with a single cross joint - make sure to line things up so that cross joint is running straight.
Conventional u-joints like that change rotational speed of the shaft or device they drive as they rotate if they are not perfectly straight, and the larger the angle, the more you note the change.
If there is a cross type joint at each end of the same shaft, phase is critical as is watching the angles of each and try to match them up to keep the rotational differences to a minimum.
The one image I posted sort of shows that. It may mean a pinion angle change is in order.
CV joints have a larger operating angle, and no speed changes.

Couldn't agree more. I am also a paint marker warrior. I'll check the bolt pattern of the flange. I would be surprised if it's not clocked in a way that forces one way assembly.

 

[ShadowsPapa]

Couldn't agree more. I am also a paint marker warrior. I'll check the bolt pattern of the flange. I would be surprised if it's not clocked in a way that forces one way assembly.

I'd be interested in seeing if my memory is right, so if you find the spacing isn't even all the way around, let us know.

Keep up the smart work.

 

[jac04]

There is a V95 recall for the rear driveshaft on some 2020 Gladiators. In this recall, there are instructions for installing a new rear driveshaft. There is no requirement to install the shaft in any particular orientation to the differential input or the transfer case output.

The bolt pattern is symmetrical

https://static.oemdtc.com/Recall/19V636/RCRIT-19V636-3067.pdf

 

[JTenn]

There is a V95 recall for the rear driveshaft on some 2020 Gladiators. In this recall, there are instructions for installing a new rear driveshaft. There is no requirement to install the shaft in any particular orientation to the differential input or the transfer case output.

The bolt pattern is symmetrical

https://static.oemdtc.com/Recall/19V636/RCRIT-19V636-3067.pdf

Answers that question. Thanks

 

[ShadowsPapa]

There is a V95 recall for the rear driveshaft on some 2020 Gladiators. In this recall, there are instructions for installing a new rear driveshaft. There is no requirement to install the shaft in any particular orientation to the differential input or the transfer case output.

The bolt pattern is symmetrical

https://static.oemdtc.com/Recall/19V636/RCRIT-19V636-3067.pdf

They wouldn't put that in a recall document anyway, especially if it's "keyed" by spacing one bolt differently. Some things are assumed, or they refer to another set of instructions.
If it will only fit one way, the tech will discover that during installation, it will be unsaid.
If it goes on in any orientation, then there's no problem.

They are also talking a new replacement shaft - not a used one being put back.

I could refer to axle hubs in the 1970s where a used hub must go back on the axle in the same orientation, but a new one - doesn't matter.

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