P00AF - The Journey

[AXISJT]

I have had this code a few times, and both times the Dealer and Jeep care were of absolutely no help. The gaps between it happening for me seem to be larger, thankfully, but it is definitely more likely to happen when it's hot out. I am coming up on the 100k mark, so my warranty will be void, not that it's helped in the past anyway. But is there anything y'all would recommend doing no longer having to worry about the warranty? I'm open to deleting things if it means my engine will run better and longer.

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[biodiesel]

But is there anything y'all would recommend doing no longer having to worry about the warranty?

According to @Green Diesel, "We have seen overheated REA (rotary electric actuator) and warn worm gears in them on GEN3. The only fix is a turbo swap as Stellantis does not sell just the REA like some other manufactures."

I personally think it's a quality control issue since there are other Gen 3 EcoDiesels with over 200,000 miles of problem free operation.

 

[AXISJT]

According to @Green Diesel, "We have seen overheated REA (rotary electric actuator) and warn worm gears in them on GEN3. The only fix is a turbo swap as Stellantis does not sell just the REA like some other manufactures."

I personally think it's a quality control issue since there are other Gen 3 EcoDiesels with over 200,000 miles of problem free operation.

I attempted to get my Jeep fixed when it happened the first time and they told me the whole turbo had to be replaced and quoted me $6,000 since apparently the turbo doesn't fall under the 100,000 mile powertrain warranty. According to Jeep cares, it falls up under some other warranty they slipped in there that ends 75k or something like that. It's a joke. Plus it seems from others who've had their turbo swap if that's not fixing the issue. So I was hoping there could possibly something else. Are there other aftermarket turbos that don't use that component?

 

[rharr]

You could call area deisel service and see if they can give you any info. They seem to deal in all sorts of turbos.

I think we have a borg warner flavor.

https://shop.areadieselservice.com/Products/BORGWARNER

 

[rharr]

I attempted to get my Jeep fixed when it happened the first time and they told me the whole turbo had to be replaced and quoted me $6,000 since apparently the turbo doesn't fall under the 100,000 mile powertrain warranty. According to Jeep cares, it falls up under some other warranty they slipped in there that ends 75k or something like that. It's a joke. Plus it seems from others who've had their turbo swap if that's not fixing the issue. So I was hoping there could possibly something else. Are there other aftermarket turbos that don't use that component?

You could call area diesel service and see if they can give you any info. They seem to deal in all sorts of turbos.

I think we have a garret flavor.

https://shop.areadieselservice.com/Products/GARRETT

 

[DC3]

According to @Green Diesel, "We have seen overheated REA (rotary electric actuator) and warn worm gears in them on GEN3. The only fix is a turbo swap as Stellantis does not sell just the REA like some other manufactures."

I personally think it's a quality control issue since there are other Gen 3 EcoDiesels with over 200,000 miles of problem free operation.

I agree with your belief in a QC issue. I was initially going down the path of designing a heat exchanger for the turbo vane actuator but ditched the effort once I determined a lack of correlation.

I ultimately have assumed its a QC issue with the vane system or the actuator.

It's also crazy to me because these actuators are replaceable, I haven't found why folks haven't replaced them. In fact, I might purchase a new actuator and swap the one on my currently installed turbo first.

Photo are from my replacement turbo, yet to be installed.

T

 

[biodiesel]

I attempted to get my Jeep fixed when it happened the first time and they told me the whole turbo had to be replaced and quoted me $6,000 since apparently the turbo doesn't fall under the 100,000 mile powertrain warranty.

That's not true. The turbo is covered under the 5 year/100,000 mile Powertrain Warranty. Everyone on the Ram forum has been getting their turbo covered under warranty.

 

[biodiesel]

Plus it seems from others who've had their turbo swap if that's not fixing the issue.

So far, 100% of the Ram owners haven't had any more problems since getting the new turbo installed.

 

[rharr]

Do you guys think the P00af code is related to vanes? I recall this video a while ago where a duramax was having turbo issues related to vanes and essential the vanes got got gummed up and and the controls couldn't actuate it. Granted this is for a duramax, but we also have variable vanes, and either through manufacturing or soot contamination the vanes could become a issue and not work right.

I recall a post on here where one guy and the control servo all chewed up aka black dust.



maybe when the p00af code hits you can use a scan tool to see if it can report the vane position?

 

[biodiesel]

It's also crazy to me because these actuators are replaceable, I haven't found why folks haven't replaced them.

Let me know if you find a part number for the actuator.

 

[biodiesel]

I agree with your belief in a QC issue. GDE told me a similar story regarding the heat caused malfunction but I can't reconcile the fact that the P00AF occurrence isn't correlated with any data (that I have found). I was initially going down the path of designing a heat exchanger for the turbo vane actuator but ditched the effort once I determined a lack of correlation.

I ultimately have assumed its a QC issue with the vane system or the actuator.

Just for the record, my 2020 Ram EcoDiesel is used exclusively for towing. Just last year alone, we logged over 8,000 miles of towing. We've towed through New Mexico, Arizona, California, Nevada, Utah, Colorado, Kansas, Oklahoma, Texas, Arkansas, Missouri, and Illinois. Trust me, if heat was an issue, then I'd be a prime candidate. I towed through the Mojave Desert when it was 117*F.

 

[biodiesel]

Do you guys think the P00af code is related to vanes? I recall this video a while ago where a duramax was having turbo issues related to vanes and essential the vanes got got gummed up and and the controls couldn't actuate it.

Based on the samples we've collected on the Ram forum, I'd say it's quality control issue since they are all fairly low mileage failures. There's not enough time on the turbos for gumming to be an issue. Again, here are the failures reported thus far. I find it interesting that all failures have been a 2021 or 2022. Coincidental?

Mzflorida (2022 Ram) 20,500 miles
Josh Nolt (2022 Ram) 20,000 miles
EC0RAM (2022 Ram) 33,000 miles
Rob Rusk (2021 Ram) 34,000 miles
ruskracing (2021 Ram) 34,000 miles
ecodiesel13 (2021 Ram) 41,000 miles
otinchon (2022 Ram) 56,068 miles

 

[rharr]

Based on the samples we've collected on the Ram forum, I'd say it's quality control issue since they are all fairly low mileage failures. There's not enough time on the turbos for gumming to be an issue. Again, here are the failures reported thus far. I find it interesting that all failures have been a 2021 or 2022. Coincidental?

Mzflorida (2022 Ram) 20,500 miles
Josh Nolt (2022 Ram) 20,000 miles
EC0RAM (2022 Ram) 33,000 miles
Rob Rusk (2021 Ram) 34,000 miles
ruskracing (2021 Ram) 34,000 miles
ecodiesel13 (2021 Ram) 41,000 miles
otinchon (2022 Ram) 56,068 miles

Agreed, but to your point about QC, if the clearances are to tight and the part gets to hot, the clarance can go down to zero and act like a gummed vane.

My point is has anyone verify vane position when this occurs?

On a turbo that is replaced because of a p000af one could open the bad turbo and look for wear/rub marks or even actuate the vanes for smooth action similar to the video above to verify causality.

especially someone who has been shunned by FCA and denied warranty, they now have a fancy desk ornament.

 

[biodiesel]

Agreed, but to your point about QC, if the clearances are to tight and the part gets to hot, the clarance can go down to zero and act like a gummed vane.

I'm certainly open to the discussion.

The good news is that it doesn't appear to be a widespread problem. And we aren't seeing any of the high mileage 2020 EcoDiesels with any issues, and some of those now have over 200,000 miles. Let's hope that it's a quality control issue. And let's hope that we can get a replacement actuator rather than having to replace the entire turbo.

200,000 Mile Club
Gabriel - 203,582 miles (engine and truck)
cdsonsini - 207,000 miles (engine and truck)
Justinj182 - 237,000 miles (engine and truck)

 

[AXISJT]

That's not true. The turbo is covered under the 5 year/100,000 mile Powertrain Warranty. Everyone on the Ram forum has been getting their turbo covered under warranty.

I argued with Jeep cares and Mopar for months untill I gave up . They will not cover the turbo after 75k or so I will try to see if I can find the name of the separate warranty they stated. It was extremely slimy to me and has put me off getting another jeep after this.

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