am I doing something wrong in snow/ice Winter driving?

[Sweetums]

The Dueler is hands down the worst A/T tire I've ever seen. We were doing Fins N Things with a stock Sahara Wrangler with Dueler tires. Before the trail I told the driver I was worried about their tires and warned them to take it easy and avoid rocks. Coming down a smooth slickrock ramp onto soft sand, the sidewall of the front passenger tire exploded for no reason. There was nothing to tear it open or puncture the tire, the ground was either flat stone or soft, bottomless sand with no rocks or sticks. The damage was a long, semi-circular hole in the sidewall from tread to bead; I've never seen anything like it, even from tires ripped open by obstacles.

I would never run that tire unless I was on my way to the tire shop to buy better tires.

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[Gvsukids]

The Dueler is hands down the worst A/T tire I've ever seen. We were doing Fins N Things with a stock Sahara Wrangler with Dueler tires. Before the trail I told the driver I was worried about their tires and warned them to take it easy and avoid rocks. Coming down a smooth slickrock ramp onto soft sand, the sidewall of the front passenger tire exploded for no reason. There was nothing to tear it open or puncture the tire, the ground was either flat stone or soft, bottomless sand with no rocks or sticks. The damage was a long, semi-circular hole in the sidewall from tread to bead; I've never seen anything like it, even from tires ripped open by obstacles.

I would never run that tire unless I was on my way to the tire shop to buy better tires.

Ran them for a year without any issues on the dunes and off-road. Nothing as crazy as fins n things.

 

[Sweetums]

Fins isn't that hard of a trail, it's Instagram Influencer Bait - not technically challenging but it looks impressive as hell. I've spotted an Xterra on stock tires with a 2" lift through it - and he didn't have any armor, not even sliders.

 

[Throwback]

I've got a Sport with stock tires. Those are street tires. OK in rain but not for snow or off road anything. Shame on Bridgestone if they are selling them as something else, but really just look at them. They're street tires. Having said that, we've had some snow and I certainly drive around in it. Mostly in 2wd, use 4hi to get going.

As I said before I was raised on Chevelles, Chargers, C10s, 1970s BMWs and even a motorcycle or three in the snow -- so I grade on a curve here. But I do like the Gladiator just fine. AWD is the way to go for winter driving, sure, but I've noticed it gives people false confidence as well, especially those in high cg vehicles. People just drive like idiots these days. It's a good thing most of them have AWD and all the electronic nannys.

 

[starrskream]

Just a comment on adding weight in the winter to a pickup. I always see pickups with one 50lb bag of sand in the back around here, even full size trucks.

The gladiator is what a 1/4 ton capacity? Adding 50lbs of sand barely does anything.
the suspension is capable of handling way more than that. It won’t even break a sweat with 50lbs.

the idea being to compress the shocks, and “force the tires to hold the road.”
You will need at least 200lbs or more to start doing anything.

try it sometime. Add weight to your bed and measure the drop. My 93 ford ranger could handle 100lbs before it really made any difference.

 

[ShadowsPapa]

Actually, any extra weight is directly transferred to the tires, forcing them harder against the pavement. It's nothing to do with compressing shocks or springs.
Suspension doesn't matter. My F250 could handle over a ton of weight in the back, but adding a couple of sandbags allowed me to keep it in 2wd more often - that weight still pushed the tires down regardless of the spring. Yo don't need to compress a spring to have an effect on snow or ice.
Granted, if you are concerned about hopping around, yeah, more weight, compress the springs a bit, but for winter driving, 50 pounds in the bed is another 50 pounds pushing down in the tires.
Those of us around here, Iowa, who have driven pickups for decades, know that even some weight can matter - all weight you put in the bed of that truck is transferred to the tires.
Proof is in how the footprint of the tire changes by adding weight.
Weigh your truck, then add 50 pounds and weigh it again - that's 50 more pounds pressing down on the tires holding them harder against the ice or snow.

Drop isn't the point - ignore that. 2,000 pounds put my Ford just onto the big overload springs (and made it ride like a Cadillac, according to my wife's aunt) but a few pounds in the back made winter difference.
Similar for my 2 wheel drive 1970 C20. A bit of weight in the back mattered, otherwise it literally could get stuck spinning on wet grass. A couple of sandbags mattered. And - I had sand for if I really needed help getting up some incline with it. Great winter truck with even a bit of weight in the back.

I put 210 pounds of sand in the back of my JT (3 times 70 pound bags) to act as ballast against the weight of the plow up front. When the plow isn't on, man, even this JT is more sure footed and it really doesn't drop the back of the truck all that much. Barely visible to the eye.

Bottom line - any weight added is transferred directly through the coil spring wire, even if the spring is not noticeably compressed, down to the axles and thus the tires.
Set a spring on your foot and let me add 50 pounds to the top of it - you are going to feel it.

 

[Rusty PW]

Caution about putting sand bags in the rear for weight. One guy I worked with was in an accident. He got hit head on. The 2 80lb bags of sand he had in the bed came through the back window of his Ranger and out the windshield. The one bag hit him in the back of his head, pushing it into the steering wheel. Breaking his neck and face. He was off work for over a year.

 

[ShadowsPapa]

Caution about putting sand bags in the rear for weight. One guy I worked with was in an accident. He got hit head on. The 2 80lb bags of sand he had in the bed came through the back window of his Ranger and out the windshield. The one bag hit him in the back of his head, pushing it into the steering wheel. Breaking his neck and face. He was off work for over a year.

That can happen with anything behind you that's not secured. Helps having a cover, and the sandbags behind the boards back there.

 

[Rusty PW]

That can happen with anything behind you that's not secured. Helps having a cover, and the sandbags behind the boards back there.

I've had pallets move around in the back of the Peterbilt that I used to drive. Sometimes it was real messy when I opened the doors.

 

[ShadowsPapa]

I've had pallets move around in the back of the Peterbilt that I used to drive. Sometimes it was real messy when I opened the doors.

A former long-time AMCer and member of our AMC forum used to drive wreckers and flatbeds. One time he was out on a call after dark and had a car on the truck. He missed a T intersection, hit an embankment and the car broke loose. You know the rest.
It's always smart/prudent to secure anything, or at least make sure it can't come up to bite you or worse in case the worst happens.

 

[TheTrailGeek]

This is where I love SelecTrac.
CV axles, no binding or jerking when you are making turns or parking.

Around here if you aren't in 4H when at a stop, you may not get going again. It's that simple. I've seen a whole lot of both front and rear wheel drive cars and so-called "SUVs" struggle in these last several days. Hundreds of them off the road.
I went with SelecTrac because my 2020 with only 4H and not 4H auto was a pain in the butt - you were constantly shifting in and out, in and out, then you hit a patch of black ice, or snow pack, or where the snow is blowing across the highway and just deep enough to want to pull things to the side........... I recall one trip with my '20 where I shifted it in and out of 4H over a dozen times - it would hum and bind in 4H when i hit the dry spots so I'd pull it out into 2 thinking cool, there's a mile of clear, only to run into another area of snow blown across I80.

You need to just deal with shifting in and out if you don't have the 4H auto transfer case.
And those who have argued have obviously never driven in the types of snow or conditions we get here. Different snow types, winds and so on........ spots on the interstate where if you were not in 4H you were not going to make it up that hill and across that bridge (and I'm' talking speeds of only 45-50 because that was the prevailing traffic speeds at that time). I watched others fail to make it through the same places I did. I had my '20 fishtail and slide all over on our snow pack (with Rubicon take-off Falken tires, too) unless I was in 4H. Then - I'd hit a mile of clear and had to take it out again or she'd bind up.

I've had pickups and have driven thousands of miles over the decades in Iowa winters. My first truck I was something like 18 or 19, have had a truck ever since with the exception of a couple of years in the 1990s. 2 wheel drive, 4 wheel drive, Fords, Chevy, Jeep, and you'll never pry the SelecTrac outta my hands. It's very similar to how my Silverado was - in bad weather, you'd put it in 4H auto and forget it.

I have 210 pounds of sand at the very rear of my truck bed to offset the 300+ pounds of snow plow but even when I drop the plow off, I can feel better stability.

Do you air down at all? Just here to learn and reading through this thread.

 

[Sweetums]

Do you air down at all? Just here to learn and reading through this thread.

I've been driving in mountain winters all my life, I've never aired down for normal winter driving on pavement.

 

[TheTrailGeek]

I've been driving in mountain winters all my life, I've never aired down for normal winter driving on pavement.

I appreciate the info. We just had a pretty decent snow here in western North Carolina over the last week. Usually, it melts off in a day and we just don’t go anywhere, but our January has been super cold so this one has lingered. My dad lives on a pretty steep hill (a gravel driveway with 120 feet of elevation gain over 0.3 miles), and it’s never in the sun, so there’s still 2–3 inches on it and the road we live on has a pretty steep decline out onto the main highway. I'm just trying to gain knowledge for going out and about in it the next time it happens.

 

[Sweetums]

Nothing short of chains or studs will grip on ice; snow at least has some traction. If the tire tracks are packed down into ice and you're struggling for traction offset your tires to drive on the crown and shoulder a little.

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