Diesel JT. Too much torque for D44s...

[Factoid]

And lower gas prices. Back in the day, diesel was always cheaper.

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[wvyankee2]

If your that hard on the equipment, just get the extended warranty. Jeep will fix anything you break.

 

[d k]

Nothing really to contradict what you are saying....
I just feel the engine could be ‘optimized’ more for the Jeep.
probably wouldnt take much.
And it would help fuel economy too.

Simple answer is because it's the best proven engine available for the application. The Wrangler (and now Gladiator) is no longer the unapologetic off-road machine it once was, it's a lifestyle vehicle. The majority of owners who will just lift and roll around on 35's or maybe 37's don't need a torque monster, they want fuel economy and a smoother ride. I'd be surprised if even 25% of new Wranglers sold saw real off-road use that necessitated them.

Off roaders can't be relied on to buy new and FCA doesn't care about the second sale. There's no reason to cater to that crowd when it hurts your primary market. Even the diesel isn't a nod to off-roading, it's FCA capitalizing on the old-school, older jeep owners (i.e. retirees) who still think that diesels are what they were 20 years ago. Yeah the torque is nice but the upfront costs are no longer offset by longevity and lower maintenance.

 

[kelkolb]

Nothing really to contradict what you are saying....
I just feel the engine could be ‘optimized’ more for the Jeep.
probably wouldnt take much.
And it would help fuel economy too.

I'm sure it is different. They can't have the same tuning as they do on the trucks. Different loads, weights etc.

 

[Karnaj]

I'm sure it is different. They can't have the same tuning as they do on the trucks. Different loads, weights etc.

Different engine. Gen3 has something like 80% new parts over the gen2

 

[kelkolb]

Different engine. Gen3 has something like 80% new parts over the gen2

No, I know. Sounded like he was referring to the way the engine is set up specifically for the Wrangler/Gladiator. I think it is set up specifically for them. Still the same overall engine as the RAM, but should be tuned for the Wrangler and maybe even different than that for the Gladiator.

 

[d k]

surprisingly little tech info on the 3.6

Im sure the tuning is different on the Challenger vs the Wrangler, but what else?

No, I know. Sounded like he was referring to the way the engine is set up specifically for the Wrangler/Gladiator. I think it is set up specifically for them. Still the same overall engine as the RAM, but should be tuned for the Wrangler and maybe even different than that for the Gladiator.

 

[steelponycowboy]

I get that axles can be swapped but mopar says a rubicon can run 35s with no lift. If I’ve got to dump $15gs in axles just to run 35s behind the diesel I’ll have serious doubts about moving forward and that sucks Nd it has nothing to do with my budget.

I run my JTRD pretty hard and will do about 6000 miles off road this year. Same with my TJ and JK. Never had an issue with a D44 even in my Scrambler with a 401 in front of it. I'm guessing if you've trashed 2 of them them you are either pretty abusive or very inexperienced in driving off road with your Jeeps. Even the 392 has a D44. It's a beefy axle that Jeep would not be using if there were going to be any chance of mass warranty claims. With all the people I see with 37s and 40s on JTs and 392s along with the 4Xe thar all have about the same torque, I've heard of no failures of the D44. If you are concerned about it get the 3.6 and be happy

 

[steelponycowboy]

If your that hard on the equipment, just get the extended warranty. Jeep will fix anything you break.

Not true, they won't pay for or fix anything due to what they determine to be abuse or if you have tires over 37" or a lift over 4" or any combination. Forget what your dealer might tell you. Big warranty claims need to be approved by corporate and they will often want to see for themselves. That is why it took over 30 days to get my tyranny replaced on my Wrangler with 35s and a 3.5" lift.

 

[BlueScapegoat]

After years and years of this I'm convinced it's all about driver technique.

I have heavy 37s on my (comparitively very weak) TJ D44s. 5.13s, stock shafts and lockers, 6 speed, 4:1 tcase, supercharger... all good. Has been for a decade and a lot of wheeling. There's always that guy rolling the same group as me breaking shafts on 33s and 35s. Then there's always a few of us that have been running 37s for years that everybody wants to call BS on.

I've just been waiting for the break to happen to upgrade, and I'm still waiting.

 

[steelponycowboy]

After years and years of this I'm convinced it's all about driver technique.

I have heavy 37s on my (comparitively very weak) TJ D44s. 5.13s, stock shafts and lockers, 6 speed, 4:1 tcase, supercharger... all good. Has been for a decade and a lot of wheeling. There's always that guy rolling the same group as me breaking shafts on 33s and 35s. Then there's always a few of us that have been running 37s for years that everybody wants to call BS on.

I've just waiting for the break to happen to upgrade, and I'm still waiting.

90% driver technique. Some people have it some don't and never will although they think they do......

 

[willhonkforparts]

Almost made 2 years before this thread was brought back from the dead!! Nice find Steelpony.

Side note, that 37" tire and 4.5" lift stuff is 100% just made up numbers someone told at your dealership. The truth is, they can deny warranty on stock vehicles if they feel like it, want to, and believe they can justify it, while ither will warranty damn near everything. Ask 5 different dealerships and you'll get 5 different answers, cuz it's not actually written anywhere. Literally just the attitude of the particular service dept/dealership you go to.

 

[BlueScapegoat]

Almost made 2 years before this thread was brought back from the dead!! Nice find Steelpony.

Side note, that 37" tire and 4.5" lift stuff is 100% just made up numbers someone told at your dealership. The truth is, they can deny warranty on stock vehicles if they feel like it, want to, and believe they can justify it, while ither will warranty damn near everything. Ask 5 different dealerships and you'll get 5 different answers, cuz it's not actually written anywhere. Literally just the attitude of the particular service dept/dealership you go to.

Specifically the Magnuson-Moss Warranty Act sets the standards in the US for consumer warranties. Things like warranty stickers "void if broken" are complete bs and in some other countries outright illegal. They need to prove that what you did caused the failure to deny a warranty. The alternative if they don't want to comply is simple- don't offer a warranty.

Now will dealerships make up their own rules? Sure. And will they illegally deny you a warranty request on a completely different part of your vehicle because you modified it? Yeah, some will. Do they assume that you won't get an attorney over the matter because it won't be financially beneficial to you in the long run, or because you won't even be bothered to look up the law regarding warranties? Also yes.

 

[willhonkforparts]

Specifically the Magnuson-Moss Warranty Act sets the standards in the US for consumer warranties. Things like warranty stickers "void if broken" are complete bs and in some other countries outright illegal. They need to prove that what you did caused the failure to deny a warranty. The alternative if they don't want to comply is simple- don't offer a warranty.

Now will dealerships make up their own rules? Sure. And will they illegally deny you a warranty request on a completely different part of your vehicle because you modified it? Yeah, some will. Do they assume that you won't get an attorney over the matter because it won't be financially beneficial to you in the long run, or because you won't even be bothered to look up the law regarding warranties? Also yes.

Sure, everyone brings up the MM Warranty Act. But....let's say you blow the engine on your rig. They deny warranty because there's mud underneath and they claim abuse/offroad use. This could happen even on a stock vehicle (and has). What's your recourse and how do you use the Act? You can yell Magnusson Moss as loud as you want, but the real answer is court. Now, what are your court costs going to be? 30k? 50k? 100k? Who has more time and money for lawyers, and will drag it out to eternity, driving up the costs, you or Stellantis? What is the cost of the new engine? See the problem of expecting the Magnusson Moss Act to protect you?

 

[BlueScapegoat]

Sure, everyone brings up the MM Warranty Act. But....let's say you blow the engine on your rig. They deny warranty because there's mud underneath and they claim abuse/offroad use. This could happen even on a stock vehicle (and has). What's your recourse and how do you use the Act? You can yell Magnusson Moss as loud as you want, but the real answer is court. Now, what are your court costs going to be? 30k? 50k? 100k? Who has more time and money for lawyers, and will drag it out to eternity, driving up the costs, you or Stellantis? What is the cost of the new engine? See the problem of expecting the Magnusson Moss Act to protect you?

That was sort of exactly my point, yes.

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