Jeep gladiator roll over

[bgenlvtex]

All of the roll-overs I have observed live or otherwise weren’t caused by gravity. Almost all of them were caused by an energetic event which caused one or both tires on one side of the vehicle to be rapidly elevated—generally when the tire(s) contacted something with a slope somewhat vertical. The velocity at which the tires were elevated is proportional to the horizontal velocity of the vehicle. Moreover, the energy of the upward one-side thrust--causing the roll-over--is proportional to the square of the velocity of the vehicle. I assume that some people have rolled while just driving slowly on too steep of a side slope, but I haven’t ever seen that. It’s usually when someone guns the vehicle before hitting an obstacle or steep slope.

Cool, well there are plenty of videos on YouTube of low speed roll overs if you're interested. I'm not saying this event wasn't speed related, just saying it ain't hard. I've personally had a 4 wheel drive farm tractor in a condition where only one tire was touching the ground, and a couple of times only two and I can assure you speed had no bearing on it.

If you look at the terrain in that picture, it's not hard to imagine what he was doing, articulation only goes so far.

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[MarineHawk]

Cool, well there are plenty of videos on YouTube of low speed roll overs if you're interested. I'm not saying this event wasn't speed related, just saying it ain't hard. I've personally had a 4 wheel drive farm tractor in a condition where only one tire was touching the ground, and a couple of times only two and I can assure you speed had no bearing on it.

If you look at the terrain in that picture, it's not hard to imagine what he was doing, articulation only goes so far.

Could be. My experiences only go so far.

 

[hosejockey61]

All of the roll-overs I have observed live or otherwise weren’t caused by gravity. Almost all of them were caused by an energetic event which caused one or both tires on one side of the vehicle to be rapidly elevated—generally when the tire(s) contacted something with a slope somewhat vertical. The velocity at which the tires were elevated is proportional to the horizontal velocity of the vehicle. Moreover, the energy of the upward one-side thrust--causing the roll-over--is proportional to the square of the velocity of the vehicle. I assume that some people have rolled while just driving slowly on too steep of a side slope, but I haven’t ever seen that. It’s usually when someone guns the vehicle before hitting an obstacle or steep slope.

I flopped my TJ doing less than 1 mph. Trying to get up a rock off camber. It is not at all impossible to lay it on its side at a slow speed. Happens quite a bit here in Colorado.

 

[MarineHawk]

I flopped my TJ doing less than 1 mph. Trying to get up a rock off camber. It is not at all impossible to lay it on its side at a slow speed. Happens quite a bit here in Colorado.

I've lived and wheeled in Colorado for decades. I have 120 acre mountain property in central Colorado I’ve wheeled on constantly.

A typical TJ has a much more narrow wheelbase than the really wide stance in the pictured JT that rolled over. Most of its tires of the rolled JT are outside of the fenders.

That being said, I’m sorry, but if you roll a TJ at 1 MPH, that’s driver error. I’ve off-roaded for thousands of miles as a Marine and as a civilian, and never came close to rolling at a 1 MPH.

Again, I’m not saying it didn’t happen, but I’ve never seen anyone do something so negligent that would cause a roll-over at 1 MPH. And I have plentiful time wheeling and observing others wheeling in in Colorado--including on the Blanca trail up to Lake Como, which is about as bad as it gets.

 

[Elwenil]

Definitely a flop and not a full roll. And yeah, anyone who has never seen a slow roll has never been rock crawling.

 

[WXman]

Gotta' pay if you wanna' play.

 

[bhbdvm]

Not sure if I agree with the statement "not too bad". I imagine when it comes time to actually pay for the damage it'll be more than this person seems to appreciate. Doors, at least one Freedom panel, suspect roof support, rear quarter panel, sheet metal behind rear door, looks like a cracked mirror. They probably have more money than me so maybe not too bad for them? But, I do agree the axles look good

 

[Dwosgood]

Not sure if I agree with the statement "not too bad". I imagine when it comes time to actually pay for the damage it'll be more than this person seems to appreciate. Doors, at least one Freedom panel, suspect roof support, rear quarter panel, sheet metal behind rear door, looks like a cracked mirror. They probably have more money than me so maybe not too bad for them? But, I do agree the axles look good

If it was Joe Nobody’s rig I’d be concerned about the cost of the damage, but this particular rig being a SEMA rig makes me think the sponsors will be able to write it off pretty easily.

 

[CarolinaGladiator]

All of the roll-overs I have observed live or otherwise weren’t caused by gravity. Almost all of them were caused by an energetic event which caused one or both tires on one side of the vehicle to be rapidly elevated—generally when the tire(s) contacted something with a slope somewhat vertical. The velocity at which the tires were elevated is proportional to the horizontal velocity of the vehicle. Moreover, the energy of the upward one-side thrust--causing the roll-over--is proportional to the square of the velocity of the vehicle. I assume that some people have rolled while just driving slowly on too steep of a side slope, but I haven’t ever seen that. It’s usually when someone guns the vehicle before hitting an obstacle or steep slope.

Not even going to lie, reading this all I could think of was the Scarecrow from the Wizard of Oz when he finally gets his brain.

 

[hosejockey61]

I've lived and wheeled in Colorado for decades. I have 120 acre mountain property in central Colorado I’ve wheeled on constantly.

A typical TJ has a much more narrow wheelbase than the really wide stance in the pictured JT that rolled over. Most of its tires of the rolled JT are outside of the fenders.

That being said, I’m sorry, but if you roll a TJ at 1 MPH, that’s driver error. I’ve off-roaded for thousands of miles as a Marine and as a civilian, and never came close to rolling at a 1 MPH.

Again, I’m not saying it didn’t happen, but I’ve never seen anyone do something so negligent that would cause a roll-over at 1 MPH. And I have plentiful time wheeling and observing others wheeling in in Colorado--including on the Blanca trail up to Lake Como, which is about as bad as it gets.

When you wheel at a higher level it is easier for opportunity to meet reality. If you think there result of the flop is driver error, then you probably haven't rock crawled much if at all. There is a huge difference in driving a scenic trail with a few minor obstacles than driving a trail that is meant for crawling. It doesn't matter what the inverse of the square of your tires sticking out past the fenders is.... When you are on tight on the edge of flopping but you need the angle too get over an obstacle, it can sometimes happen. You say you have wheeled thousands of times with not even being close to a flop. Wheel where it matters (not a dirt road) and you will finally see the light. Most of the people in here who rock crawl try to push themselves to find new limits they haven't reached yet. That's how shit like that happens.

 

[jrf]

Come on, wheeling hardcore is risk vs reward. If you flop your Jeep on hunting trails...you screwed up. If you are trying to do the hardcore trails and take some of those ridiculous lines, you might flop. But you knew that going into it...so yeah, that's driver error. Trying to climb a steep rock with heavy off-camber. Recipe to hurt something. I mean it has to be all driver error..the thing isn't going to flip on it's own. The driver chose the climb.

 

[MarineHawk]

Definitely a flop and not a full roll. And yeah, anyone who has never seen a slow roll has never been rock crawling.

Wrong.

 

[hosejockey61]

Come on, wheeling hardcore is risk vs reward. If you flop your Jeep on hunting trails...you screwed up. If you are trying to do the hardcore trails and take some of those ridiculous lines, you might flop. But you knew that going into it...so yeah, that's driver error. Trying to climb a steep rock with heavy off-camber. Recipe to hurt something. I mean it has to be all driver error..the thing isn't going to flip on it's own. The driver chose the climb.

I have two points I want to make here that are specific to this thread.

1. The Gladiator in the pic appears to be a flop from my both my experience and observation. If you look at the picture there appears to be some sort of a rock or other obstacle to the right of the Jeep. My guess is the driver was playing screw around and attempted to see how far they could go up that obstacle for picture opportunities or just plain showing off. It does appear to be a SEMA truck. They obviously went a couple of inches further than they should have. Driver error, yes. But based on risk reward to them.

2. Hard core trails are indeed high risk/reward. I would not call it driver error (semantics I guess because technically that's right), rather that it is an accepted risk of the reward you are seeking. To say it is driver error does not paint the whole picture. If your goal is to drive a dirt road and not roll your Jeep then it is driver error if you do. In the case of a rig on a hardcore trail, the risk is known and accepted, therefore should a flop occur it was known to a high degree of certainty that it was a certain risk. This is how people become better at wheeling. They push their junk to the limit and sometimes past. That it's not driver error, that is simply sometimes the result of finding that line.

And lastly, to find that fine line doesn't require knowing the square of the inverse off camber situation whether you're tires are sticking out to far or not far enough depending on the earths rotational gravity based on whether it's spring or fall.

 

[hosejockey61]

The whole argument was based around marinewolf claiming that high speed caused this roll over. Nothing is father from the truth.

 

[Ztugs]

Is that one of the SEMA trucks?
I wonder how this happened.

Bilstein Gladiator at the 2019 SEMA Show

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