So what about those factory V8 Gladiator rumors?

[joeym7]

Not interested, and unless I got into mega-towing, will never be interested...My Mojave has plenty of acceleration and then some for all my needs on and off road. It is not an 8, and I don't want it to be. You just can't be afraid to downshift when needed and then it works great - there is a very nice power band just a tiny bit above where (I would guess) the "not enough pony's" folks are hanging out.

Sponsored

 

[The Duck of Earl]

I hear you guys and also have concerns that the infrastructure is not (close) to where it needs to be to support these ambitious electric strategies. But whether we like it or not, the electric train is coming.

Forbe's "Every Automaker’s EV Plans Through 2035 And Beyond", here are some examples:

• Starting in 2025, Mercedes said, all new vehicle platforms will be EV-only.
• General Motors says it plans to stop selling gas and diesel vehicles by 2035.
  • Cadillac, for example, will be all-electric by 2030 (Escalade?).
• Honda is selling only EVs and hybrids in Europe after 2022. By 2030, Honda says 40 percent of its North American vehicle sales will be either battery electric or hydrogen, and by 2040 all gas cars will be phased out.
• Stellantis is planning that 70% of its European sales, and 40% of its American, will be either battery electric or plug-in hybrid by 2025.

And of course we have states like California that are proposing to ban new car sales of ICEs by 2035. So while GM still plans on putting the 5.5L V8 in the 2023 Corvette Z06, these V8 powered vehicles will undoubtedly be collector items. And clearly it sounds like most ICEs, if they continue for a manufacturer, will be mated with some plug-in hybrid system.

Yes the days of the v8 are likely over - outside of low production, high margin, specialty offerings, unfortunately. But I think all the electric talk is largely vaporware in the short term for the good 'ol U S of A. The EU market is different - they could force everyone to just take an already well built-out public transit for the most part - USA, not so much.

Right now the EV market in the USA is only a truly feasible option for the well-off urbanites (which includes both the downright rich, as well as white collar younger workers in bigger cities/suburbs). Even then, my uncle has a Tesla out in Denver - ask him about his trip back to the city from the foothills in a snowstorm... luckily, he has the privilege of 'working remote' and making own hours...

Will the EV market evolve, sure - but over time (and the current technology is not the answer). Doesn't seem like our govmnt is giving it much of a choice as it is picking it as the only option. But even the timelines quoted above mean that there will be a TON of ICE powered cars for the foreseeable future even though the execs get the best press talking about the 'future'.

 

[texanjeeper]

This ship has long since sailed. When Stellantis came out and said they would no longer make the V8 after 2023, that killed any hope for the Gladiator.

 

[XJFanatic]

Yes the days of the v8 are likely over - outside of low production, high margin, specialty offerings, unfortunately. But I think all the electric talk is largely vaporware in the short term for the good 'ol U S of A. The EU market is different - they could force everyone to just take an already well built-out public transit for the most part - USA, not so much.

Right now the EV market in the USA is only a truly feasible option for the well-off urbanites (which includes both the downright rich, as well as white collar younger workers in bigger cities/suburbs). Even then, my uncle has a Tesla out in Denver - ask him about his trip back to the city from the foothills in a snowstorm... luckily, he has the privilege of 'working remote' and making own hours...

Will the EV market evolve, sure - but over time (and the current technology is not the answer). Doesn't seem like our govmnt is giving it much of a choice as it is picking it as the only option. But even the timelines quoted above mean that there will be a TON of ICE powered cars for the foreseeable future even though the execs get the best press talking about the 'future'.

This. I keep saying the same general idea to people. Electric works in Europe where most don’t drive and there are towns close to each other.

It could work in certain areas of the country, but there are far to many areas that you may not see a gas station for 120-200 miles. I see PHEV taking off in force though.

 

[Fcmalie]

Yes the days of the v8 are likely over - outside of low production, high margin, specialty offerings, unfortunately. But I think all the electric talk is largely vaporware in the short term for the good 'ol U S of A. The EU market is different - they could force everyone to just take an already well built-out public transit for the most part - USA, not so much.

Right now the EV market in the USA is only a truly feasible option for the well-off urbanites (which includes both the downright rich, as well as white collar younger workers in bigger cities/suburbs). Even then, my uncle has a Tesla out in Denver - ask him about his trip back to the city from the foothills in a snowstorm... luckily, he has the privilege of 'working remote' and making own hours...

Will the EV market evolve, sure - but over time (and the current technology is not the answer). Doesn't seem like our govmnt is giving it much of a choice as it is picking it as the only option. But even the timelines quoted above mean that there will be a TON of ICE powered cars for the foreseeable future even though the execs get the best press talking about the 'future'.

The funny thing is everyone saying that the government is forcing automakers hands. Eventually sure, but most of the ICE "bans" aren't until 2035. Automakers see this as mostly a positive and are trying to beat each other to the finish line. The performance of EVs is definitely there, and I think manufacturers are farther along on 800v architecture than people think. That will decrease charge time and improve performance even more.

 

[Kblanton]

The fact I can gas my truck, pee, and buy a drink at multiple gas stations all over the place and do these things in about 10-15 mins is the key.

Once they figure out the battery swap thing like a cordless drill, then and only then will the EV be better.

How many of you own a cordless product?
How many of you would still own them if you had to stop using it when the battery died until you could recharge the battery?

The defense rest.......

 

[dcmdon]

Question for everyone.

Who is willing to buy a used EV?

You know at some point in time. You will be faced with the possibly of replacing the battery. Batteries are almost half the cost of a new EV. What would the percentage be on a used EV? 3/4 the price of the used EV? Would it even be worth it to buy a used EV.

There is a story on the local news of a girl buying a used Ford EV. Had it for 6 months and it needed a new battery. Ford discontinued the model, and no batteries are to be had. So what do you do then?

Most EVs currently have a 100k warranty on the battery.

Most of the guys on this forum flip their cars every few years. This is not relevant to them. Its relevant to me, and maybe you. But not to most buyers.

Tesla is currently working on battery chemistries that will last longer than the vehicle itself.

 

[dcmdon]

EV's maybe faster on a drag strip, but not around a road course. They are fast for the first couple of laps then start to taper off. The power drops off with the charge. Last year, I did a couple of trackdays, that someone bought their Tesla to.

Depending on the Tesla, they will or won't maintain speed. C&D did a test of a model 3 performance. There is a software setting called "track mode" that maxes out cooling of the motors and batteries. They got full power for like 5 or 6 laps then a gradual decrease in power.

They said they lost 3-4 seconds per lap. They also equated it to other issues they've had with other cars running track days.

Regardless, running on a road race track is not a typical use case. It impacts probably .1% of buyers.

 

[Gvsukids]

This has been fun, I wonder if the horse and carriage guys had the same discussion when the first vehicles came out. And horses had amount of infinite amount of fuel, and now they've been put out the pasture.

 

[dcmdon]

That's cute, when you can trailer home from that race, not have to worry about recharging....

But out on the trail, not so much, we borrow fuel if we didn't carry enough, we can't borrow electricity.....

ev has a place in the urban realm, a better solution is need to get lost in the wilderness. Because no one will go the places we go with if the power is EV

Why would you say you can't borrow electricity? Several EVs now have the ability to share charge.

Its not just cities Where EV's work well. They work in everyplace except truly rural areas where you need to drive long distances.

My place in NH is very very rural. I'm talking 1000 ft driveway and a dirt road. But I'm still only 18 miles from a WalMart and grocery shopping.

I agree with you in the edge case of places where getting anything requires a 100+ mile trip. But that represents probably 1% of the auto market.

Extreme rural EVs dont' play. But again, when charging speed comes down and charger availability comes up they will be as good or better than gas cars. Better because you can top off the "tank" every evening at home if you wish.

 

[Rusty PW]

Depending on the Tesla, they will or won't maintain speed. C&D did a test of a model 3 performance. There is a software setting called "track mode" that maxes out cooling of the motors and batteries. They got full power for like 5 or 6 laps then a gradual decrease in power.

They said they lost 3-4 seconds per lap. They also equated it to other issues they've had with other cars running track days.

Regardless, running on a road race track is not a typical use case. It impacts probably .1% of buyers.

The guys I talked to said after 3 laps, there was a noticeable drop in power. Said that you have to do your fast laps first before the power drop. After that, it's just cruising and trying different lines. I'm just getting heat in my tires on lap 2. LOL

 

[dcmdon]

The guys I talked to said after 3 laps, there was a noticeable drop in power. Said that you have to do your fast laps first before the power drop. After that, it's just cruising and trying different lines. I'm just getting heat in my tires on lap 2. LOL

Not perfect. But good.

https://www.roadandtrack.com/new-cars/road-tests/a22625274/tesla-model-3-performance-track-test/

Also, we've been talking about Tesla. But its the Porsche Taycan's claim to fame that it can lap a track with no decreasing performance. Google it. There are many articles and track tests.

 

[The Duck of Earl]

Not perfect. But good.

https://www.roadandtrack.com/new-cars/road-tests/a22625274/tesla-model-3-performance-track-test/

Also, we've been talking about Tesla. But its the Porsche Taycan's claim to fame that it can lap a track with no decreasing performance. Google it. There are many articles and track tests.

Ya, but in the winter, on a trip they both suck.

And beyond that for track or back roads driving, they are heavy as hell, only somewhat saved by their low center of gravity. Make for a good muscle car going stop light to stop light (a few times anyway) I guess, but comparing them to a true drivers car is disingenuous at best.

 

[The Duck of Earl]

This has been fun, I wonder if the horse and carriage guys had the same discussion when the first vehicles came out. And horses had amount of infinite amount of fuel, and now they've been put out the pasture.

I wonder if we achieved peak hay back then.

 

[The Duck of Earl]

Depending on the Tesla, they will or won't maintain speed. C&D did a test of a model 3 performance. There is a software setting called "track mode" that maxes out cooling of the motors and batteries. They got full power for like 5 or 6 laps then a gradual decrease in power.

They said they lost 3-4 seconds per lap. They also equated it to other issues they've had with other cars running track days.

Regardless, running on a road race track is not a typical use case. It impacts probably .1% of buyers.

We do forget that most car buyers are buying appliances. By being a member on a car forum probably makes one at least somewhat an enthusiast.

So then what we really need to be talking about, is how many of these future EV buyers are going to be going 55 or less in the left lane to preserve their range...

Sponsored