Still f*** no

[Caspien]

I'd also argue other uses for the 4xe crowd (and partially why I'm hoping for a 4xe Gladiator in the future):

Those who have a lot of stop and go traffic, no matter their commute. (Mine is about 45miles each direction)

As we all know, our vehicles are bricks on wheels, but the biggest suck on gas, is having to get back up to speed, from a dead stop.

From what I understand, you can place a 4xe in a sort of 'hybrid' mode, where it will operate solely on electric, until you reach a certain speed, at which point it can be switched over to gas. (At least, that's how the 4xe JLU we tested, had an option to operate at)

For those of us that travel a lot in stop and go traffic, that can be the difference of 8mpg, vs 18mpg.

There's also the crowd that just doesn't want to make much noise, while crawling... for those, the electric option is also appealing.

What ISN'T appealing, to me, is the additional weight and loss of under seat storage, however... so it'll be interesting to see if/how they do a 4xe Gladiator.

(Also, this post has made me realize, I need to update my photo.. since the Rubicon doesn't look anything like that, anymore.. lol)



~ Casp

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[Sazabi19]

I'd also argue other uses for the 4xe crowd (and partially why I'm hoping for a 4xe Gladiator in the future):

Those who have a lot of stop and go traffic, no matter their commute. (Mine is about 45miles each direction)

As we all know, our vehicles are bricks on wheels, but the biggest suck on gas, is having to get back up to speed, from a dead stop.

From what I understand, you can place a 4xe in a sort of 'hybrid' mode, where it will operate solely on electric, until you reach a certain speed, at which point it can be switched over to gas. (At least, that's how the 4xe JLU we tested, had an option to operate at)

For those of us that travel a lot in stop and go traffic, that can be the difference of 8mpg, vs 18mpg.

There's also the crowd that just doesn't want to make much noise, while crawling... for those, the electric option is also appealing.

What ISN'T appealing, to me, is the additional weight and loss of under seat storage, however... so it'll be interesting to see if/how they do a 4xe Gladiator.

(Also, this post has made me realize, I need to update my photo.. since the Rubicon doesn't look anything like that, anymore.. lol)



~ Casp

Unfortunately the offroad mpg numbers I've seen from YT have been terrible. They're getting about 3mi or thereabouts when going full electric on the trail.

 

[Caspien]

Unfortunately the offroad mpg numbers I've seen from YT have been terrible. They're getting about 3mi or thereabouts when going full electric on the trail.

Weird... I wonder if that's an outlier or just due to scale of trail they're doing. *Shrug*


I DO know the Magneto is supposedly superior to the 4xe in pretty much every way... but that current sticker, they're supposedly aiming for is 100k... which is WAAY too much for my pocketbook.



~ Casp

 

[DAVECS1]

I think the point gets missed. I don't believe it is a drivetrain built to save you insane amounts over a fueled vehicles. It gives you great performance without a huge fuel penalty. It 370HP and 470ft lbs of torque. It is all there all the time. The snooth modulated low end torque is phenomenal, in hybrid or full electric. It is great in the morning or in town you run complety silent, great way to wakeup.

I think a 4xe Gladiator would make good sense if they can figure out gvwr and tow capacity, as I think that power plant would do awesome pulling.

 

[Rusty PW]

Just a little googling

How many gallons of diesel make a gallon of crude oil?

Petroleum refineries in the United States produce about 19 to 20 gallons of motor gasoline and 11 to 12 gallons of ultra-low sulfur distillate fuel oil (most of which is sold as diesel fuel and in several states as heating oil) from one 42-gallon barrel of crude oil. The other 7 to 8 gallons of crude is by-products.


Is diesel more expensive to produce?

Diesel fuel, the kind of fuel commonly used in commercial trucks, has not always been more expensive than the standard gasoline used in passenger vehicles. On paper at least, diesel fuel is a less refined petroleum distillate than gasoline, so it should always be cheaper to produce than gasoline.


Why is diesel so expensive?

The transition to less polluting, lower-sulfur diesel fuels in the United States affected diesel fuel production and distribution costs. The federal excise tax for on-highway diesel fuel of 24.3 cents per gallon is 6 cents per gallon higher than the federal excise tax on gasoline.

 

[ShadowsPapa]

Yes, cheaper to produce based on less refining. But when you start producing more diesel, you need to start with more crude.
In short - you may not refine it as much, but it takes more crude to make it. Based on the current costs of crude..........

On paper at least, diesel fuel is a less refined petroleum distillate than gasoline, so it should always be cheaper to produce than gasoline.

That's a tricky one, isn't it? On paper at least? "should always be" - when was that written, when oil was $40/barrel?
You get 19-20 gallons of gas and 11-12 gallons of diesel. Seems like it's a bit more complicated than the cost of refining.
All stats assume the same gas production from that barrel, no one is saying how much diesel if no gas was made from that barrel of crude.

Europe will be the leaders in cleaning up diesel vehicles - it's been a huge problem for them in the past and they have a big incentive to clean things up. So look for the cleanest diesel engines to come from Europe. Apparently they have NOX under control there. That and particulates have always been the bigger problem, not CO2.
They have the technology.

 

[Rusty PW]

Yes, cheaper to produce based on less refining. But when you start producing more diesel, you need to start with more crude.
In short - you may not refine it as much, but it takes more crude to make it. Based on the current costs of crude..........



That's a tricky one, isn't it? On paper at least? "should always be" - when was that written, when oil was $40/barrel?
You get 19-20 gallons of gas and 11-12 gallons of diesel. Seems like it's a bit more complicated than the cost of refining.
All stats assume the same gas production from that barrel, no one is saying how much diesel if no gas was made from that barrel of crude.

Europe will be the leaders in cleaning up diesel vehicles - it's been a huge problem for them in the past and they have a big incentive to clean things up. So look for the cleanest diesel engines to come from Europe. Apparently they have NOX under control there. That and particulates have always been the bigger problem, not CO2.
They have the technology.

Go outside the US, and diesel is the fuel of choice. When I was in Eastern Europe. Most everything was diesel. Same for South America.

 

[DAVECS1]

Modern diesel is an equal opportunity complex drivetrain, and defective parts producer.

Now you go back to Tier II and older, apocalypse ready, easy on fuel, and not picky about fuel.

 

[ImThe0ne]

Tell you what! Was pretty fun to have a 4xe this Tax season. Have not seen numbers in the black for years?

You ain’t kidding, we bought a 21 Pacifica Hybrid at the beginning of 2021 and that tax break was nice!

 

[ShadowsPapa]

Go outside the US, and diesel is the fuel of choice. When I was in Eastern Europe. Most everything was diesel. Same for South America.

Yes, it started with whatever they called it accord to reduce greenhouse gases and Europe and other countries jumped on diesel because of lower CO2 emissions - because that is all that was talked about back then (the 80s, wasn't it?)
I bet you did see mostly diesel cars in Europe. There are other reasons, too - and you hit on one of them - easier and cheaper as far as the refining process. Since they were refining for rail and bus use, it just made sense, CO2 or not.
In Korea it's gas and propane. You don't see diesel there much, at least I didn't in the cities I was in. They are also big on electric.

 

[Rusty PW]

Modern diesel is an equal opportunity complex drivetrain, and defective parts producer.

Now you go back to Tier II and older, apocalypse ready, easy on fuel, and not picky about fuel.

The old 12 valve Cummins.

 

[Glad_he_ate]

I think the point gets missed. I don't believe it is a drivetrain built to save you insane amounts over a fueled vehicles. It gives you great performance without a huge fuel penalty. It 370HP and 470ft lbs of torque. It is all there all the time. The snooth modulated low end torque is phenomenal, in hybrid or full electric. It is great in the morning or in town you run complety silent, great way to wakeup.

I think a 4xe Gladiator would make good sense if they can figure out gvwr and tow capacity, as I think that power plant would do awesome pulling.

It’s actually 375 hp and 480 lbs tq .. I like ours. Winter mpg she got between 21 and 25. If I drive I can get it to 28 in winter on our regular weekend running around. Loads of fun to drive. In summer we can see as much as 35 mpg from our house to the city and back.

 

[Glad_he_ate]

Unfortunately the offroad mpg numbers I've seen from YT have been terrible. They're getting about 3mi or thereabouts when going full electric on the trail.

Must be a technical trail all low range up steep grades the whole time with the top off and ac on full.

 

[Ar4130]

Sure but that means she should look at something other than the 4xe. Mileage is OK for about the first 30-50 miles. If you read on the 4xe forums the mileage is terrible. If you can stay within electric only range and charge before you go anywhere, it's great. It would work out for me on my short commute to work but if you're driving further than the electric range the mileage tanks. It's got the worst mpg rating outside of electric than any other Wrangler (excluding the 392, though there are reports there of people getting 20+). People are seeing 20mpg and below and it's the 4 cylinder.

Can’t be any worse that the 13 mpg I get in my JT...

 

[Sazabi19]

Can’t be any worse that the 13 mpg I get in my JT...

That sounds like something is wrong or heavily modded. Or you drive under yes/no conditions to where the throttle is fully pressed or not all lol. You're experience is not the norm, as an outlier, you don't count :P

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