VM 3.0 general overview and current observations - Q&A encouraged

[22EcoDs]

Thanks for the great write-up. Lots of good info that gave me 3 questions.

1. Do you think a actual snorkel like the river raider would make the most difference in iat?
2. Which egts should we focus on most, I have a scan guage which let's me see Regen, and soot mass. But the egt options are turbo, dpf, scr... I also went into Regen with only 30% soot mass after 700 miles.
3. Do you know if it will do an active Regen based on miles alone?

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[Bananaman]

The Pent is a fantastic engine, perfectly married to whichever transmission you'd like. In the olde-skool Chrysler Community, we call the 3.6 the "Modern 340 Six-Pack, or 318, or 360..."

I used to have a 340 that my dad and I took out of a wrecked '71 Duster and transplanted into my '64 Dodge Dart. That motor was a Beast!

 

[Deleted member 22728]

Thanks for the great write-up. Lots of good info that gave me 3 questions.

1. Do you think a actual snorkel like the river raider would make the most difference in iat?
I reckon any feasible method to get more moderated air into the turbo would be advantageous. My fix was simply the least-invasive I could determine for my application.

2. Which egts should we focus on most, I have a scan guage which let's me see Regen, and soot mass. But the egt options are turbo, dpf, scr... I also went into Regen with only 30% soot mass after 700 miles.

Burns are really as variable as the individual operator/driver, environment, loads, environment, etc. I expect 700 miles in could be considered "early", however it really comes down to "your results may (WILL) vary.

3. Do you know if it will do an active Regen based on miles alone?

IIRC, from the Stellantis lecture, it was a variable that wasn't totally dependent on mileage, time, or content exclusively. Other than that, I do not know. Great question.

I use cruise control almost as if by second nature, with the mention by Stellantis engineering that it essentially allowed powertrain to run an "optimum scenario" for an effective passive regeneration. Now, the 15' WK2 does prompt a REGEN alert on the DIC while driving occasionally, however I'm still, after 7 years and 70k miles (35k pulling the Airstream), only at 50%. The system has never been serviced. I did have to perform one forced REGEN, but I'm pretty sure I found some marginal diesel while on a trip.[/QUOTE]

 

[Deleted member 22728]

As to EGT's (sorry, the edit and save seems to be janky currently), I'd like to see a reading from a point that is nearest the exhaust port. Of course, sometimes we're left with whatever thermocouple is available.

 

[22EcoDs]

As to EGT's (sorry, the edit and save seems to be janky currently), I'd like to see a reading from a point that is nearest the exhaust port. Of course, sometimes we're left with whatever thermocouple is available.

Awesome, Thank You

 

[Deleted member 22728]

I believe it's important to remember that the lube oil in these engines is, in a way, like transmission fluid, in that it really does serve like 4 distinct purposes (or more!): lubrication, cooling, hydraulics, and material preservation. It is also expected to be scavenged and reconciled by the after treatment system, as you'd be surprised how much precipitates in the CAC tubes. In any case, the lube oil takes-on a prompt heat load, which we can generalize as "ok, we're at 250f oil, EGT's are likely getting into the 1300f+ discomfort zone, so let's back-off throttle". Just where my brain goes.

 

[Deleted member 22728]

As to EGT's (sorry, the edit and save seems to be janky currently), I'd like to see a reading from a point that is nearest the exhaust port. Of course, sometimes we're left with whatever thermocouple is available.

And I must note that since the corrective changes I've made, it tows just like you'd expect it should. With less restrictive intake air, matched gear ratio to tire size, and removal of excess underhood heat, it works well pulling the 28' Airstream.

 

[armd.offroad]

Thanks for this hard work and wonderful feedback, I will be getting the 3.6 Gasser

I might have to eat my own words now... last weekend I went and test drove a JT Rubicon 3.0 Ecodiesel and then a JT Overland 3.6 Pentastar and it was night and day difference. The Ecodiesel was very quiet getting up to speed and the Pentastar just screamed every time I pressed on the pedal. Now I want the Ecodiesel but I am torn because I want reliability first and foremost.

 

[stickshifter]

I might have to eat my own words now... last weekend I went and test drove a JT Rubicon 3.0 Ecodiesel and then a JT Overland 3.6 Pentastar and it was night and day difference. The Ecodiesel was very quiet getting up to speed and the Pentastar just screamed every time I pressed on the pedal. Now I want the Ecodiesel but I am torn because I want reliability first and foremost.

Maybe wait for the 3.0 I6 turbo gas engine? They haven't said yet whether or not the I6 "Tornado" will be used in the Gladiator, but it seems like the best of all engine options to me - presuming they don't charge 392 money for it. Sure, we know almost nothing about the engine, but I'll take a 3.0 liter inline turbo-charged gas engine (built from the factory, not with an aftermarket turbo) any day. Inline six-cylinder engines are (1) well-balanced, (2) even without a turbo they can make decent torque relatively low in the power band, (3) with a turbo, they will crank out the power down low, and (4) as a general design - have a proven track record. We will see what Stellantis does with the Tornado, but I'd buy one in a Gladiator.

3.6 Pentastar: under-powered for my use. I understand that many people love their Pentastar, and that's awesome. I am genuinely happy for you. I don't find it strong enough, under load, driving up hill at elevation.

3.0 Ecodiesel: just not reliable enough for my needs. Overheating under load in hot temps (that won't work for me), added complexity of exhaust systems, DEF fluid freezes at 11 or 12 degrees Fahrenheit, and its 20 to 30 degrees colder than that for three months where I live (increasing likelihood of DEF freezing in the DEF line, if the DEF pump fails - which it seems prone to do), added maintenance cost, very expensive to repair out of warranty. Lots of people on this forum love their Ecodiesel, and that's awesome, but I'm not going to buy one.

An Imaginary V8: if they ever put the 392 in the Gladiator it will be crazy expensive. Its a shame they never built the Gladiator with the 5.7 Hemi, and sold it for a reasonable price. I would have bought that without thinking twice.

3.0 Turbo-Charged Gas I6 - the "Tornado": bring it on, but at a reasonable price...

P.S. After looking for a vehicle I am really psyched about, I have placed a $450 deposit on a 2023 Ineos Grenadier, which will be sold in North America with a 3.0 liter turbo-charged gas I6 (made by BMW), with an 8-speed auto transmission (made by ZF). Sound familiar? I'm pretty bummed that I couldn't get into a Gladiator. The Tornado would bring me back to Jeep.

 

[Deleted member 22728]

Maybe wait for the 3.0 I6 turbo gas engine? They haven't said yet whether or not the I6 "Tornado" will be used in the Gladiator, but it seems like the best of all engine options to me - presuming they don't charge 392 money for it. Sure, we know almost nothing about the engine, but I'll take a 3.0 liter inline turbo-charged gas engine (built from the factory, not with an aftermarket turbo) any day. Inline six-cylinder engines are (1) well-balanced, (2) even without a turbo they can make decent torque relatively low in the power band, (3) with a turbo, they will crank out the power down low, and (4) as a general design - have a proven track record. We will see what Stellantis does with the Tornado, but I'd buy one in a Gladiator.

3.6 Pentastar: under-powered for my use. I understand that many people love their Pentastar, and that's awesome. I am genuinely happy for you. I don't find it strong enough, under load, driving up hill at elevation.

3.0 Ecodiesel: just not reliable enough for my needs. Overheating under load in hot temps (that won't work for me), added complexity of exhaust systems, DEF fluid freezes at 11 or 12 degrees Fahrenheit, and its 20 to 30 degrees colder than that for three months where I live (increasing likelihood of DEF freezing in the DEF line, if the DEF pump fails - which it seems prone to do), added maintenance cost, very expensive to repair out of warranty. Lots of people on this forum love their Ecodiesel, and that's awesome, but I'm not going to buy one.

An Imaginary V8: if they ever put the 392 in the Gladiator it will be crazy expensive. Its a shame they never built the Gladiator with the 5.7 Hemi, and sold it for a reasonable price. I would have bought that without thinking twice.

3.0 Turbo-Charged Gas I6 - the "Tornado": bring it on, but at a reasonable price...

P.S. After looking for a vehicle I am really psyched about, I have placed a $450 deposit on a 2023 Ineos Grenadier, which will be sold in North America with a 3.0 liter turbo-charged gas I6 (made by BMW), with an 8-speed auto transmission (made by ZF). Sound familiar? I'm pretty bummed that I couldn't get into a Gladiator. The Tornado would bring me back to Jeep.

Then perhaps going with a conventional pickup would be in-order. I can only relate my experience, my training, and my ADVICE, which is worth about as much as Rod Serling's predictions for the future. The 3.6 Pent is an exceptionally capable engine, worthy of every accolade afforded. The HEMI is, too. The EcoD is, and will continue to be, my preferred powerplant for work and play.

 

[Sting-Gray Neutral Pres.]

The air cleaner intake opening neatly seals-off a portion of the underhood skin that, aside from the small duct that is open to the grill. You basically draw you're fresh air from the space, formed by a stamped "channel", between the hood blanket and the hood skin. Note that the gas burners have a portion of that boot open for at least enough fresh air to enter, again outside of the little plastic tube open to the grille.

Where is this "stamped channel between the hood blanket and the hood skin"? On mine the rubber boot appears to seal completely to the hood skin, forcing all intake air to come from the garden-hose sized plastic grill tube. I keep looking for a way for air to get in around the boot seal but I'm not seeing it.

 

[Deleted member 22728]

Where is this "stamped channel between the hood blanket and the hood skin"? On mine the rubber boot appears to seal completely to the hood skin, forcing all intake air to come from the garden-hose sized plastic grill tube. I keep looking for a way for air to get in around the boot seal but I'm not seeing it.

Like I'd mentioned earlier, the Rubicon hood has the passive vents/channels; it's why the SB scoops are effective in both rolesI mentioned. I can't speak to the non-rubi diesel, but this is a sport gas. Note the partially open intake air boot, and the sealing surface above, of which you speak.

It's like they almost want the EcoD to be unappealing.

 

[RS3]

Like I'd mentioned earlier, the Rubicon hood has the passive vents/channels; it's why the SB scoops are effective in both rolesI mentioned. I can't speak to the non-rubi diesel, but this is a sport gas. Note the partially open intake air boot, and the sealing surface above, of which you speak.

It's like they almost want the EcoD to be unappealing.

So you just did the scoops only correct as I don't believe S&B has a cold air intake for the diesel yet? Both bottoms of the scoops are just open or does the one side have the part that would normally go to the cold air intake? Any pics of under the hood?

 

[Deleted member 22728]

So you just did the scoops only correct as I don't believe S&B has a cold air intake for the diesel yet? Both bottoms of the scoops are just open or does the one side have the part that would normally go to the cold air intake? Any pics of under the hood?

Check-out my above write-up.

 

[Deleted member 22728]

This was the preceding 20' Sport S Max Tow on 35's, 4.10's, pulling my 28' Airstream last year. Of course, it did just fine, while screaming bloody-mudder, the whole way. With it's 3.0 EcoD, APPROPRIATELY GEARED, no more squeeze on the bottom.

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