Is an EV Gladiator Better Off-Road Than a Traditional Gas Jeep - Let's Find Out! [TFL]

[Deleted member 57233]

I see a ton of EVs at the ski resorts here. The resorts are putting in chargers, and they work just fine buried in snow and negative temps. My neighbor drives his tesla ~200 miles round trip through windy mountain roads with no issues.

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[bleda2002]

why defend ev’s anyway? They’re only around because the govts are pushing them on us, its not organic now

as Ive and other said countless times, a regime change is all it’ll take to snuff out this zealous push and disastrous mandates

I can't honestly tell if you are a troll or you really believe the stuff you write.

But I'll humor it, I think EVs are great tech. Even at a version 2.0ish the Tesla tech is exciting in that it makes way better torque, lower per mile costs, lower maintenance, and are more reliable.

As that tech makes it in to phev's like the 4xe, we end up with the advantages of both power trains and eliminate most of the disadvantages of either as well to end up with way more performant vehicles.

This isn't going away, the Tesla model y is the number one selling car in the world, this tech is here to stay as people are buying and do want the tech, especially when incorporated as hybrids.

I personally have no interest in a pure EV. The disadvantages of EV tech make it non-realistic for my use case, and while I know that will change at its current state it's not for me. Our 4xe on the other hand is by far the most compelling jeep I've ever driven if I'm price conscious. Sure I'd rather have a 392, but not for 30k more as the 4xe is already a 5.7 hemi worth of power, with 3.6 pentastar mpgs and ease of fill ups.

Knowing and experiencing that, I want ev tech to continue to evolve and grow so that I can end up with hopefully version 2, 3, 4 etc of the 4xe.

 

[MF Comics]

I can't honestly tell if you are a troll or you really believe the stuff you write.

But I'll humor it, I think EVs are great tech. Even at a version 2.0ish the Tesla tech is exciting in that it makes way better torque, lower per mile costs, lower maintenance, and are more reliable.

As that tech makes it in to phev's like the 4xe, we end up with the advantages of both power trains and eliminate most of the disadvantages of either as well to end up with way more performant vehicles.

This isn't going away, the Tesla model y is the number one selling car in the world, this tech is here to stay as people are buying and do want the tech, especially when incorporated as hybrids.

I personally have no interest in a pure EV. The disadvantages of EV tech make it non-realistic for my use case, and while I know that will change at its current state it's not for me. Our 4xe on the other hand is by far the most compelling jeep I've ever driven if I'm price conscious. Sure I'd rather have a 392, but not for 30k more as the 4xe is already a 5.7 hemi worth of power, with 3.6 pentastar mpgs and ease of fill ups.

Knowing and experiencing that, I want ev tech to continue to evolve and grow so that I can end up with hopefully version 2, 3, 4 etc of the 4xe.

If I were trolling, I wouldn't be crapping on EV's for the last several pages.

Batteries get weaker overtime, and aren't a simple fix like an engine, nevermind the costs. Performance is there only saving grace, they're one trick ponies that suffer from range issues, having diminishing returns as you use the battery up, and cost a fortune to replace.

Also, while a few zealots here will point out that gas does have fires, it's not as catastrophic, or intense as battery fires (1500 degrees vs 4500-6000), and don't reignite either.

Hybrids are a different story, but the push to Lithuim is iffy, as while it performs better, they're exploding vs the old stuff.

Also, while a few here don't like the author's views here, he does make some good points:

"Diesels have been the focus of special attention because they focus unwanted attention on the idiocy (and evil) of “electrification.” It is why VW was treated as if it had actually hurt people by selling low-cost, high-efficiency diesel-powered Jettas, Golfs and Beetles. The real hurt was the availability of such cars, which could be bought for about half what it costs to buy a typical new EV and which travelled three times as far (these cars came standard with 600-plus miles of range vs. the typical 240-270 that comes standard in most EVs priced under $50k today).

If VW were still selling such vehicles today, what would the effect of that be on EV sales?

The psychological effect would surely be significant. It would be similar to the effect of the sight of perfectly healthy people walking around showing their faces – and not keeling over from sickness – during the “pandemic.” The contrast would have upset the narrative. And that is why it was not enough to suggest or encourage the populace to “mask.” It was essential to try to force everyone to “mask.”

That normalized the pathology of “masking.”

Similarly, by forcing low-cost, high-mileage and very long-range diesel-powered vehicles off the market, it is easier to force EVs onto the market.

This same purpose is furthered by making the few diesel-powered vehicles that remain – models like the Far Out Gladiator – as or even more expensive than EVs. That way, they won’t be missed when they are gone by those who couldn’t afford them.

Just the same as regards the Last Call iterations of the Dodge Challenger powered by the 6.2 liter supercharged V8. It does not travel even half as far as the diesel-powered Far Out Gladiator, despite being a car and weighing 1,000 pounds less. But it still goes about as far as most $50k electric cars – including the “economical” ones – and it isn’t tethered to a cord, as they are. Its appeal is therefore problematic and so its price has been adjusted – via impending forced scarcity – to make the problem go away. What you used to be able to buy for around $60k (around $40k, with just the V8, sans the supercharger) now costs almost $100k and you soon won’t be able to buy it (new) at any price.

Because they can’t allow it.

They know that, so long as alternatives – and contrasts – exist, it will be much harder for them to get people to forget what’s been taken away from them and to accept what’s being forced upon them."

You can dismiss some of what he says, but you can't dismiss everything. That basically sums up my view on things, that as long as they (Govt) are heavy handed in determining what can and can't remain, I'm opposed to it. Had EV's been completely organic, they'd be boutique at best, and probably half a market percentage of sales, where only those who truly want them drive them instead of every company going all in on EV's.

As stated before, forget who wins, a regime change in the other direction could easily reverse course on this Green agenda and pull back on this EV push, thus leaving a few companies with their dicks in their hand when it's like "Okay, we're not going all electric, no 2035", which leads to this article,
"MOST OF THE LEGACY CAR MANUFACTURERS WON’T MAKE IT."

Although as I stated before, a regime change leaves those who put their eggs in one basket left scrambling, and some might not recover.

 

[Deleted member 57233]

That basically sums up my view on things, that as long as they (Govt) are heavy handed in determining what can and can't remain, I'm opposed to it.

The government has been extremely heavy handed in keeping ICE vehicles and the fossil fuel industry alive. They have decided which brands live or die, and actively block foreign competition. There is no such thing as "completely organic" in the auto industry in the US.

 

[MF Comics]

The government has been extremely heavy handed in keeping ICE vehicles and the fossil fuel industry alive. They have decided which brands live or die, and actively block foreign competition. There is no such thing as "completely organic" in the auto industry in the US.

Govt shouldn’t be involved in more than protecting our borders and delivering the mail, period

no taxes, no red tape, no picking winners and losers, period

 

[Alpine Warthog]

Well said @MF Comics

I'm not anti EV or hybrid either, Just anti-lied to. The gov and zealots keep preaching all the EV stuff as if the tech were 15-20 years from where it is in reality. Can't charge an EV unless I'm close to the grid and it takes 3 to 4 times longer to refuel. I can carry 20-40 miles of gas a couple miles back into the woods if I run out from stupidity or a punctured tank. Aint nobody carrying 20-40 miles of electricity back to an EV that did the same.

I'm waiting on Doc Brown's generator to come around, then I'll be all in for EVs!

 

[MF Comics]

Well said @MF Comics

I'm not anti EV or hybrid either, Just anti-lied to. The gov and zealots keep preaching all the EV stuff as if the tech were 15-20 years from where it is in reality. Can't charge an EV unless I'm close to the grid and it takes 3 to 4 times longer to refuel. I can carry 20-40 miles of gas a couple miles back into the woods if I run out from stupidity or a punctured tank. Aint nobody carrying 20-40 miles of electricity back to an EV that did the same.

I'm waiting on Doc Brown's generator to come around, then I'll be all in for EVs!

Exactly. Removed the heavy hand, and let the chips fall where they may.

I'm sure someone is towing a diesel generator with them through the woods as we speak right now xD Yeah, a few jerry cans, and you're set, reminds me I need to get a few skid plates myself now that ya mention it

Thought that only worked for Deloreans now

 

[MrJeep]

Completely organic EV adopter here chiming in (2 years into a MYP). I would put a deposit on an NACS compatible JT tomorrow and pay what they ask.
(Also of note I am almost 50 and have driven 17 gas Jeeps and lean pretty conservative)
I can't speak for other EV's but once you drive a Tesla for 2 weeks and get used to it you feel like this:
"What? I have to press a start button so that a clumsy reciprocating engine (which makes so little sense from a mechanical engineering standpoint) with a transmission that is bound to go to poop, that fires up and belches smoke and then I have to go stop for dirty smelly gas that invariably splashes somewhere that requires oil changes and wears out the brakes 10x faster?" You really come to appreciate an EV pretty quick, esp from the maintenance end: there is none but tires, and mine have been fine for over 25k.
Plus plus, the technology in it is just sick and they give you major upgrades for free over the wire every few months.
This is coming from a guy who was a mech E in college who can adjust a carburetor and has ingested and skin absorbed more gas and oil than most on this forum.
I love my JT and TJ and the contrast it provides to the MY but I'm literally in line with my Jeep dealer for the NACS JT be it hybrid or full E whenever that happens.
Why do I keep saying NACS? Because all the other chargers are complete garbage and the supercharger network is so crucial to my experience. I'm not a Musk fan, per se, but I am of what he made. Same goes for Jobs.

 

[MF Comics]

A Gladiator with a 3.6 would beat any ev on a roadtrip a few states away, even without an Aux tank

 

[Alpine Warthog]

Completely organic EV adopter here chiming in (2 years into a MYP). I would put a deposit on an NACS compatible JT tomorrow and pay what they ask.
(Also of note I am almost 50 and have driven 17 gas Jeeps and lean pretty conservative)
I can't speak for other EV's but once you drive a Tesla for 2 weeks and get used to it you feel like this:
"What? I have to press a start button so that a clumsy reciprocating engine (which makes so little sense from a mechanical engineering standpoint) with a transmission that is bound to go to poop, that fires up and belches smoke and then I have to go stop for dirty smelly gas that invariably splashes somewhere that requires oil changes and wears out the brakes 10x faster?" You really come to appreciate an EV pretty quick, esp from the maintenance end: there is none but tires, and mine have been fine for over 25k.
Plus plus, the technology in it is just sick and they give you major upgrades for free over the wire every few months.
This is coming from a guy who was a mech E in college who can adjust a carburetor and has ingested and skin absorbed more gas and oil than most on this forum.
I love my JT and TJ and the contrast it provides to the MY but I'm literally in line with my Jeep dealer for the NACS JT be it hybrid or full E whenever that happens.
Why do I keep saying NACS? Because all the other chargers are complete garbage and the supercharger network is so crucial to my experience. I'm not a Musk fan, per se, but I am of what he made. Same goes for Jobs.

I'm with you mostly. I love tech. (Former military radio troop who was in on the early days of data burst technology, eventually became a military cop and did deployments under both career fields and now I'm back in IT in my retirement days )

The problem with a pure EV is one nasty disaster and your car is only good for a few trips. Was stationed in Oklahoma for lots of years. Had a particularly nasty ice storm come through and our base and surrounding city was out of power for about a month. (not an exaggeration) Back then EVs weren't a thing so no worries about charging my car. The only power available were through gas/diesel generators. The only way to have hot water was through my natural gas stove. There was no chance that anyone was driving through with a charging truck to help people get charged up and out of town to a city with electricity. There was a diesel generator at the gas station though. So in a way did gasoline depend on electricity? kinda. But there were also a bunch of good ol boys with hand pumps and transfer tanks that could reach down into tanks until the generator was running. it also only took a couple of minutes to fill my tank.

The beautiful thing about gas/diesel/propane is that I can store large amounts of it safely on my property for a reasonable cost. Not so with electricity. add a vehicle to charge on top of that? no thanks.

Then there's hybrids. This is my preferred option: Higher MPG, better acceleration.... well. I guess that's about it benefit wise...

but with those comes WAY more weight, and WAY more cost. Lower payload, oh and not to mention the ridiculous complexity of the energy recapture systems in the brakes, the batteries cost

(prius batteries are 4 grand a pop, that's like replacing an engine! and they don't last 200thousand miles)

I can't afford them nor can most people. They catch fire at a rate of 3 times that of a ICE car, and they still benefit from a charger. And if we really want to talk about EV range for a hybrid, you're doing pretty good if you're in the 40 mile range

So while I can see the cool factor of a hybrid and they'll be practical in another decade or so, I don't have any use for them in a rural setting. Hybrids are only useful to suburbanites that have little to no fear of the electricity ever going out (or being taken away, but that's for a different thread)

 

[MF Comics]

I'm with you mostly. I love tech. (Former military radio troop who was in on the early days of data burst technology, eventually became a military cop and did deployments under both career fields and now I'm back in IT in my retirement days )

The problem with a pure EV is one nasty disaster and your car is only good for a few trips. Was stationed in Oklahoma for lots of years. Had a particularly nasty ice storm come through and our base and surrounding city was out of power for about a month. (not an exaggeration) Back then EVs weren't a thing so no worries about charging my car. The only power available were through gas/diesel generators. The only way to have hot water was through my natural gas stove. There was no chance that anyone was driving through with a charging truck to help people get charged up and out of town to a city with electricity. There was a diesel generator at the gas station though. So in a way did gasoline depend on electricity? kinda. But there were also a bunch of good ol boys with hand pumps and transfer tanks that could reach down into tanks until the generator was running. it also only took a couple of minutes to fill my tank.

The beautiful thing about gas/diesel/propane is that I can store large amounts of it safely on my property for a reasonable cost. Not so with electricity. add a vehicle to charge on top of that? no thanks.

Then there's hybrids. This is my preferred option: Higher MPG, better acceleration.... well. I guess that's about it benefit wise...

but with those comes WAY more weight, and WAY more cost. Lower payload, oh and not to mention the ridiculous complexity of the energy recapture systems in the brakes, the batteries cost

(prius batteries are 4 grand a pop, that's like replacing an engine! and they don't last 200thousand miles)

I can't afford them nor can most people. They catch fire at a rate of 3 times that of a ICE car, and they still benefit from a charger. And if we really want to talk about EV range for a hybrid, you're doing pretty good if you're in the 40 mile range

So while I can see the cool factor of a hybrid and they'll be practical in another decade or so, I don't have any use for them in a rural setting. Hybrids are only useful to suburbanites that have little to no fear of the electricity ever going out (or being taken away, but that's for a different thread)

Cool factor? I was in HS in the mid 2000s, Hybrids were dorky and dinky, and not in the "could be cool" way, they were THE Prius' that you'd joke and meme about.

No nothing could make Hybrids cool, especially when once you strip away the cvt, and special aero, mileage would take a hit. Hybrids were merely a step above cyclists on the road, same self righteousness and smugness.
Diesels though are cool, you drive them normal vehicles and they still delivered better mileage than sticker, can be modded to make more power (and by virtue of better parts, more mpg) and don't need fancy parts (Aero/cvt) to deliver the mileage, all while using regular parts. Slap said aero on though and you'll make a Prius look thirsty in comarpison

Goes back to my dieselgate argument, where had it been a different regime in charge, we'd still be driving them instead of all this battery talk. Hell, once they figure out the cooling issues on the 3.0d and you delete the emissions crap, it should be fine.

 

[tysongladiator]

These comments are hilarious!!!??? Most have nothing to do with the question.?‍


Yes, the type of vehicle matters when it comes to offroading. But the biggest factors are your setup and who's behind the wheel.

 

[MF Comics]

These comments are hilarious!!!??? Most have nothing to do with the question.?‍


Yes, the type of vehicle matters when it comes to offroading. But the biggest factors are your setup and who's behind the wheel.

Remember, It's not the car you drive. It's the driver who's driving the car that's doing the driving.

 

[Alpine Warthog]

These comments are hilarious!!!??? Most have nothing to do with the question.?‍


Yes, the type of vehicle matters when it comes to offroading. But the biggest factors are your setup and who's behind the wheel.

LOL, you know how stuff like this goes.
The original question is pretty much moot. same truck different power plant. it all comes down to set up and driver. The fun part is where the conversation really went.

 

[tysongladiator]

Remember, It's not the car you drive. It's the driver who's driving the car that's doing the driving.

Exactly!

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